I actually tried for a solid bit to make a similar “the Afternoon Streets but with dementia” based on this theme when Dawntrail came out. Couldn’t quite make it work how I wanted
Frankly, for all of Dawntrail's narrative faults in the base MSQ, Living Memory made me feel much more melancholic than either Amaurot or Ultima Thule. They handled the vibes really well.
Same. I think because it felt so much more relatable to me: a place where your loved ones could go after they passed on, and the idea of being able to see the again hit hard.
And I feel like I'm one of the 0.5% who didn't like the 2nd half of DT - Living Memory felt like a blur from me
It also didn't help that I live nearby a Venice knock-off gimmick place and my distaste for it bled over Living Memory. I barely remember Graha Tia monologuing on the gondola lol
We reached this zone on the one year anniversary of our grandmother's passing. We all had to stop for the night after a certain conversation. A wonderful conversation! But yeowch ;A;
I firmly believe the final zones of each expac are a theme park of varying quality.
In Heavensward, it was Tomorrowland, but the problem was it had been out of business for 10,000 years or so. Still, a lot of the attractions still worked. We had to break down the fence with Cid’s car to get in.
Then in Stormblood we headed over to The Mad King’s Family Waterpark… which was also out of business since the Garleans took over. The salt water system they used to stop algae growing was completely out of control. 1 and 1/2 stars at best.
The next one was great though. A scale model of a retro-futuristic New York some old guy built in his basement! At like 5x scale, too! He even had simulated people set up running around in it. Unfortunately he was all ‘this is private property’ and ‘you’re trespassing’ and ‘Eight Rejoining’ so we had to kill him. Still go back there every so often though.
The next one suuuucked. DepressionLand, the most existentially terrible place in the universe. Each park charged admission, one or two souls of a loved one per park. And they were all kinda grey and dingy, and the mascots all wanted to die. So we talked to the manager and got a refund. Then we killed the manager.
Not gonna lie, first time I got there I was like "omg, it's Amaurot/Ultima Thule all over again", but I've learned to appreciate it over time, especially after my second DT playthrough.
Also, I was really happy when it was restored in 7.3.
I hope they won't end next expansion with another depression "everyone is already gone" zone. I'm not saying it's a bad trope but 3 times in a row is a bit much. I'm really starting to think that writers really have no other ideas.
It wasn't for me. I'm glad there are people who like it. I loved all of Dawntrail's zones except this one. In fact I think it's my least favorite in the entire game.
Shaaloani is my least favorite for being such a letdown for the western theme. Living memory is a nice zone, but narratively i didn't care by that point.
I do kind of have some mixed feelings cos it so clearly felt like it was trying to recapture the magic of when you first saw Amaurot for the first time at the Tempest.
But part of what made Amaurot work so well was that they teased it in the narrative by showing the old ruins in the Tempest, so when you see the city unveiled, it looks all the more impressive. Living Memory didn't have that because of one key reason: Solution 9. Because we already toured Solution 9 beforehand, seeing another high-tech city, just in a yellow colour rather than purple, did kind of feel a little less special.
IMO maybe they could have made the final zone Alexandria or something. Have it such that Everkeep was the only part that got sent to the Source, and the "City of Gold" was Alexandria on the 9th reflection, enduring against the lightning calamity thanks to a barrier shield that gave the city a golden ambience.
7.4 spoiler
In the end, there really was a city on the 9th that was still around, enduring against the lightning calamity thanks to a barrier shield... it just wasn't Alexandria.
Personally I wasn't a huge fan of the aesthetic of Piss City and thought it dragged on for a bit *too* long, but it did have two of the best story moments in the entire expac.
the place is both visually- and literally- soulless. it has the same 'dead behind the eyes' uncanny valley effect that places like many casinos and amusement parks give me in real life. It's a shine put on a horrible abomination, where souls are drained to create mockeries of the dead out of their extracted memories, forever playing out a pantomime of the life they once had in a cold, shallow environment. Nothing there feels real- it's all a set dressing so an AI that has long gone mad can pretend it's still fulfilling its purpose by playing with what is spiritually the mutilated remains of the people it was supposed to protect, making a grotesque mockery of their memories.
The entire place turns my stomach. I could not wait to shut that monstrosity down, and was constantly confused by the NPCs acting all sad that it was a necessity. I'm also immensely disappointed that we turned it back on later.
Who are you to determine who is valid to live and who is a hollow mockery? The people there had thoughts, memories, could discuss things, make plans, and feel emotions.
There's no pretending, the people there did exist at some point on a scale of consciousness and existence. Didn't you get the sense you were missing something when you were constantly confused that all the NPCs were acting differently than you expected?
It's not a set dressing, fake, or a pantomime. It's supposed to be inherently strange and uncanny, but not because they're all not real. It's because they're persisting after their death, which is inherently unnatural. They're real in the way that people exist after their death when they're discussed. They're real as memories, maybe even moreso. But when the choice comes to sustaining the dead, needing an increasing amount of energy to do so, versus letting them pass on, accepting the loss, and letting go for new people, the choice had to be made, everyone understood it. That's why it's supposed to be a sad moment.
Sphene/Preservation isn't inherently wrong, as neither is Emet-Selch, but in both cases, exterminating an entire race for a grand scheme just doesn't work for us.
I feel like there's a lot of nuance around the transhumanism concepts that some people don't fully consider or want to think about. I'm not trying to convince you, but this is my interpretation as I was going through it, and why I and many others love the area and section, at least.
Interesting. I can definitely see where you're coming from. Though to me, those elements are part of what makes the area so interesting. I enjoy IRL theme parks for similar reasons. The uncanny facade is evocative in an interesting way to me. Same with malls, casinos, and other very "artificial" places. I think the things that make them kinda uncanny are what make them neat.
"All this time, it was here - the city of gold."
I do love Dawntrail's take on the city of gold and how they worked it into the lore
When I first got there I was like "This reminds me of Twilight Town"
Yeah, and the music hella sounds like twilight town too, with heavy use of the oboe
Especially the live version of Twilight Town's theme
Also: Oboe! Thank you! I've been trying to figure out what it was!
I actually tried for a solid bit to make a similar “the Afternoon Streets but with dementia” based on this theme when Dawntrail came out. Couldn’t quite make it work how I wanted
Just be careful reading comments or anything, don't let yourself get spoiled
Frankly, for all of Dawntrail's narrative faults in the base MSQ, Living Memory made me feel much more melancholic than either Amaurot or Ultima Thule. They handled the vibes really well.
Same. I think because it felt so much more relatable to me: a place where your loved ones could go after they passed on, and the idea of being able to see the again hit hard.
Idk, Ultima Thule still makes me feel that way.
Close in the Distance is an instafeels from me
And I feel like I'm one of the 0.5% who didn't like the 2nd half of DT - Living Memory felt like a blur from me
It also didn't help that I live nearby a Venice knock-off gimmick place and my distaste for it bled over Living Memory. I barely remember Graha Tia monologuing on the gondola lol
I cried on each quarter of the zone, it hits pretty damned hard.
If you lost someone close to you then you are gonna be torn up by the time you finish this zone. It's rough. Really rough. Just a warning.
My grandpa had passed the same month I got to the latter half of dt. Strange the gameplay got so blurry
Lost my dad around the time of Endwalker and these last two expansions have been absolutely brutal because of that
We reached this zone on the one year anniversary of our grandmother's passing. We all had to stop for the night after a certain conversation. A wonderful conversation! But yeowch ;A;
I had to stop playing the msq for a bit, between EW and the second half of DT, ugh-- skipped some cutscenes, enjoyed Treno, and am now up to current.
I've capped my 2000 A-Ranks for Dawntrail achievement, but I always end up jumping on a hunt train just to admire the scenery. It's so beautiful.
Yay! DeadneyLand!
I firmly believe the final zones of each expac are a theme park of varying quality.
In Heavensward, it was Tomorrowland, but the problem was it had been out of business for 10,000 years or so. Still, a lot of the attractions still worked. We had to break down the fence with Cid’s car to get in.
Then in Stormblood we headed over to The Mad King’s Family Waterpark… which was also out of business since the Garleans took over. The salt water system they used to stop algae growing was completely out of control. 1 and 1/2 stars at best.
The next one was great though. A scale model of a retro-futuristic New York some old guy built in his basement! At like 5x scale, too! He even had simulated people set up running around in it. Unfortunately he was all ‘this is private property’ and ‘you’re trespassing’ and ‘Eight Rejoining’ so we had to kill him. Still go back there every so often though.
The next one suuuucked. DepressionLand, the most existentially terrible place in the universe. Each park charged admission, one or two souls of a loved one per park. And they were all kinda grey and dingy, and the mascots all wanted to die. So we talked to the manager and got a refund. Then we killed the manager.
DeadneyLand though? DeadneyLand is nice.
At least we’re able to liven up DepressionLand later with a coffee shop…
Not gonna lie, first time I got there I was like "omg, it's Amaurot/Ultima Thule all over again", but I've learned to appreciate it over time, especially after my second DT playthrough.
Also, I was really happy when it was restored in 7.3.
Same
Congrats! Hope you enjoy.
Prepare for heavy (non-stop) emotional damage.
I hope they won't end next expansion with another depression "everyone is already gone" zone. I'm not saying it's a bad trope but 3 times in a row is a bit much. I'm really starting to think that writers really have no other ideas.
It wasn't for me. I'm glad there are people who like it. I loved all of Dawntrail's zones except this one. In fact I think it's my least favorite in the entire game.
Shaaloani is my least favorite for being such a letdown for the western theme. Living memory is a nice zone, but narratively i didn't care by that point.
I do kind of have some mixed feelings cos it so clearly felt like it was trying to recapture the magic of when you first saw Amaurot for the first time at the Tempest.
But part of what made Amaurot work so well was that they teased it in the narrative by showing the old ruins in the Tempest, so when you see the city unveiled, it looks all the more impressive. Living Memory didn't have that because of one key reason: Solution 9. Because we already toured Solution 9 beforehand, seeing another high-tech city, just in a yellow colour rather than purple, did kind of feel a little less special.
IMO maybe they could have made the final zone Alexandria or something. Have it such that Everkeep was the only part that got sent to the Source, and the "City of Gold" was Alexandria on the 9th reflection, enduring against the lightning calamity thanks to a barrier shield that gave the city a golden ambience.
7.4 spoiler
In the end, there really was a city on the 9th that was still around, enduring against the lightning calamity thanks to a barrier shield... it just wasn't Alexandria.
Personally I wasn't a huge fan of the aesthetic of Piss City and thought it dragged on for a bit *too* long, but it did have two of the best story moments in the entire expac.
I try not to yuck anyone else's yum, but people who genuinely like Living Memory seriously confuse me. I'm happy you can enjoy it tho.
What's confusing about it?
the place is both visually- and literally- soulless. it has the same 'dead behind the eyes' uncanny valley effect that places like many casinos and amusement parks give me in real life. It's a shine put on a horrible abomination, where souls are drained to create mockeries of the dead out of their extracted memories, forever playing out a pantomime of the life they once had in a cold, shallow environment. Nothing there feels real- it's all a set dressing so an AI that has long gone mad can pretend it's still fulfilling its purpose by playing with what is spiritually the mutilated remains of the people it was supposed to protect, making a grotesque mockery of their memories.
The entire place turns my stomach. I could not wait to shut that monstrosity down, and was constantly confused by the NPCs acting all sad that it was a necessity. I'm also immensely disappointed that we turned it back on later.
Who are you to determine who is valid to live and who is a hollow mockery? The people there had thoughts, memories, could discuss things, make plans, and feel emotions.
There's no pretending, the people there did exist at some point on a scale of consciousness and existence. Didn't you get the sense you were missing something when you were constantly confused that all the NPCs were acting differently than you expected?
It's not a set dressing, fake, or a pantomime. It's supposed to be inherently strange and uncanny, but not because they're all not real. It's because they're persisting after their death, which is inherently unnatural. They're real in the way that people exist after their death when they're discussed. They're real as memories, maybe even moreso. But when the choice comes to sustaining the dead, needing an increasing amount of energy to do so, versus letting them pass on, accepting the loss, and letting go for new people, the choice had to be made, everyone understood it. That's why it's supposed to be a sad moment.
Sphene/Preservation isn't inherently wrong, as neither is Emet-Selch, but in both cases, exterminating an entire race for a grand scheme just doesn't work for us.
I feel like there's a lot of nuance around the transhumanism concepts that some people don't fully consider or want to think about. I'm not trying to convince you, but this is my interpretation as I was going through it, and why I and many others love the area and section, at least.
quite the wall of text, but in a quick glance I saw 'emet selch wasn't inherently wrong', so I can safely ignore the rest.
So, you’re saying that they succeded with this zone?
No. the game clearly wanted me to be attached to that horrendous place and feel conflicted about shutting it down. I absolutely was not.
Interesting. I can definitely see where you're coming from. Though to me, those elements are part of what makes the area so interesting. I enjoy IRL theme parks for similar reasons. The uncanny facade is evocative in an interesting way to me. Same with malls, casinos, and other very "artificial" places. I think the things that make them kinda uncanny are what make them neat.
I understand that it is a taste thing. I was merely commenting that this particular taste is quite confusing to my bran.
Yeah, I wasn't trying to argue, just sharing my perspective. I appreciate you sharing yours :)
*insert Kirstoff/Anya gif "I'm gonna tell him"