This is the way. I will often switch it up multiple times even in the same ritual. I used to think if I couldn't do it with my eyes open I was somehow "failing", but ultimately I've found that going with the flow is better.
Agree with other comment saying do however is most comfortable for you, either visualizing with them open or closed. I think practice with both might be worth while to explore, and could be utilized in different scenarios. I would say if I wanted to explicitly follow the instructions, I would keep my eyes closed the whole time, I don’t see anything in the instructions following “Close your eyes” that requires having them open.
Sure, they probably aren't an elite athlete or ballroom dancer, but if they've learned to walk without looking at their feet, they've at least developed it to some degree. One would have to be quite severely disabled not to be able to trace a simple five-pointed star without looking.
Plus, in reality, if it feels like they're doing it right, that's all that matters. Your arm could physically trace the Disney Channel logo, but as long as it's a pentagram in your mind, it's a pentagram.
This is a really common problem with books that include visualization exercises or guided meditations. I think that authors don’t consider that their readers are reading a book and haven’t memorized the scenario or don’t have someone reading it aloud to them.
Close your eyes just solidify the visualization then transfer that visualization to the present moment in front of you. Once you learned to visualize with your eyes open anything is possible.
Why are you still using GD? At one time it was the height of mainstream magic, but time has passed, and there are modern methods of magic that are more effective and simpler to implement. Modern magic is very different because now we know things that weren't known back then. GD is very dogmatic and elitist, with its "high magic" mentality (if it's not done exactly and meticulously, it doesn't work), and that's not how it is. In my opinion, if you're trying to deconstruct their paradigms to see how you can use them, perfect. But if you intend to use it the way they did, good luck.
what works for them doesn’t work for you. It’s the intent and exploration of the dream space that matters. How you get there and what happens when you do certain things, is completely subjective.
Look, what's your disrespect? Why do you care if I care? I'm just making a suggestion so that things move faster and you don't waste time on outdated systems.
Sorry, I thought what you said was disrespectful as people do still use GD, so I was only matching your disrespect. Your previous comment came off a little condescending. At the end of the day people should practice whatever they want to practice as long as they are not harming themselves and others.
I understand your confusion and you're right, I can sound like that and all that. I agree with what you said, exactly, because of the last point; there are people who urgently need an adjustment.
Just vhsualize however is most comfortable for you. Some people fond it easier to visualize with eyes closed, some not.
This is the way. I will often switch it up multiple times even in the same ritual. I used to think if I couldn't do it with my eyes open I was somehow "failing", but ultimately I've found that going with the flow is better.
this, moreover even some ppl have more a knack for seeing and skrying than others
This ⬆️
Agree with other comment saying do however is most comfortable for you, either visualizing with them open or closed. I think practice with both might be worth while to explore, and could be utilized in different scenarios. I would say if I wanted to explicitly follow the instructions, I would keep my eyes closed the whole time, I don’t see anything in the instructions following “Close your eyes” that requires having them open.
But it says I have to trace the line with my finger that’s why it’s confusing.
You don't have to see your finger to know where it is. It's called propriosception.
Not everyone has that developed, OP clearly is one of those people.
Sure, they probably aren't an elite athlete or ballroom dancer, but if they've learned to walk without looking at their feet, they've at least developed it to some degree. One would have to be quite severely disabled not to be able to trace a simple five-pointed star without looking.
Plus, in reality, if it feels like they're doing it right, that's all that matters. Your arm could physically trace the Disney Channel logo, but as long as it's a pentagram in your mind, it's a pentagram.
I meant developed as in improved, not developed as in exists.
Lmfao, yes, great analogy. :P
You visualize the line in the air so there's nothing "physical" for you to trace that you would need to see with your eyes.
It definitely means "In the air, trace your finger in this shape while imagining the shape and believing that your finger is tracing perfectly"
Not
"Trace the page or anything else perfectly with your finger."
You "see" magic with your imaginal, third eye, in the same space you dream.
Why is everyone downvoting lmao I’m just trying to understand.
This is a really common problem with books that include visualization exercises or guided meditations. I think that authors don’t consider that their readers are reading a book and haven’t memorized the scenario or don’t have someone reading it aloud to them.
Closing your eyes is a relaxation and centering technique, you open them before you do the invocations.
2nd this. Drawing and visualizing with open eyes brings the yetzirah energies into assiah helping to complete the circuit so to speak.
You can trace shapes with the point of your finger with your eyes closed? It's really easy.
Maybe imagine your hand and finger with your eyes closed while doing the movements.
Which book is this?
Goden Dawn Magic by the Ciceros.
Trust yourself You don't need help with this
I visualize better eyes open. It depends on you.
You just have to picture it in your mind's eye. Close your eyes, keep them open, do whatever you want as long as you SEE the triangle.
Close your eyes and visualize the light and triangle while your eyes are closed. This may be easier in a very dark room.
Close your eyes just solidify the visualization then transfer that visualization to the present moment in front of you. Once you learned to visualize with your eyes open anything is possible.
Why are you still using GD? At one time it was the height of mainstream magic, but time has passed, and there are modern methods of magic that are more effective and simpler to implement. Modern magic is very different because now we know things that weren't known back then. GD is very dogmatic and elitist, with its "high magic" mentality (if it's not done exactly and meticulously, it doesn't work), and that's not how it is. In my opinion, if you're trying to deconstruct their paradigms to see how you can use them, perfect. But if you intend to use it the way they did, good luck.
And Abracadabra
Why can’t they use whatever system they want? If that is what they are called to do, why do you care? At the end of the day do what thou wilt.
what works for them doesn’t work for you. It’s the intent and exploration of the dream space that matters. How you get there and what happens when you do certain things, is completely subjective.
Look, what's your disrespect? Why do you care if I care? I'm just making a suggestion so that things move faster and you don't waste time on outdated systems.
Sorry, I thought what you said was disrespectful as people do still use GD, so I was only matching your disrespect. Your previous comment came off a little condescending. At the end of the day people should practice whatever they want to practice as long as they are not harming themselves and others.
I understand your confusion and you're right, I can sound like that and all that. I agree with what you said, exactly, because of the last point; there are people who urgently need an adjustment.
What other systems do you suggest?
I suggest Chaos Magic; if it's literally just "do whatever works for you," then do what works.