They use a locking mechanism that can only be unlocked by a Bluetooth app on your phone. There is no physical key at all. Tonight I was trying to get into my apartment and it gave me errors because the app would not generate a new token. It was 25 degrees Fahrenheit and I had nowhere else to go. This is not the first time we have had issues with the app/lock either. This is such a scummy way for the apartment company to save a tiny bit of money.
Locksmith or window?
Is property manager on call?
Luckily after 10 minutes it was able to generate a new token
Isn’t technology wonderful!? I use an app on my phone to get in my apartment. I was told I could not get a physical key. I forgot my phone once and luckily the office was open.
They make locks with no physical backup? This seems awful! What if your phone is dead? I've only used my physical key once to test it, but it's still attached to my car fob as a backup.
Don't forget about the possibility of the battery in the lock dying or if it's hardwired the power going out. The only way in then is breaking in.
My apartment locks send a message to me when they're low on battery. They're designed to have the apartment replaced them, but the apartment won't do 'em.
Aaaaaannnddd the first time I have to pay to replace the battery, the whole lock is getting replaced and front desk is getting a backup key. You can reinstall your shitty pay to use lock when I move out. Absolutely ridiculous.
WHO even keep the original lock anyway ?
The 2 times I rent something, I put my lock on the door and put back theirs when I left.
Good luck getting your deposit back.
Just put their shitty auto lock back in when you move out?
I had an apartment do this kind of digital front lock but had a manual lock on the patio but wouldn’t issue a key. So I just replaced the tumbler and put theirs back when I moved out.
I'm glad I live in a place where I could tell the landlord to pound sand in this situation.
You'd get asked nicely to put the lock back on . Then you'd get a notice of perform or quit. You cant just change the appearance of the asset on your whim.
Counter argument: fuck you and your digital lock
Knowing how these usually happen, I would definitely get this message on the first week of a 2-month business trip.
they have locks now where you can hold a 9v battery and itll allow you to turn it on. Then you can replace the battery.
So instead of a key you need to remember your 9v battery...
Yeah it's pretty dumb. My combination keypad has 9V backup but I just keep the key for my other door on my keychain. The only place nearby that is open 24/7 that might sell 9v batteries is 7 Eleven and I'm not paying those prices. I just replace the batteries when the door lock starts beeping.
There are also these things called keys that don’t require batteries at all
Thankfully all you generally need to break into this is a sufficiently powerful magnet and/or a shim
I left those inside with my phone
Or someone decide that the next big Tiktok trend is to take high powered magnets to random devices to see which ones fail.
EDIT: fail meaning break or, in this case, malfunctioning and allowing access
I think it must be hardwired.
We have electronic doors on 2 of 3 entrances and it is very convenient to just press a button on a remote rather than messing with a key, especially in the dark.
A few months back we ran out of prepaid electricity over night and the online portal to buy more was down on multiple platforms. Husband had to go to the gas station down the street to buy more units and we were both so glad that we had that one normal lock to get in and out through.
On some of these there's a jumping point that you can access which allows you to plug a 9 volt battery into it which gives it enough power to lock/unlock. I don't see a way to do that on this one though.
Most locks which have no override keys, fail open (unlocked) in the case of power failure.
My apartment has these Salto locks but they gave us physical fobs. I think OPs landlord is just cheaping out.
They might have one just if your renting they might just decide not to give you one depending on what the laws are.
I have a feeling that these sorts of locks aren't actually thought about in the law aspect of it.
There will be one, it's just not handed out. Means you can revoke someone's access super easily. Also means there's no backup if shit goes down.
Imagine your fucking front door getting hacked.
People are
reta-exceptional. it's cool on paper but Jesus christ, imagine a lock having uneccesary points of failure.The app generates a code you can physically type into a number pad on the door handle.
The landlords just chose shitty "smart" doors. Any decent smart doors will have fingerprint, facial recognition , app access and physical key entry.
There was a power outage in my street a few years ago, a lot of people were waiting in the street due to the electronic locks not working 😓 Now I am reminded each time I see a modern all-connected apartment and know to flee
Its not the technology that is the problem. Its the neglect from the ones who created/programmed the technology. I 100% bet you OPs app uses a cloud to generate the "key" when it should be done locally on the device. This is just poor setup from whoever manages the system. But they don't care
Not to mention ... there should always be a backup key for something like this, FFS.
I mean, yeah. But having a backup key/physical key is less secure. Which yes, having more security comes with its risks. Thats the tradeoff
Yeah, but the chances that someone who wants to rob you will pick your lock (as opposed to just busting down the door or breaking a window) are astronomically small compared to the likelihood that you're gonna wind up in a situation like OP, or your phone will be dead, or the batteries in the thing died, or it just locked up for some damned reason or something.
As someone who works in tech, I will NEVER have a high tech version of an everyday item if I can avoid it. All of my appliances are analog, I have a 10 year old non-smart tv, and I’ll never get an app based lock.
I would like the same, but unfortunately I did not know my apartment management company could not give me a physical key.
It's great when you just want to get inside but you get a popup asking you to leave a review in the app store.
Isn’t the technology wonderful!? I use an app on Samsung fridge to get in my apartment and it shows ads while idle, I’m not sure how its meant to replace a key though.
I'd be pissed if my frige was showing ads...
I'm just wondering what you do if your phone is dead or stolen?
Or if there’s a power outage
Then you pull up a lock picking lawyer video and figure out how to bypass the lock within 20 seconds using only a paper clip.
But you don't have a phone and the power's out.
They normally have batteries.
I refuse to let posession of a working phone dictate getting in an apartment, using a car, using an email.
It is reckless to use a phone as a key.
As your only key.
I'd be fine with one that's got a key backup.
I mean you'd be just as screwed as if someone stole your backpack with your keys in it. And AFAIK your phone can still unlock doors if the battery is dead, at least that's what iPhones do. They reserve a tiny bit of battery just so they can very shortly wake up and unlock doors / cars.
I still hate digital locks like these and I would never install one. But it's not as bad as people think.
However, these digital locks come with entirely new attack vectors that nobody thinks of. What if there's a bug or a backdoor in the software? What if an attacker can just open the door by connecting to it via Bluetooth? I think I've even seen one of these locks that could be unlocked with a strong magnet, because to unlock the door, internally they just pulls a pin using an electromagnet if they receive the "correct password". So yeah, don't buy them.
Should still have insisted property Manager come out. They won’t change this until it inconveniences them.
Call them and tell them your phone ran out of power and you had to use your laptop to make the call. Inconvenience the heck out of them.
I'm so glad we changed something so inconvenient and cumbersome as a key to some more app based bullshit that just randomly doesn't work. this is exactly what I had in mind as a kid thinking of the wonders of the future of technology
Pay a script kiddie to unlock it.
Oops! Accidentally unlocked all the locks in the building.
I could see someone hacking into these and are useless in a power failure
Or emp, or if your phone dies.
Yea I'd want that changed or a payment for every unnecessary lock out.... 50 bucks for anything over 5 minutes of not being able to enter.....
Bet that shit would be a key in half a day
Also how is electric or internet only locks an okay thing for the Fire Marshall!? I wouldn't trust it at all
Let's get lockpicking lawyer on it
This is a bluetooth phone lock, it can be opened with a bluetooth phone lock
He showed a few locks that require chips and he often opens them with strong magnet
I guess it’s easier to make a shit lock so you don’t have to pay someone to lock someone out of their home when they are 3 milliseconds late on rent
"If I use technology to do it, it isn't breaking the law. That surely won't backfire!" -property manager, probably
In USA they have to have a court order
I mean yes but doesn’t stop them from trying to pull the “technical difficulties” card
Record everything
they might not actually violate the law, but could still gain an unfair advantage over the tenant if the tenant assumes they might!
i. e. "imma remove all my belongings before landlord locks me out illegally with his computer" and suddenly the landlord might have a chance to argue that you self-evicted. Or simply you will go much farther in finding alternative housing in the first place, and thus might be more likely to genuinely leave voluntarily - but still ultimately due to landlord implicitly threatening you with locking you out of your apartment illegally.
This is exactly the reason they are doing it of course - It makes it easier to lock out a tenant.
also if they require residents to use an app they have full control over who has access to the building as well as being able to track when people arrive/leave too. really fucked up. why do Americans allow this crap?
I really want to stay at your house intensifies
Hope people learn their lesson not to trust electric shit for important things.
Not having a manual key to unlock the door is just a terrible design choice. Oh, your phone broke? Just wait until you can buy a new one before going into your apartment, I don't understand what the problem is.
They actually do sell these with mechanical overrides, but the fact that they sell them without mechanical overrides, too, is incredibly stupid.
Also since the part they actually want to market is the electronic lock, the mechanical overrides are often very shitty and extremely easy to pick.
Some are laughably easy to pick
I mean the OP didn’t have a choice to be fair
Yeah, I fuckin love technology and I will still absolutely never voluntarily tolerate there being a barrier between me and my own bed which requires electricity to open/unlock. Not at all. Forget it needing WiFi/Bluetooth etc.
If the power is out or a battery somewhere is dead, I don't want to be locked out, and I don't want my door swinging open.
There is a reason why physical locks and keys have been the method of choice for securing your shit for more than two thousand years. We got them right, and they just keep working.
I like the idea of stuff like this, but to me, there should always be a manual option for when the power/internet is out.
I’d be willing to bet if you pried off that Bluetooth cap there’d still be a manual lock under it but most likely only the landlord has the keys for it
Not electric, but shit requiring an app. Never buy devices working only with shitty app.
There are reliable electronic locks. This is just a shitty cheap one
the only reliable lock is good old analog no electronic bs crap
I dunno, I've had to get out of bed at 1AM to go deal with a broken regular old deadbolt more than once. Jokes aside, anything electronic should also have a key override IMO in care of electronic failure.
Something only a person who never had a lock jam could say.
Locks are just generally unreliable, the one in the picture is just a really bad electronic one,
They won't and we will all be punished for it.
There IS a physical key card, you should demand a copy of it
Ok that makes way more sense. Key card in the wallet, phone as back up. Maybe a small one attached to the car keys.
Have you experienced this lock in particular or are you just making assumptions?
My apartment has an electric lock with a pin-code for example. There is absolutely no physical key. I have to carry around a D battery in my backpack incase the batteries die (there are connection points on the bottom for a D battery) or I'm SOL and would need the fire department to break in through the balcony
Salto door locks can use RFID cards, key fobs, and digital key with the app. https://saltosystems.com/en/products/xs4-original-plus-din/
Fair enough just asking, and hating my door lock more and more every day
The little "signal" icon indicates RFID
My car has a sticker on it that lets me into the apartment. Pretty cool and convenient until my car breaks down and I borrow my moms for a few days and have to use the app to get in, because they disabled my old keycard, and the app requires wifi so i have to sit outside of the garage in my car for 4 minutes every time i get home waiting for my phone to connect to the buildings wifi while outside of the building
The way things are heading, in a couple of years your toilet paper hanger will need a wifi connection to work.
"You are fined one credit for a violation of the verbal-morality statute."
Good thing i live in a house where we just stick it next to the sink
that already exists if I remember correctly
Or toilet paper dispdnsers, soap, water faucet, will serve ads, may even force eye contact on screen before disoensing.
That or a paid subscription, using the app that spies on you and sells your data, including to the government that buys all data broker info and uses it without warrant or judicial oversight, or ability to challenge in court as they find other ways they supposedly learn stuff, never citing the 4th ammenfment violation info.
That's when you call your landlord to open it for you.
Call them and tell them it looks like somebody threw a brick through the window.
$50 unlock fee?
If only they invented a key like object to unlock the door without technology
I'm never understand ppl who choose the "convenience" of tech like this over the simplicity of stuff like a damn key.
Shit like this can happen. Lost or broke your phone? Guess you're not coming home or maybe it's fine & the "smart" lock & app decide to be dumb.
It poses a legitimate security risk. It isn't hard to get past systems like this. At least with a physical lock they either need to know how to defeat a lock or kick in a door. With these "smart" locks if you're tech savvy enough you can figure out how to open a door with 0 physical force.
In this case the apartment owners get kickback from the company, that's why they do it. Last apartment I lived at had these, though it also had physical access. But that place would sell your data to everyone who asked.
Access your apartment - an app
Do your laundry - need an app
Paying rent - another app
Couldn't even call the office for anything because the phone number directed to call center in a completely different state, then they would maybe, possibly, pass the message on.
Finally snapped when we were moving out and they signed us up for all these random companies to "ease our move". Only the leasing agent that signed us up for it could remove us from the list. Lost my damn mind.
Do you know the owners behind this management company?
Wondering if private equity. They disguise ownerships so you would probably not know. Blackstone is a big one, spun off from black rock, but there are so many large chiseling investment groups in on it now.
Back in 2018 15 percent of residential properties were bought by large investment groups, probably way higher now, look at the prices side by side with those parasites getting involved, definite correlation, and causation.
the Lock Picking Lawyer on youtube occasionally does videos on these sorts of electronic locks. Some of them are comically insecure, where you can just pry off a little plastic cover to reveal screws that will let you dismantle the lock from the outside.
To be fair watching his videos you learn quickly how insecure any lock really is but these electronic ones are by far some of the worst.
Nobody is choosing this bullshit, it's being forced upon us.
Also, what if you're being stalked by someone?
So if your phone dies while you're out, you're just homeless?
Yes, but you still have to pay rent.
I'm a huge fan of smart locks and keyless entry. However, I ALWAYS have a back up plan and multiple ways to open a lock. App on phone, number password, physical key in a key safe hidden on the property etc.
This the dumbest shit I ever heard of.. not you OP the idiots that made the locks and the idiots who bought them lol. ( Apt complex company )
In a lot of jurisdictions, tenants have the right to change the lock on their apartment.
Luckily there's no way this could go wrong in any way during some kind of outage.
lol
all non key locks are hilarious in that they are NOT harder to falsify entry and are never more convient
This is why you never trust technology with your safety without a backup.
It’s probably called a “smart” lock.
Sometimes the non tech way is the best way
A Bluetooth lock?! That’s the dumbest fucking thing ever invented, and that’s really saying something.
All you need is a powerful magnet to open it
Well that's even worse!
How so?
Normal lock operates on mechanical principal , by putting in a key, pins gets aligned which can physically turn the lock open/close. Without that key, this lock relying on electronic components and they're vulnerable to manipulation
A few years ago, the apartment complex I lived in changed all the locks to keyless ones that could take either Bluetooth with your phone or a keypad. One night my partner and I got home really late and it was like -10°F. The lock wouldn't work. It started to open a tiny bit, then jammed and you could hear the little motor inside just grinding away. Had to call emergency mantenance to get it open. They were quick but it was still way too long standing out on a 3rd floor landing in that weather.
Oh hell no. If that shit is on my front door, I am straight away replacing it with an actual keyed lock. I'll put the stupid electronic one back when I move out.
What the hell is wrong with keys
You can use a badge or fob with Salto. Mobile credentials probably cost more for them too. What do you do if your phone dies before you get home?
what happens during an electrical blackout?
Your Social Score is too low.
How is technology that relies on power saving money?
Edit: Not directed at you OP, genuinely curious how the property manager thought this was better
And what will you do if your phone battery is dead? Or you lost it? You need another way to enter your apartment.
This sucks.
I have a smart lock.
It's got a pincode option, fob, fingerprint scanner, app, or physical key option.
I don't need to carry a key these days however I have a physical key safely stored. Should there be an electronic issue sometime down the line as sadly, things will fail eventually.
If it's one key, it might be safer tucked away into your wallet or something instead of "safely stored".. cuz it sounds like someone could gain access by locating your key.
They would need to know what the key is and what the lock it matches. It's not like a key hidden under a rock or mat.
WHY WOOULD ONE EVEN USE BLUETOOTH FOR SOMETHING LIKE THAT ?!
Because the tenants inability to enter is not their problem.
And they get the benefit of changing the locks whenever they want.
Basically fuck you it makes my life easier.
Im done. Bluetooth lock? Wifi washer dryer? Screens on fridges. Can we just fucking get products that work. Who is asking for this shit? Who wants all this automatic shit and tech shit that sounds neat until it doesnt work. Jesus im so tired of this tech hungry planet when we had shot that worked fucking decades ago. Stop. Please stop buying this shit.
Bluetooth lock seems really hackable.
Because it is
Giving this some extra thought, people that can pick locks are probably more common than people that can hack Bluetooth. Maybe Bluetooth is a better play.
No worry, my apartment has a keypad lock and that also doesn’t work. Locked out in the cold many times.
welcome to the future of everything
I would hate to rely on Bluetooth for safety
Something tells me they aren't only NOT saving money, but actually charging tenants MORE for such innovation.
Honestly, I'm working with a client in Florida rn that is swapping over to BT locks.
I have them still making physical cards via the encoder to prevent this from ever happening. This prevents you having to rely on tokens.
Redundancy isn't cheap but its work it.
Hell to the no. There's no way any type of lock that is on a bluetooth app is secure.
Electronic locks are absolutely stupid af. You can buy any cheap $20 door lock/handle and it lasts for 50 years without thinking about it but these electric locks are nothing but problems. I think they make the driver for the latch intentionally weak so someone doesn't get their hand smashed in it or something but it never has enough power to go into the hole unless your alignment is absolutely flawless. And even if it is flawless they still malfunction and run out of batteries constantly
The future is now old man!
My last apartment had a similar thing. One day the lock companies servers went down and I could no longer get in. Luckily I was leaving when I noticed this and it was fixed when I got back, but it took like at least half an hour iirc
What happened to good old keys?
There's going to be actual fobs or cards you can use for these, I would bring this up with others that live there. Having this as an option- ok. But having to rely on it when tech fails you is garbage. Or very least see if you can buy a supported format for those salto locks on eBay maybe and tell them to add the format and number to the controller for your profile
My phone is dead almost every single night I get home from work. I would have kicked in this door ages ago.
Enshittified..... entering your house. Fucking outstanding.
Probably kept trying to connect to someone's refrigerator. Reminds me of my Bluetooth headphones that want to connect to every device except my phone
uuknb v b .. .
I'd just break it apart with a rock personally, then look at apartments online to plan my escape from dystopian hell
I've never seen a "smart" lock before that didn't still just let you use your regular key
You can break into your own leased property if locked out. It can be contested civily but it is not criminal although I do not doubt some cops would arrest you anyway. But I know someone thst has broken in their own place before, had to look up legalities. Kicked in a door.
I don't get it. Why not just use a physical key? That is just stupid to have instead of a physical lock.
This is a terrible idea for a locking mechanism. I wouldn't stand for it at all.
Why would anyone need a smart lock for their own front door??? Just carry a key like people have already done for hundreds of years. All this over reliance on tech has really screwed humanity with the way things are going now.
Thank god I have a size 12 master key for doors.
I was thinking the same shit lol
Right? Or an old credit card and shimmy the door open that way.
This is an electric deadbolt, but yeah, or that usually
Electric deadbolt? Hold up let me grab a 1200 grain ECT from my man purse.
Sneak in through the window choom
He wants you blue too
My current apartment uses rfid tags. I work nights and have been locked out of my own place 3 times in the year and a half I’ve lived there. I never wanna hear “oh the battery in your lock died” ever again
A physical key is very much a sticking point for wherever I move to next year.
oof, i used these for my work and they DO NOT work. the locks are pretty outdated. They can be keyed to NFC cards, so im pretty sure if you put pressure on your property manager they can give you a card
I have one of these too and I don’t understand them AT ALL. Sure, people lose keys, but a key has like, one purpose and tends to do it quite well! 9 times out of 10 I have to restart the app or reconnect to wifi or try several different hand positions before I can get my seemingly efficient bluetooth lock to open. And god forbid something happen to my phone! At least keys are relatively easy to replace. What am I expected to do if I get mugged or my phone breaks or something? Even if it dies before I get home? Who thinks of this shit?
This is astronomically bad design choice. There's literally no reason to have a blue tooth lock. Just have a normal key hole.
How the ever living fuck would a fire Marshall allow a lock without key override?
Guess it means the doors are also shit enough to wedge open quickly.
Just wait until we get the new AI locks!
Wow we now have doors with bugs
We Are!!
Electrical locks are stupid. It's even more stupid if there is no physical key that works
Penn State?
Haha! This is why you have the technology work for you, not you work for the technology.
My building has an app you use to unlock the door, but the app also provides a personalized 6 digit code you can physically type in if you want, which never changes. The code is way more convenient that dealing with the app all the time, and it sucks you don't have that option.
Is there an office for the apartment complex on site? Can you walk into said office? If Bluetooth is required to even access the office, is there a large window that you could walk through after smashing said window with your brick/rock?
Seriously, let management know that this is unacceptable and it needs to change. If it doesn't change and happens again, don't wait. Call the management company and the police. You're paying to live there, you need to be able to get in.
And what do people do that don't have a mobile device? I don't have a cell phone myself.
I just thought about this for a minute but op you should hide a charging cable somewhere in the rare case your phone is dead when you arrive.
Sorry OP, this is on you. you leased a property that could reject access at a moments notice without your say.
Why in the fuck would you rent from a place with locks like this?
It happened to me in my first apartment I got on my own. I broke the door down and sent in a maintenance request. They tried to make me pay but I just said “no, you shouldn’t have locked me out of my apartment.” And then my unit was the only unit with a physical key from then on
Which product/app is that? I've had a Yale Connexis on my door for years without a problem, apart from the time I let the battery run out while I was away... oops.
There must be an AI for that /s
With just those two pictures someone could easily find where ya live, OP. Just sayin
Is that not a keyhole at the top?
Bet they don’t give those to tenants.
you're uhhh...kinda doxxing yourself