Because it's actually a duo bossfight and not two single mobs put in the same arena with separated AIs like every duo bossfight in ER. Another good example is demon in pain + demon from below in ds3, they haven't made any other good ones.
The way they alternate between one another and the second phase being influenced by which one you kill second is such a cool mechanic, my favourite duo in all souls
I dont understand why everyone thinks this. Yes the sevond phase is true but they absolutely do not alternate between each other, smough is so big he gets stuck on the pillars which gives the illusion of him being "slower" and them "tag teaming" but thatd not the case at all. I've completed the game a few times so this is just purely from my observations
I always wondered why O&S felt way more fun to fight than most other duo bosses and that's absolutely it. Actually feels like you're fighting a team who compliment each other.
When I get to O&S I always feel like "LET'S FUCKING GO!" whereas a lot of others in the series is more "ok let's get this over with"
I feel you on this. Unfortunately it's because of the "difficult boss arms race" that's going on. Who can make the hardest boss? It being good is not relevant to the goal.
Seriously O&S is so well designed Ornstein is more mobile so he'll get to you first and chase you down leaving Smough behind so you're left alone with him. And Smough is big enough to block Ornstein and the pillars can help to block and separate them too. If your positioning is good you'll only ever gave to fight one at a time.
It's so well designed, that Ornstein gets stuck behind Smough when doing the flying attack, but then continues to fly in place until Smough's hitbox allows him to leash, letting Ornstein get a free hit in (will he unleash and go straight at you, so you need to roll immediately, or will he go sideways, then 90 degrees. Who knows! Guess wrong and free hit). Also, Smough's hammer can shove Ornstein around, but Ornstein can poke through Smough. Why? Who knows! Design!
That fight had chance of being great, but phase 1 needed a lot more bug testing.
They do feel like two single mobs put in the same arena? How do they complement each other? Smough is as fast as Ornstein lol. Only difference to Godskin Duo is that they’re much much much simpler mechanically.
Demon Prince is in another stratosphere compared to O&S. They actually complement each other. One Demon will always be passive while the others aggressive. Or they’ll both be aggressive briefly.
my guy, have you seen ornstein's smooth criminal glide attack, that shit comes at you like a torpedo, hits you and then jumps backwards to the middle of the room, smough can charge at you but not that far
O&S are very different in a way the Godskin Duo aren’t. The GD are pretty much the same enemy, except one has a twirly twinblade which he only brings out now and again, and the other can turn himself into a doughnut.
At least O&S have substantially different styles. I’d say each of them has more personality too.
Agreed. O&S are tough enough but we're absolutely designed to be fought at the same time. I think since the noble and pillar were designed as individual bosses.It makes them tougher to fight when combined. That or maybe i've just memorized smoan ornstein.After thirteen years but can't get the hang of the godskin duo after four years heheh
Ever since my first playthrough I've been confused with how some people find O&S overly hard. Of course they're difficult, they're a DS boss, but they give you everything to beat them.
Godskin duo was just stressful and didn't feel rewarding to beat, just felt like I got lucky that time.
Eh honestly I think they’re probably the hardest boss in ds1. I can mostly no-hit artorius, manus, etc. playing clean with O+S usually takes forever to get good openings.
As a veteran with NG+6 playthoughs, its hardest in a later NG+ cycle if you go for Smough first instead of the easier Ornstein to get Ornstein's fancy armour.
I get lucky sometimes when Ornstein randomly derps himself on a wall or pillar so i can land those greedy hits on Smough.Theres a very, very narrow attack and clean escape window from stunlock death even if you separate them well as Ornstein gets more aggressive the closer you get to Smough and likes to punish you if you dare land a hit on Smough.
Because it's actually a duo bossfight and not two single mobs put in the same arena with separated AIs like every duo bossfight in ER. Another good example is demon in pain + demon from below in ds3, they haven't made any other good ones.
The way they alternate between one another and the second phase being influenced by which one you kill second is such a cool mechanic, my favourite duo in all souls
I dont understand why everyone thinks this. Yes the sevond phase is true but they absolutely do not alternate between each other, smough is so big he gets stuck on the pillars which gives the illusion of him being "slower" and them "tag teaming" but thatd not the case at all. I've completed the game a few times so this is just purely from my observations
Ah, I just noticed that I didn't specify, I was talking about the demon princes lol
Oh my bad lmao. I totally agree in terms of demon princes. Demon Princes is what O&S wants to be
I always wondered why O&S felt way more fun to fight than most other duo bosses and that's absolutely it. Actually feels like you're fighting a team who compliment each other.
When I get to O&S I always feel like "LET'S FUCKING GO!" whereas a lot of others in the series is more "ok let's get this over with"
I feel you on this. Unfortunately it's because of the "difficult boss arms race" that's going on. Who can make the hardest boss? It being good is not relevant to the goal.
I'm looking at you Consort motherfucker.
Seriously O&S is so well designed Ornstein is more mobile so he'll get to you first and chase you down leaving Smough behind so you're left alone with him. And Smough is big enough to block Ornstein and the pillars can help to block and separate them too. If your positioning is good you'll only ever gave to fight one at a time.
It's so well designed, that Ornstein gets stuck behind Smough when doing the flying attack, but then continues to fly in place until Smough's hitbox allows him to leash, letting Ornstein get a free hit in (will he unleash and go straight at you, so you need to roll immediately, or will he go sideways, then 90 degrees. Who knows! Guess wrong and free hit). Also, Smough's hammer can shove Ornstein around, but Ornstein can poke through Smough. Why? Who knows! Design!
That fight had chance of being great, but phase 1 needed a lot more bug testing.
They do feel like two single mobs put in the same arena? How do they complement each other? Smough is as fast as Ornstein lol. Only difference to Godskin Duo is that they’re much much much simpler mechanically.
Demon Prince is in another stratosphere compared to O&S. They actually complement each other. One Demon will always be passive while the others aggressive. Or they’ll both be aggressive briefly.
my guy, have you seen ornstein's smooth criminal glide attack, that shit comes at you like a torpedo, hits you and then jumps backwards to the middle of the room, smough can charge at you but not that far
My favorite boss fight in DS will always be Artorias.
fighting him rn
O&S are very different in a way the Godskin Duo aren’t. The GD are pretty much the same enemy, except one has a twirly twinblade which he only brings out now and again, and the other can turn himself into a doughnut.
At least O&S have substantially different styles. I’d say each of them has more personality too.
O&S lets you breathe while the foreskin duo gang bangs you
Godskin duo aren’t the same enemy lol. They share exactly one attack.
Agreed. O&S are tough enough but we're absolutely designed to be fought at the same time. I think since the noble and pillar were designed as individual bosses.It makes them tougher to fight when combined. That or maybe i've just memorized smoan ornstein.After thirteen years but can't get the hang of the godskin duo after four years heheh
Where did all the O&S haters come from? We are not doing this revisionist bs
Totally agree ☺️ O&S are so great
I’m a sucker for “equal” fights like against Artorias where it’s just two really powerful guys fighting it out but O+S is definitely a close second.
O&S and simply easier.
Godskin Duo is genuinely my least favourite boss in like all Souls games. Just bullshit.
And you have to fight them more than once.
I play on PTDE so O is bugged and sometimes it's funny and sometimes like when I did a endurance only knight starting gear only build its a nightmare.
Godskin duo is only good in nightreign, I didn’t bother and decided to just get on with it by summoning an OP player who soloed them
Ever since my first playthrough I've been confused with how some people find O&S overly hard. Of course they're difficult, they're a DS boss, but they give you everything to beat them.
Godskin duo was just stressful and didn't feel rewarding to beat, just felt like I got lucky that time.
Eh honestly I think they’re probably the hardest boss in ds1. I can mostly no-hit artorius, manus, etc. playing clean with O+S usually takes forever to get good openings.
As a veteran with NG+6 playthoughs, its hardest in a later NG+ cycle if you go for Smough first instead of the easier Ornstein to get Ornstein's fancy armour.
I get lucky sometimes when Ornstein randomly derps himself on a wall or pillar so i can land those greedy hits on Smough.Theres a very, very narrow attack and clean escape window from stunlock death even if you separate them well as Ornstein gets more aggressive the closer you get to Smough and likes to punish you if you dare land a hit on Smough.
eh Arty is kinda humbling me at the moment