It is. He sent the same text from both his and Nancy Benoit's phones to multiple people, before committing suicide. He'd killed Nancy and their son Daniel nearly two days before that, and lied that they'd gotten a stomach bug to explain why he wasn't en route to a pay per view event.
And you'll still occasionally hear people try to make out like he did this as part of some cte blackout.
Guy obviously wasn't right in the head, but he'd been abusing nancy for years at that point. He obviously had the faculties to cover his tracks and know what he was doing was wrong.
I don't think it was a "CTE Blackout" but I have also heard some of the stories from his sister-in-law and Nancy's sister Sandra Toffoloni. She lived with them and was a workout partner for Chris. He increasingly showed paranoid and delusional thinking. His autopsy showed severe brain damage consistent with CTE. I think CTE and drug use were major contributors to the murder-suicide.
I'm not saying that to get Chris Benoit off the hook - I'm saying it to keep organizations like the WWE accountable who had a revolving door of tragedies caused by the way they treated drug use and head injuries for the vast majority of their existence.
I couldn’t agree more. It’s not an excuse for his actions but there’s just so much we don’t know about the brain and brain injuries have been known to make somebody’s personality take a nasty turn
Everybody who committed an act of violence that was influenced by lead poisoning isn’t suddenly off the hook because we realized lead poisoning was a thing, but we figured out a way to prevent that in the future. With all the environmental contaminants we’ve invented directly or indirectly since the Industrial Revolution who knows what would be influencing our mental health or how long it could take to figure it out
First it was Owen Hart, next big one was Eddie Guerrero, Benoit, Macho Man, Warrior, Piper, Brodie Lee, Razor, Bray Wyatt, Sabu. It's not just drug use and head injuries, it's how the medium itself has evolved to dismiss or ignore injuries or take bigger risks. Whatever it takes, as long as you keep going. As long as you grind your body down to a literal pulp for the sake of a few extra dollars, for a few more seconds of fame.
Why would acknowledging the massive CTE he got from doing a flying headbutt for years diminish what he did? Doesn't that justify more research and care into preventing this in the future?
That's not how CTE works. It's not like getting blackout drunk, it literally changes how you think, act, behave, and what you believe (delusional, violence) rapidly for a brain but slower than what you're implying here - you don't snap and "black-out". And yes, it can and will come on over years, it's chronic brain damage that developes into a severe brain disorder after the fact.
Knowing what he was doing was wrong isn't really what's most relevant, it's "did he change dramatically" "would he have behaved that way without CTE". Did he actually understand what he was doing and why in the sense of what was driving him - delusions, beliefs, fears that may be completely irrational but the knowledge that others won't understand- because it's crazy and wrong. Did it make him more aggressive? All of those are real possibilities.
The reason we ask is because prevention saves lives. It's not got anything to do with your comment, it's because we don't want this to happen again, and yet, it has and it will, because for some reason it's easier to ignore CTE is real than it is to try and prevent it from being caused by activities done purely for entertainment. We could change rules to minimize, but no.
Some people use their love of animals to absolve themselves of how badly they treat people. You probably hear people say things like “he loves animals, he couldn’t possibly be bad!” but like, Hitler was an animal lover. Animals can’t talk back so they can’t tell you that your help isn’t helpful. And many people view animals, at least their preferred animals, as uncomplicated and apolitical. Those animals don’t clash with their views of the world or confront their ideologies.
My ex-husband! Thanks for expressing this so clearly.
The fact that my ex, a selfish and abusive man-child, was such a big animal person helped fool me for a long time. He was even a vegetarian since his teens because he loved them so much. It's a MASSIVE part of how it took me so effing long to spot it- his ability to display empathy didn't extend to humans.
I truly believe they viewed these children as lesser than animals. There were multiple abuse allegations against these two. They also would've been the type to deny being racist because they adopted Black children even though their White Saviorism was so blatant. Not saying that all white people who adopt non-white kids are racist. But there is definitely A Type of white person who chooses to adopt non-white children because of their White Savior mentality). And many of them hide their racism under progressive, altruistic disguises.
I think people like that end up abusing their children because they think no matter what they do, their child's life with their black biological family would have been worse. I can almost 100% guarantee this lady drove off that cliff thinking her kids were better off dead with her than alive with a black family.
Tbh even with white women who have biracial kids the ‘ol fashioned way. My cousin is biracial and my shitty aunt uses her and my uncle to try and bypass any accusation of racism
Never mind that she called my uncle the n word (with hard r) in front of my cousin. My cousin also wasn’t allowed to wear her natural hair texture until after graduating college. It goes without saying that not everyone in biracial relationships is like my aunt. But at the same time every white person I’ve met who is in a biracial relationship thinks that it’s impossible for them to be racist if they’re involved with somebody from another race
many of them hide their racism under progressive, altruistic disguises
These ideologically driven delusions are exactly the same whether fueled by religion or politics. Historically we've repeatedly seen the dire consequences for those who wanted no part in it, and were unable to defend themselves from it.
A large portion of the population of the internet doesn’t attach any significant value to a human life over an animals. It’s very easy if you don’t believe in the concept of a soul, which a large portion of redditors don’t based on my comment replies in the past.
The head of a homeless outreach program on tiktok had to take dog food off of their wishlist because more people were donating dog food than supplies for people in need
It's because a lot of people think animals are perfect and can do no wrong. Like an animal simply can't process its own actions so if they do anything bad or violent it can be blamed on instinct as if they have no control, but conversely if they do anything good or seemingly selfless it's "because they have a heart of gold" and "we don't deserve dogs! 🥹🥲".
They think they are fundamentally different than a person in that they are dumb enough to not have the capacity to do anything bad, but also intelligent enough to choose to be kind and selfless. It's an odd paradox that a lot of people don't even want to acknowledge.
I think the women in this case were fake vegetarians. Like, they presented as healthy vegetarian on social media but investigators found meat and junk food in their fridge and pantry.
When someone thinks a dog's life is more valuable than a human, it's a sign that they are psychopaths or have ASPD. The main reason why psychopaths love dogs is because they desire control, and it's easy to control a dog than it is to control a human.
Psychopaths gravitate toward dogs since they are obedient and easy to manipulate. Ronson says he spoke with individuals who would qualify as psychopaths who told him they aren't sad when they hear about people dying. "But they get really upset when their dogs die because dogs offer unconditional love."
Prior to adopting their six children, the Harts were foster parents to a 15-year-old girl.[21] A week before their first three children were due to arrive, the Harts dropped the girl off at a scheduled therapist appointment. The therapist then informed the girl that the Harts would not be coming back for her.[21]
That poor girl. That whole story shows how people become attached to their abusers.
Lee was all in, too. “I was going to be a big sister!”
The Harts seemed to be preparing her for the role. “They would tell me I needed to be a good influence for these kids.”
The couple went to Texas for a week to meet the first set of two sets of siblings they would adopt. As Lee remembers, there was a brother and sister. The mom was pregnant with a girl, and the Harts expected to adopt her, too.
Lee stayed with another family while they were gone and reunited with the Harts when they got back. They showed her pictures of the children. “We were super excited,” she said.
A week before the Texas children were due to arrive, the Harts dropped Lee off for a therapist appointment. Sitting her down, the therapist broke the news: Jen and Sarah would not be coming back to get her. Lee was going to live with a new family, starting immediately.
It’s not your fault, she recalled the therapist telling her. The Harts were just not a good fit.
And so, another couple picked her up and brought her home. All her belongings were already there.
I've loosely followed this case since it first happened, and somehow I missed this interview. I hope Lee is happy, and has found solace and peace about her time with these two murderers.
There's a book about this, We Were Once A Family. I read it last year and it's infuriating and really shows how little the system does to address child abuse. The children had a brother, Dontay, who was separated from the family due to behavioral issues and grew up in a series of abusive psych wards and residential facilities. Through it all he dreamed of one day reuniting with his siblings, only to find out they were murdered. Such a heartbreaking case.
And wasn’t this the case when the kids were taken from their biological mother for marijuana? That mother kept trying to get the kids back, and to know that this is how it ended is heartbreaking
For cocaine iirc, but she was never high around the kids and they were largely raised by a friend of hers who by all accounts was a good dad. I feel so bad for that whole family. The biological parents weren't informed of their kids' deaths, they found out weeks after the fact from the news, and they weren't allowed to have their ashes because they no longer had any parental rights. I can't imagine the grief.
EDIT: I'm reading about it again and they were originally placed in the custody of her husband. I thought he was just a friend because he wasn't their biological dad and from what I remember of the book they weren't actively in a relationship.
Case workers from DSHS tried to reach the Harts twice: once on March 23, 2018—three days before the murders—and once on the day of the murders.
This reminds me of the Josh Powell family case. When the abuser(s) feel that their control of their “family” is close to ending due to their abuse being discovered, they often make the decision to just wipe everyone out. In the Powell’s case it literally happened while a social worker was at the front door and Josh Powell locked her out and proceeded to burn the house down in as big of a hurry as he possibly could before anyone could save them. It is such a shame the systems we have in place cannot detect these narcissistic sadistic psychopaths sooner. It also makes me wonder if, in cases where this type of extreme abuse from dangerous individuals is involved, if social and health services should tread carefully in terms of giving these people any form of advance notice/indications of an imminent change in custody as this often can be the catalyst for familicide.
I posit, the fact it’s all psychopaths and sociopaths and narcissists in power, we are VERY good at identifying them. Just, none of the right people care. Because the right people don’t WANT to be billionaires when people are homeless and starving. All the wrong people think of they help the psychopaths and billionaires, one day they will get their reward and be made into a millionaire. Most of them get conned, the psychopaths find a way through to get what they want because they are sociopaths. No empathy for others.
So no. We are not bad at identifying them. No one with real power will oppose them because at some level they are jealous and want it for themselves. If they take down millionaires, it’s less likely they get to end up one in the future, because those same rules would apply to them now too.
It’s why we need to primary in all the candidates that do not own stocks or take money from big corporations. Grass roots only
Sarah had made Google searches before the crash, inquiring about the lethality of Benadryl and the nature of death by drowning.[35] Her searches also included "No-kill shelters for dogs"; the family's two dogs were found inside the Hart family home.
The irony of making sure her dogs didn’t get killed after killing her entire family.
Also,
Hannah reportedly pleaded, "Don't make me go back! They're racists and they abuse us!"
Jennifer attempted to explain the incident by claiming that Hannah was lying, that the children occasionally acted out because they were "drug babies", and that Hannah's biological mother was bipolar.
using a racist stereotype to explain why your kid is calling you racist is insane.
This is literally the same situation as Dahmer. The cops gave a 14 year old laotian boy back to his murderer. It’s crazy depressing that the same thing could happen 30 years apart.
Even worse when you know the boy was naked and bleeding from his back side due to SA. Bruised and cut too. He begged for help and police looked at this boy bleeding and limping and said “Yeah, Dahmer, you’re a great guy! I’m sure the story you just told us about he did it to himself and has mental problems is right.”
Later people stated he was just so charismatic. I can’t fathom seeing a child naked and bleeding and deciding charm overruled it.
You can’t be serious lol. Because saying “sounds about white” implies all white people do it
Basically, because some white people do it, you are attributing that behavior to every single person who is white, regardless of who they are. Hmm, what does that sound like…
The book mentioned above is really good. One of the girls felt (I think?) maybe a bicylce accident and chipped her two front teeth or lost them. They were adult teeth and the women who adopted her wouldn't fix it because they wanted her to look younger then she was. I guess for more sympathy. I think the girl was around 12 or maybe older. And being malnourished also resulted in her looking small.
The two women were the absolute worst! Withheld food from the kids, claimed to be vegan, meanwhile ate meat and snacks. I recall a pretentious facebook post one lady about not having a tv and not needing it because the real world is so amazing and they are so enlightened. They had a big screen TV.
The DHS workers saw that Hannah Hart, who was 11 at the time, appeared small for her age and had no front teeth. Jennifer and Sarah Hart said Hannah knocked out her teeth when she was running on hardwood floors the year before, and they needed to wait another year for dental treatment.
A few months after the Harts moved to Washington, the DeKalbs reported that Hannah Hart came to their door at 1:30 AM. She had jumped out of a second-story window and ran through bushes to their home, begging them to protect her from her abusive parents. The neighbors noted that she was missing her front teeth and appeared to be about seven years old, although she was twelve. The other children also appeared small and thin when the family came over the next morning.
Weren't these two women also behind some kumbaya, pro-cops photo-op that they coerced one of the kids into (around the time that BLM started)? It's super obvious that they viewed these kids as an accessory for them to use for whatever purpose they thought served them...
is it possible that something happened to him first and the other kids were killed so they couldn't tell? I don't think a child services visit alone would have made them do this when they could just move to a new town to avoid oversight.
I live in a very red rural pocket of a very blue state and 3 of the 4 out lesbian couples I know with kids are extremely right wing/pro-police/MAGA. Like I don’t understand them at all, but they certainly exist.
Those kids repeatedly looked for help because they were being abused and not on authority helped them to get out.It makes me angry this these people were allowed to abused those kids for soo long and then kill them
As far as I can tell from stories I’ve personally heard and my personal experience, when you’re abused by your mom, it is really fucking hard to get help. Maybe I’m wrong, but I don’t think a man could do what my mother did and never be charged with a crime and never spend a day in jail. To the point that my youngest sibling was taken away and put in foster care for abuse. It still did not result in a crime, my mother did nothing in the way of mental rehabilitation, and my sister just went back home after a couple of years.
Very true. I was told that my mom hitting me and screaming in my face was just a result of her being stressed and tired and that I should be more understanding.
Now Ive spent thousands in therapy and I still think I deserve being treated like shit
You are worthy of dignity, hope, love, respect, kindness, and compassion. You deserve to take up space. You belong here. Love yourself into health, knowing, you deserve dignity, respect, kindness, and love especially from yourself. Start granting yourself what you are worthy of, and others will follow.
When I was 9, my mother had her first full psychotic break and spent the entire night beating me once my sibling. She screamed to mske us say we hated her and that we were pigs, ingrate, skanks, ect.
The neighbors could easily hear this.
She started this by putting a choker on the new puppy and pulling him while he screamed. She yelled that if we stopped her she'd do rhe same to us. She said ir was because we were bad kids that he was making her do this.
Thr neighbors witnessed and went inside
The next day, I was missing a tooth and covered in bruises. Neighbor came to me to say my mom is sick and needed more help from me. Since I was thr oldest, I had to step up. At 9.
She had already let her boyfriend molest me and was sexually inappropriate with me. This is something I've had to come to terms with recently at 33. I told so many teachers, parents, and others about her but this woman was a mentally ill Oscar performance giving actor.
She weaponized her chronic health problems and made her kids the villains. It was our fault her house was filled with bugs and garbage. Not that she was a mentally ill hoarder who made up get stuff from the trash. It was our fault she stayed in bed for days, not that she was so high on pills that she couldn't function.
Cps did nothing. Fuck Detroit
One parent believed me and she tried being nice to my mother to keep me and my sibling safe. She called cps and the cops but nothing. Recently, I learned that my mother had said something to her that had her afraid she was going to murder/ suicide. It made sense since my mother was batshit and this was around the time she was talking about having my pets put to sleep and made my sibling snd I watch videos of cats being euthanized on a vet show.
In my experience, they don't lose any custody and in fact win some just cause of that whole "a child can't not be with their father!" Ugh. Thank you judge, for ignoring the abuse.
I was "only" emotionally/psychologically abused by my adoptive mother. She was physically and sexually abused as a child. I guess she thought she was an amazing mother because she never beat us. She would even yell at us that, "IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE ABUSED!" I didn't even know I was abused until after she died and I started really processing how fucked up everything was. It didn't feel like I was abused because that was just what my normal was.
My 911 center took the calls for this incident. It happened right after a real accident occurred in the same spot a few weeks prior. The first one was a real accident. Witnesses said she lost control. Someone on scene saw her trying to get out. I think she called in. The woman couldn't get out of her belt or car. She suffered. It was on the news.
A few of us ordered seat belt cutters the same day.
When this incident came in, we called it out as intentional before the officers even arrived (verbally amongst ourselves, not in the logs). Witness said the van just drove off the cliff. We didnt know there were kids in the car, we just assumed it was a suicide inspired by the previous incident. Once we found out there were kids in the car, I remember so many of us losing it. Anger mixed with other emotions. Fyck those bytches.
I dont necessarily believe in heaven or hell. But I hope there's a hell for these 2.
It does, butNot in the way you think. I love my job. I could do this job for another 20 years. But it comes with incredibly toxic managers who seem to have been "promoted up" because they couldn't do the job on the floor. Its a common issue in most centers. They're THE REASON most people leave. Bad managers with ego driven policies. When ego shouldn't come into play in this job at all.
Hard to say. Near the end, it seems like the women were hating being parents. And one of them told a friend "i wish someone had told me it was ok not to have a very large family." Probably regretted adopting the kids. They didnt seem to love them. They abused and neglected the children for years, often not feeding them in the form of punishment. There was also signs of physical harm in the form of bruises on the kids arms and backs. Kids were afraid of them, and one even tried to run away once by jumping out of a 2nd story window, crying to the neighbour "they are racist" and that they were afraid of them.
They were active on social media, often using the kids as props for social clout. Pretty disgusting behaviour. They probably had some kind of disorder or mental illness, because otherwise they just seem evil. After a while, I guess their narcissism told them to murder-suicide rather than seeking help. Probably had some twisted and demented justification for that being the best thing to do.
Not to mention is also usually because the parents don’t want to “expose” their kids to science, gays, sex education, banned books, critical thinking, etc. (Which is just another form of abuse IMO)
Yes. Whenever you ask homeschooling parents why they wouldn't support regulations of their industry to prevent neglect and abuse, they get super defensive, saying public school kids get abuses, too. Point out that there are systems to TRY and report abuse in schools (however imperfect), and they go into strawman arguments. Sorry, how many child deaths are the acceptable price for your "freedom" to homeschool?
The Hart family murders are an extreme example but they are one I bring up to counter people who believe adoption is all happy endings and that the foster care system is flawless. I was separated from my family by foster care and adopted into a very abusive home with a racist parent. I commemorate the Hart children every year.
When I read articles about abused adoptees I often get the sense that the adoptive parents like, expected the kids to be so grateful for being adopted that they’d act perfect.
Society, in general, acts like adoptive parents can do no wrong and are basically saints or saviors for raising "someone else's unwanted child" and that adoptees should be eternally grateful for not being aborted, thrown in a dumpster and left for dead, etc. I believe this line of thinking makes it easier for abusive adoptive parents to get away with the abuse. And makes it harder for adoptees to speak up about it and be believed.
In my case, I was adopted as a baby. I was never in foster care. This form (US domestic infant adoption) of adoption basically just means that the adopters had tens of thousands of dollars to spend on getting a baby. Meanwhile, my biological mother was living in poverty. I was abused by my adoptive mother. People think adoption means that you were "chosen" and wanted by your adopters. But there's definitely a subset of infant adopters who want to pretend that the kid is biologically theirs. When the kid doesn't turn out the way they want or has feelings about adoption other than being grateful, some of them even rehome the kid.
It’s not so much that people widely believe its flawless, but lots of people are eager to dismiss any discussion that sometimes children are wrongfully removed from homes and placed in foster care. As an adoptee I’m frequently told things like “well aren’t you grateful?” etc and people have this weird faith in the foster/adoption system when things are not that black and white.
That makes sense. I wonder if that's just people feeling weird and not being willing to engage with a nuanced conversation with you. it's easier for them to act like what you experienced was for the better because they don't want to acknowledge the nuance.
Yeah it’s kind of a strange dichotomy, people are critical of foster care but not so much the adoption system even though they’re linked. I think maybe people see CPS as a potential threat to their own families but they don’t think it would ever go so far as to adopt their kids out to totally different families.
And I’d wager that race was a factor. White adoptive parents likely face less scrutiny, and black adoptees are probably treated with less care and handed off to questionable people. Especially a sibling group, as it’s harder to find foster and adoptive families for those.
There was a very sad passage in Dungy's autobiography. When he and his wife signed up to adopt a baby the social worker told them the waiting list was 18 months.
When they asked how long for a Black baby, the social worker said "Oh. You can take one home today."
After their biological mother, Sherry Davis,[26] lost custody due to substance abuse problems in August 2006,[19] the Davis children were given to their paternal aunt, Priscilla Celestine, under the condition that they have no contact with their biological mother.[26] However, after she was required to work another shift, Celestine allowed Davis to babysit the children, which a case worker observed.[27]
As a result, the children were removed from Celestine's care and a court prevented Celestine from obtaining permanent custody.[10]
The layers of cruelty in this story are overwhelming.
The podcast Broken Harts covers this story very well. It was pretty dubious how the kids were in the system in the first place to be adopted by these monsters. They were failed every step of the way.
Your criticism of the true crime podcast genre overall is valid. I recommended this one in particular because I think the hosts took their jobs as journalists seriously and it wasn’t typical rubbernecking froth. They gave care to the humanity of the victims and covered issues with more in depth discussion such as racial bias in CPS and the foster system that the Wikipedia page does not. If you want a curation of the basic facts of the case and maybe read the cited sources that go more in depth, then yes, the Wikipedia page would suffice.
On one of the recent times this case was brought up on Reddit, there was a lot of comments on the MMO that Jennifer spent a huge amount of her life playing. It was some kind of game about Alice In Wonderland (edit: it was actually "Oz: Broken Kingdom"). A number of her co-players showed up in the comments with anecdotes. To have six foster kids and spend the amount of time they did playing the MMO is insane.
This whole thing is more common than most people ever want to know. Not to the extreme like these insane, legal-parents, but close enough. Everyone working with adoption, foster care, knows this.
They were big fans of a band called Nahko and Medicine for the People, which has a song that goes like this:
Me and Mr. Washington go forth with no real direction, dreaming of the day we drive our cars into the ocean. And all the people looking on will wonder what to say, and live confused about us ‘til the day they do the same. And they will see, while swimming, that they are free.
I was a fan and went to a concert last year with a friend. We found out about the allegations right before which alone would have ruined it, but we didn’t realize it was gonna be just the one guy, we thought it was a group? So we went. It was just the one dude in a ballroom made for a wedding, terrible acoustics, probably only a couple hundred people there. Anyways, we don’t listen to him (them?) anymore.
They were too concerned with coming off as the selfless, empathetic, martyr type and never considered how difficult the job could actually be. They’d rather kill themselves and the children than admit they weren’t who they appeared to be.
These White woman adopting Black children to use for their social media and to then dispose of them via murder is so fucking evil. There’s so many layers to this tragic story and racism is one of them. I hope they’re rotting in hell.
I met the biological mother of 3 of the kids. She was even interviewed about it when we were neighbors. She will never be ok mentally after this. She lost her 3 due to medical negligence and it was a sad story too. All 6 of these kids lived through so much trauma before having their lives extinguished so young. Jennifer and Sarah deserve to rot
I don't automatically think the post was homophobic. I'm LGBT and non-white, and racism is definitely a problem in the community. You can be both privileged and marginalized at the same time. They were lesbians, but they used their white privilege to masquerade as progressive, while using that as cover to abuse these children.
Oo I remember this story, it’s extremely dark. There’s a video of one of the boys crying and hugging a man who is leading some sort of drum circle. It’s heartbreaking to watch because you can see the boy isn’t doing well under the care of these two women. There’s another picture of the same boy hugging a police officer at a protest that went viral. I believe the video was filmed a few weeks before the murder.
1.) These kids were failed, multiple times.
2.) Ole girl wanted to make sure her dogs were okay and checked on no-kill shelters, before killing all of these kids.
Holy shit.
Point 2 is giving "Dogs are in the enclosed pool area. Garage side door is open."
What's this from
I believe it’s referencing the Chris Benoit murder-suicide, referring to the last text he sent to someone.
It is. He sent the same text from both his and Nancy Benoit's phones to multiple people, before committing suicide. He'd killed Nancy and their son Daniel nearly two days before that, and lied that they'd gotten a stomach bug to explain why he wasn't en route to a pay per view event.
And you'll still occasionally hear people try to make out like he did this as part of some cte blackout.
Guy obviously wasn't right in the head, but he'd been abusing nancy for years at that point. He obviously had the faculties to cover his tracks and know what he was doing was wrong.
I don't think it was a "CTE Blackout" but I have also heard some of the stories from his sister-in-law and Nancy's sister Sandra Toffoloni. She lived with them and was a workout partner for Chris. He increasingly showed paranoid and delusional thinking. His autopsy showed severe brain damage consistent with CTE. I think CTE and drug use were major contributors to the murder-suicide.
I'm not saying that to get Chris Benoit off the hook - I'm saying it to keep organizations like the WWE accountable who had a revolving door of tragedies caused by the way they treated drug use and head injuries for the vast majority of their existence.
I couldn’t agree more. It’s not an excuse for his actions but there’s just so much we don’t know about the brain and brain injuries have been known to make somebody’s personality take a nasty turn
Everybody who committed an act of violence that was influenced by lead poisoning isn’t suddenly off the hook because we realized lead poisoning was a thing, but we figured out a way to prevent that in the future. With all the environmental contaminants we’ve invented directly or indirectly since the Industrial Revolution who knows what would be influencing our mental health or how long it could take to figure it out
First it was Owen Hart, next big one was Eddie Guerrero, Benoit, Macho Man, Warrior, Piper, Brodie Lee, Razor, Bray Wyatt, Sabu. It's not just drug use and head injuries, it's how the medium itself has evolved to dismiss or ignore injuries or take bigger risks. Whatever it takes, as long as you keep going. As long as you grind your body down to a literal pulp for the sake of a few extra dollars, for a few more seconds of fame.
Why would acknowledging the massive CTE he got from doing a flying headbutt for years diminish what he did? Doesn't that justify more research and care into preventing this in the future?
That's not how CTE works. It's not like getting blackout drunk, it literally changes how you think, act, behave, and what you believe (delusional, violence) rapidly for a brain but slower than what you're implying here - you don't snap and "black-out". And yes, it can and will come on over years, it's chronic brain damage that developes into a severe brain disorder after the fact.
Knowing what he was doing was wrong isn't really what's most relevant, it's "did he change dramatically" "would he have behaved that way without CTE". Did he actually understand what he was doing and why in the sense of what was driving him - delusions, beliefs, fears that may be completely irrational but the knowledge that others won't understand- because it's crazy and wrong. Did it make him more aggressive? All of those are real possibilities.
The reason we ask is because prevention saves lives. It's not got anything to do with your comment, it's because we don't want this to happen again, and yet, it has and it will, because for some reason it's easier to ignore CTE is real than it is to try and prevent it from being caused by activities done purely for entertainment. We could change rules to minimize, but no.
Minor correction: it was his son Daniel. David, who was living with Chris’ ex, is still alive.
Damn, I freaking completely forgot about this
All the children were black, adopted by crazy white ladies that ended up murdering them….. yet they made sure the animals survived.
What kind of sickness is this??
Some people use their love of animals to absolve themselves of how badly they treat people. You probably hear people say things like “he loves animals, he couldn’t possibly be bad!” but like, Hitler was an animal lover. Animals can’t talk back so they can’t tell you that your help isn’t helpful. And many people view animals, at least their preferred animals, as uncomplicated and apolitical. Those animals don’t clash with their views of the world or confront their ideologies.
My ex-husband! Thanks for expressing this so clearly.
The fact that my ex, a selfish and abusive man-child, was such a big animal person helped fool me for a long time. He was even a vegetarian since his teens because he loved them so much. It's a MASSIVE part of how it took me so effing long to spot it- his ability to display empathy didn't extend to humans.
I truly believe they viewed these children as lesser than animals. There were multiple abuse allegations against these two. They also would've been the type to deny being racist because they adopted Black children even though their White Saviorism was so blatant. Not saying that all white people who adopt non-white kids are racist. But there is definitely A Type of white person who chooses to adopt non-white children because of their White Savior mentality). And many of them hide their racism under progressive, altruistic disguises.
I think people like that end up abusing their children because they think no matter what they do, their child's life with their black biological family would have been worse. I can almost 100% guarantee this lady drove off that cliff thinking her kids were better off dead with her than alive with a black family.
Tbh even with white women who have biracial kids the ‘ol fashioned way. My cousin is biracial and my shitty aunt uses her and my uncle to try and bypass any accusation of racism
Never mind that she called my uncle the n word (with hard r) in front of my cousin. My cousin also wasn’t allowed to wear her natural hair texture until after graduating college. It goes without saying that not everyone in biracial relationships is like my aunt. But at the same time every white person I’ve met who is in a biracial relationship thinks that it’s impossible for them to be racist if they’re involved with somebody from another race
These ideologically driven delusions are exactly the same whether fueled by religion or politics. Historically we've repeatedly seen the dire consequences for those who wanted no part in it, and were unable to defend themselves from it.
Hitler was a vegan artist, who adored animals.
Vegetarian, I think.
That was propaganda actually, he wanted to look kind. All his favorite dishes were meat
That tracks.
He was not kind to his dogs.
A large portion of the population of the internet doesn’t attach any significant value to a human life over an animals. It’s very easy if you don’t believe in the concept of a soul, which a large portion of redditors don’t based on my comment replies in the past.
Valid.
But would it not be fair to say a soul and morality are two separate subjects?
Are we saying you that have to believe in the concept of a soul to have morals and be decent human?? Thats kind of what I'm reading here.
Shows that they cared more for the fucking dogs than the children. Sickening pieces of shit.
Partially why I hate when people are way more concerned with animal welfare than humans.
The head of a homeless outreach program on tiktok had to take dog food off of their wishlist because more people were donating dog food than supplies for people in need
“Animals are easy at worst they kill and eat you. humans pretend to be your friend first” -Steve Irwin
That shit is so weird but pervasive nowadays….
It's because a lot of people think animals are perfect and can do no wrong. Like an animal simply can't process its own actions so if they do anything bad or violent it can be blamed on instinct as if they have no control, but conversely if they do anything good or seemingly selfless it's "because they have a heart of gold" and "we don't deserve dogs! 🥹🥲".
They think they are fundamentally different than a person in that they are dumb enough to not have the capacity to do anything bad, but also intelligent enough to choose to be kind and selfless. It's an odd paradox that a lot of people don't even want to acknowledge.
I hate that line of thinking so much
Is it so weird? I'd rather hang out with her dogs than her - she was a fuckin' loon, but the dogs were probably chill.
If that means a dog’s life or wellbeing is worth more than a human’s? Then yes, that’s weird.
Well, the dogs didn’t kill the kids…so, yes, I think the dogs were worth more than Jennifer 🤷♀️
We’re obviously talking in generalities. Yeah, duh, your golden retriever is worth more than a mass murderer….
These people are rarely vegan so they're not even logically consistent.
I think the women in this case were fake vegetarians. Like, they presented as healthy vegetarian on social media but investigators found meat and junk food in their fridge and pantry.
See Brigitte Bardot
Guilty. I absolutely love cats. I could never knowingly hurt a cat. I will stand up for the welfare of cats, wild or otherwise.
EXACTLY.
When someone thinks a dog's life is more valuable than a human, it's a sign that they are psychopaths or have ASPD. The main reason why psychopaths love dogs is because they desire control, and it's easy to control a dog than it is to control a human.
Is this your opinion or in this based on objective information?
https://laist.com/news/kpcc-archive/how-spot-psychopath
Very interesting.
I'm still reading the article, but holy shit:
here's the 2018 Seattle Times interview with the woman who'd been that teenage foster kid. rough.
That poor girl. That whole story shows how people become attached to their abusers.
at least she didn't get murdered though
I've loosely followed this case since it first happened, and somehow I missed this interview. I hope Lee is happy, and has found solace and peace about her time with these two murderers.
Holy shit.
The fact that these two bches were allowed to adopt more children after this makes my blood boil.
There's a book about this, We Were Once A Family. I read it last year and it's infuriating and really shows how little the system does to address child abuse. The children had a brother, Dontay, who was separated from the family due to behavioral issues and grew up in a series of abusive psych wards and residential facilities. Through it all he dreamed of one day reuniting with his siblings, only to find out they were murdered. Such a heartbreaking case.
And wasn’t this the case when the kids were taken from their biological mother for marijuana? That mother kept trying to get the kids back, and to know that this is how it ended is heartbreaking
For cocaine iirc, but she was never high around the kids and they were largely raised by a friend of hers who by all accounts was a good dad. I feel so bad for that whole family. The biological parents weren't informed of their kids' deaths, they found out weeks after the fact from the news, and they weren't allowed to have their ashes because they no longer had any parental rights. I can't imagine the grief.
EDIT: I'm reading about it again and they were originally placed in the custody of her husband. I thought he was just a friend because he wasn't their biological dad and from what I remember of the book they weren't actively in a relationship.
Omg this is heartbreaking
Slate did a very good podcast segment on this and the book!
This reminds me of the Josh Powell family case. When the abuser(s) feel that their control of their “family” is close to ending due to their abuse being discovered, they often make the decision to just wipe everyone out. In the Powell’s case it literally happened while a social worker was at the front door and Josh Powell locked her out and proceeded to burn the house down in as big of a hurry as he possibly could before anyone could save them. It is such a shame the systems we have in place cannot detect these narcissistic sadistic psychopaths sooner. It also makes me wonder if, in cases where this type of extreme abuse from dangerous individuals is involved, if social and health services should tread carefully in terms of giving these people any form of advance notice/indications of an imminent change in custody as this often can be the catalyst for familicide.
I know with police for very dangerous individuals they won’t go to their home for this reason. and opt for their place of work, gym ect.
If we were good at detecting psychopaths we would stop letting them be in charge
It’s not that we can’t detect them, we just equate the charisma and manipulation with them being “good people”.
Fair point, although I am afraid at the political level it is a feature, not a bug.
I posit, the fact it’s all psychopaths and sociopaths and narcissists in power, we are VERY good at identifying them. Just, none of the right people care. Because the right people don’t WANT to be billionaires when people are homeless and starving. All the wrong people think of they help the psychopaths and billionaires, one day they will get their reward and be made into a millionaire. Most of them get conned, the psychopaths find a way through to get what they want because they are sociopaths. No empathy for others.
So no. We are not bad at identifying them. No one with real power will oppose them because at some level they are jealous and want it for themselves. If they take down millionaires, it’s less likely they get to end up one in the future, because those same rules would apply to them now too.
It’s why we need to primary in all the candidates that do not own stocks or take money from big corporations. Grass roots only
I heard that 911 operator didn’t handle it very well
It has to be very hard to be suspicious of the people that are actually trying to help, without driving them away.
The irony of making sure her dogs didn’t get killed after killing her entire family.
Also,
using a racist stereotype to explain why your kid is calling you racist is insane.
This is literally the same situation as Dahmer. The cops gave a 14 year old laotian boy back to his murderer. It’s crazy depressing that the same thing could happen 30 years apart.
Even worse when you know the boy was naked and bleeding from his back side due to SA. Bruised and cut too. He begged for help and police looked at this boy bleeding and limping and said “Yeah, Dahmer, you’re a great guy! I’m sure the story you just told us about he did it to himself and has mental problems is right.”
Later people stated he was just so charismatic. I can’t fathom seeing a child naked and bleeding and deciding charm overruled it.
I’d bet my bank account that we will be having the same conversation about Jillian Michaels when her daughter becomes an adult.
i couldn't find the scoop online. what makes you say that?
Oh yeah. That witch is diabolical, it seems
Sounds about “white”
[deleted]
White people often perpetrate acts of racism against black people, as evidenced by this post… what’s racist about making that observation?
You can’t be serious lol. Because saying “sounds about white” implies all white people do it
Basically, because some white people do it, you are attributing that behavior to every single person who is white, regardless of who they are. Hmm, what does that sound like…
Looks at the pictures and then look at the ages of the kids. They were so malnourished to keep them small and childlike. Hurts my heart.
The book mentioned above is really good. One of the girls felt (I think?) maybe a bicylce accident and chipped her two front teeth or lost them. They were adult teeth and the women who adopted her wouldn't fix it because they wanted her to look younger then she was. I guess for more sympathy. I think the girl was around 12 or maybe older. And being malnourished also resulted in her looking small.
The two women were the absolute worst! Withheld food from the kids, claimed to be vegan, meanwhile ate meat and snacks. I recall a pretentious facebook post one lady about not having a tv and not needing it because the real world is so amazing and they are so enlightened. They had a big screen TV.
What scary people....
https://www.kgw.com/article/news/local/oregon-dhs-investigated-hart-family-in-2013-knew-of-other-abuse-allegations-documents-show/283-544988935
https://childwelfaremonitor.org/2018/04/09/multiple-system-failures-allowed-hart-children-to-die/
Weren't these two women also behind some kumbaya, pro-cops photo-op that they coerced one of the kids into (around the time that BLM started)? It's super obvious that they viewed these kids as an accessory for them to use for whatever purpose they thought served them...
Yes the kid second to the right was in a photo hugging a policeman and he's crying.
They used to go around with 'free hugs' signs. Ugh
He was crying in the photo. Now, I can’t help to wonder what he was actually crying about.
They also never found his body
is it possible that something happened to him first and the other kids were killed so they couldn't tell? I don't think a child services visit alone would have made them do this when they could just move to a new town to avoid oversight.
Yes, the wee lad hugged the police man and it went viral. May these ladies be rotting in hell.
they also did a bunch of rainbow-gathering hippie type shit where they paraded the kids around in goofy costumes
Yeah they were
yes it is right there, in the linked wikipedia article!
The lesbian couple were also pro police? Thats like the perfect storm of domestic violence.
I dont think so. The kid was at a protest with them and had a sign that said free hugs and the cop hugged him
I live in a very red rural pocket of a very blue state and 3 of the 4 out lesbian couples I know with kids are extremely right wing/pro-police/MAGA. Like I don’t understand them at all, but they certainly exist.
Proximity to power. Some people think if they can ingratiate themselves to the right that they’ll be accepted and “safe” from persecution.
Wouldn’t exactly call it pro cop. It was pro blm just in a very both sides way.
Those kids repeatedly looked for help because they were being abused and not on authority helped them to get out.It makes me angry this these people were allowed to abused those kids for soo long and then kill them
As far as I can tell from stories I’ve personally heard and my personal experience, when you’re abused by your mom, it is really fucking hard to get help. Maybe I’m wrong, but I don’t think a man could do what my mother did and never be charged with a crime and never spend a day in jail. To the point that my youngest sibling was taken away and put in foster care for abuse. It still did not result in a crime, my mother did nothing in the way of mental rehabilitation, and my sister just went back home after a couple of years.
Very true. I was told that my mom hitting me and screaming in my face was just a result of her being stressed and tired and that I should be more understanding.
Now Ive spent thousands in therapy and I still think I deserve being treated like shit
From one black sheep, mother abused to another:
You are worthy of dignity, hope, love, respect, kindness, and compassion. You deserve to take up space. You belong here. Love yourself into health, knowing, you deserve dignity, respect, kindness, and love especially from yourself. Start granting yourself what you are worthy of, and others will follow.
When I was 9, my mother had her first full psychotic break and spent the entire night beating me once my sibling. She screamed to mske us say we hated her and that we were pigs, ingrate, skanks, ect.
The neighbors could easily hear this.
She started this by putting a choker on the new puppy and pulling him while he screamed. She yelled that if we stopped her she'd do rhe same to us. She said ir was because we were bad kids that he was making her do this.
Thr neighbors witnessed and went inside
The next day, I was missing a tooth and covered in bruises. Neighbor came to me to say my mom is sick and needed more help from me. Since I was thr oldest, I had to step up. At 9.
She had already let her boyfriend molest me and was sexually inappropriate with me. This is something I've had to come to terms with recently at 33. I told so many teachers, parents, and others about her but this woman was a mentally ill Oscar performance giving actor.
She weaponized her chronic health problems and made her kids the villains. It was our fault her house was filled with bugs and garbage. Not that she was a mentally ill hoarder who made up get stuff from the trash. It was our fault she stayed in bed for days, not that she was so high on pills that she couldn't function.
Cps did nothing. Fuck Detroit
One parent believed me and she tried being nice to my mother to keep me and my sibling safe. She called cps and the cops but nothing. Recently, I learned that my mother had said something to her that had her afraid she was going to murder/ suicide. It made sense since my mother was batshit and this was around the time she was talking about having my pets put to sleep and made my sibling snd I watch videos of cats being euthanized on a vet show.
Oh men get away with it too.
Most child abusers lose custody without any criminal penalty.
In my experience, they don't lose any custody and in fact win some just cause of that whole "a child can't not be with their father!" Ugh. Thank you judge, for ignoring the abuse.
And women get punished for bringing up abuse, even with credible evidence.
I was "only" emotionally/psychologically abused by my adoptive mother. She was physically and sexually abused as a child. I guess she thought she was an amazing mother because she never beat us. She would even yell at us that, "IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE ABUSED!" I didn't even know I was abused until after she died and I started really processing how fucked up everything was. It didn't feel like I was abused because that was just what my normal was.
Lay off the red pill, mate
I am a very left woman in my 40s.
Black and white thinking is a cancer.
The system failed these kids.
Such a horrific massacre and so preventable. Those women never should have been allowed to adopt.
Wasn’t there an Atlanta episode based on this? Oh yeah it says in the wiki.
Spectacular show and episode
Yep. Back baby by Jessica Pratt was a perfect choice for the music
First episode of season 3. I recognized it immediately as it aired.
Imo best episode of the show, made me think real hard about whiteness for a few months.
That was how I learned of this, and holy shit it still feels way too weird even for fiction.
Yeah I knew I’d seen this before.
My 911 center took the calls for this incident. It happened right after a real accident occurred in the same spot a few weeks prior. The first one was a real accident. Witnesses said she lost control. Someone on scene saw her trying to get out. I think she called in. The woman couldn't get out of her belt or car. She suffered. It was on the news.
A few of us ordered seat belt cutters the same day.
When this incident came in, we called it out as intentional before the officers even arrived (verbally amongst ourselves, not in the logs). Witness said the van just drove off the cliff. We didnt know there were kids in the car, we just assumed it was a suicide inspired by the previous incident. Once we found out there were kids in the car, I remember so many of us losing it. Anger mixed with other emotions. Fyck those bytches.
I dont necessarily believe in heaven or hell. But I hope there's a hell for these 2.
I can’t imagine what it’s like to work with this stuff. I’m glad there are people like you who can handle it. I’m sure it takes a toll though.
It does, butNot in the way you think. I love my job. I could do this job for another 20 years. But it comes with incredibly toxic managers who seem to have been "promoted up" because they couldn't do the job on the floor. Its a common issue in most centers. They're THE REASON most people leave. Bad managers with ego driven policies. When ego shouldn't come into play in this job at all.
CHP Ukiah?
Well, that was a particularly terrible wiki article to read first thing in the morning. Merry Christmas!
Is there a known motive?
Hard to say. Near the end, it seems like the women were hating being parents. And one of them told a friend "i wish someone had told me it was ok not to have a very large family." Probably regretted adopting the kids. They didnt seem to love them. They abused and neglected the children for years, often not feeding them in the form of punishment. There was also signs of physical harm in the form of bruises on the kids arms and backs. Kids were afraid of them, and one even tried to run away once by jumping out of a 2nd story window, crying to the neighbour "they are racist" and that they were afraid of them.
They were active on social media, often using the kids as props for social clout. Pretty disgusting behaviour. They probably had some kind of disorder or mental illness, because otherwise they just seem evil. After a while, I guess their narcissism told them to murder-suicide rather than seeking help. Probably had some twisted and demented justification for that being the best thing to do.
Cases like this is why I'm so against homeschooling.
Parents pull kids out to get away with abuse.
Exactly they have all the control and nobody who can see how the kids are.
Not to mention is also usually because the parents don’t want to “expose” their kids to science, gays, sex education, banned books, critical thinking, etc. (Which is just another form of abuse IMO)
Yes. Whenever you ask homeschooling parents why they wouldn't support regulations of their industry to prevent neglect and abuse, they get super defensive, saying public school kids get abuses, too. Point out that there are systems to TRY and report abuse in schools (however imperfect), and they go into strawman arguments. Sorry, how many child deaths are the acceptable price for your "freedom" to homeschool?
The Hart family murders are an extreme example but they are one I bring up to counter people who believe adoption is all happy endings and that the foster care system is flawless. I was separated from my family by foster care and adopted into a very abusive home with a racist parent. I commemorate the Hart children every year.
When I read articles about abused adoptees I often get the sense that the adoptive parents like, expected the kids to be so grateful for being adopted that they’d act perfect.
Society, in general, acts like adoptive parents can do no wrong and are basically saints or saviors for raising "someone else's unwanted child" and that adoptees should be eternally grateful for not being aborted, thrown in a dumpster and left for dead, etc. I believe this line of thinking makes it easier for abusive adoptive parents to get away with the abuse. And makes it harder for adoptees to speak up about it and be believed.
In my case, I was adopted as a baby. I was never in foster care. This form (US domestic infant adoption) of adoption basically just means that the adopters had tens of thousands of dollars to spend on getting a baby. Meanwhile, my biological mother was living in poverty. I was abused by my adoptive mother. People think adoption means that you were "chosen" and wanted by your adopters. But there's definitely a subset of infant adopters who want to pretend that the kid is biologically theirs. When the kid doesn't turn out the way they want or has feelings about adoption other than being grateful, some of them even rehome the kid.
I’ve never met anyone who believes the foster care system is flawless.
It’s not so much that people widely believe its flawless, but lots of people are eager to dismiss any discussion that sometimes children are wrongfully removed from homes and placed in foster care. As an adoptee I’m frequently told things like “well aren’t you grateful?” etc and people have this weird faith in the foster/adoption system when things are not that black and white.
That makes sense. I wonder if that's just people feeling weird and not being willing to engage with a nuanced conversation with you. it's easier for them to act like what you experienced was for the better because they don't want to acknowledge the nuance.
Yeah it’s kind of a strange dichotomy, people are critical of foster care but not so much the adoption system even though they’re linked. I think maybe people see CPS as a potential threat to their own families but they don’t think it would ever go so far as to adopt their kids out to totally different families.
Critiques of adoption don’t go over well online in my experience
How were they able to adopt six children? I thought adopting one child is hard enough especially for a homosexual couple.
Adoption is hard for male homosexual couples not necessarily female.
They adopted a while ago - in the mid 00s adoption was much easier.
And they adopted non-infants. Adopting infants is very competitive. Adopting children older than six months is much less competitive.
Adopting non infants AND sibling sets, you get to the top of the line for that.
And I’d wager that race was a factor. White adoptive parents likely face less scrutiny, and black adoptees are probably treated with less care and handed off to questionable people. Especially a sibling group, as it’s harder to find foster and adoptive families for those.
Especially Black children.
There was a very sad passage in Dungy's autobiography. When he and his wife signed up to adopt a baby the social worker told them the waiting list was 18 months.
When they asked how long for a Black baby, the social worker said "Oh. You can take one home today."
Jfc
They were older kids with neglect histories. Much different.
The layers of cruelty in this story are overwhelming.
The podcast Broken Harts covers this story very well. It was pretty dubious how the kids were in the system in the first place to be adopted by these monsters. They were failed every step of the way.
The podcast Broken Harts is one more ghoulish podcast profiting off of real world violence and its appeal to people who relentlessly cite podcasts.
I bet the wikipedia entry covers the story pretty well.
Your criticism of the true crime podcast genre overall is valid. I recommended this one in particular because I think the hosts took their jobs as journalists seriously and it wasn’t typical rubbernecking froth. They gave care to the humanity of the victims and covered issues with more in depth discussion such as racial bias in CPS and the foster system that the Wikipedia page does not. If you want a curation of the basic facts of the case and maybe read the cited sources that go more in depth, then yes, the Wikipedia page would suffice.
Thank you, I hate the true crime podcast racket so much, it is a vulture pit
The TV show Atlanta definitely did an episode inspired by this - never knew it was a real incident until now. Terrible tragedy for those kids!
What the complete fuck?
Oh I remember when this happened. It was so shocking and sad.
Then we found out it was murder. Insanity
On one of the recent times this case was brought up on Reddit, there was a lot of comments on the MMO that Jennifer spent a huge amount of her life playing. It was some kind of game about Alice In Wonderland (edit: it was actually "Oz: Broken Kingdom"). A number of her co-players showed up in the comments with anecdotes. To have six foster kids and spend the amount of time they did playing the MMO is insane.
iirc they played star wars galaxy of heroes like, a lot
Ah, it was "Oz: Broken Kingdom", not Alice In Wonderland. Jennifer was apparently a notable figure in the community.
I genuinely can’t think about this case too hard without breaking into tears. those poor children.
This whole thing is more common than most people ever want to know. Not to the extreme like these insane, legal-parents, but close enough. Everyone working with adoption, foster care, knows this.
Imagine the social workers and other authorities living with this the rest of their lives. The lack of instincts in some of these people.
Jfc, this is horrendous. Those poor kids.
They were big fans of a band called Nahko and Medicine for the People, which has a song that goes like this:
Just an interesting tidbit.
Ugh, they would be fans. Nahko Bear has multiple allegations of sexual misconduct against him.
I was a fan and went to a concert last year with a friend. We found out about the allegations right before which alone would have ruined it, but we didn’t realize it was gonna be just the one guy, we thought it was a group? So we went. It was just the one dude in a ballroom made for a wedding, terrible acoustics, probably only a couple hundred people there. Anyways, we don’t listen to him (them?) anymore.
Oh, man. That sounds awful, but also like something you might laugh about from time to time. "Remember when we went to that horrible concert?"
Wait so that episode of Atlanta was based on a true story?
Yes, it is heartbreaking.
Atlanta does a really good mini episode that’s loosely based on this
The ultimate selfish final act. Terrifying...
They were too concerned with coming off as the selfless, empathetic, martyr type and never considered how difficult the job could actually be. They’d rather kill themselves and the children than admit they weren’t who they appeared to be.
Absolute fucking monsters. Rot in hell savages.
Those poor poor children. Thought they were saved but it was evil n disguise
Atlanta made me aware about this. White saviour complex on steroids.
This case is horrible. My God, those poor kids suffered.
The thing is I'm every photo I've seen of these kids, they look malnourished. Look at the girl on the left, she's too skinny.
They were starving.
I work with disabled foster kids. These women should never have been given children.
Atlanta S3e1 lives rent free in brain..
Oh so THIS was the inspiration for the first episode of the 4th season of Atlanta... I always wondered... now I regret finding out.
Those poor children. What hell they went through, only to be failed over and over again. I hope those bitches rot in Hell.
Y'all should watch the episode "Three Slaps" in the show Atlanta, based on this incident.
There’s a podcast about this called Broken Harts. Very well done
I wish more had read before commenting. The poor families. In particular the family that fought for custody back.
In 2017 a mom killed herself and her young 3 kids the same way in my state. Horrifying.
Pisses me off every time I see this
I've seen the memorial at the cliff, it's so sad and spooky
I think there’s an episode of Atlanta that was inspired by this.
imagine being so racist you literally kill yourself because it means killing brown people too
I’ve read this article before, but it is absolutely devastating every single time.
These White woman adopting Black children to use for their social media and to then dispose of them via murder is so fucking evil. There’s so many layers to this tragic story and racism is one of them. I hope they’re rotting in hell.
I met the biological mother of 3 of the kids. She was even interviewed about it when we were neighbors. She will never be ok mentally after this. She lost her 3 due to medical negligence and it was a sad story too. All 6 of these kids lived through so much trauma before having their lives extinguished so young. Jennifer and Sarah deserve to rot
Sounds like an episode of Atlanta. Sadly, this is probably just one of many examples of this happening they could have used for source material.
It was based on this story, down to where the kid hugs a cop (there's a picture of it)
Reminds me of the Copper Canyon story on nosleep
This is a huge reason why I’m always uncomfortable when I see white people adopting black babies. It seems so easy for things to go sideways.
These liberal lesbians adopted only black kids to parade around and virtual signal. Then murdered all of them when that got old. White supremacists.
Using murdered children as an excuse to be homophobic.. are we deadass
I don't automatically think the post was homophobic. I'm LGBT and non-white, and racism is definitely a problem in the community. You can be both privileged and marginalized at the same time. They were lesbians, but they used their white privilege to masquerade as progressive, while using that as cover to abuse these children.
Progressives aren’t out making copaganda.
Truly awful and sad.
What a wild read. Tragic and heart wrenching
Atlanta had a really great episode about this
Didn’t the show Atlanta do a riff off of this?
Oo I remember this story, it’s extremely dark. There’s a video of one of the boys crying and hugging a man who is leading some sort of drum circle. It’s heartbreaking to watch because you can see the boy isn’t doing well under the care of these two women. There’s another picture of the same boy hugging a police officer at a protest that went viral. I believe the video was filmed a few weeks before the murder.
Atlanta show did a spoof episode and involved this case.