when my ex left, I self-esteem was at its lowest. Later, I realized it was not me - it was her insecurity and past wounds, mixed with my own upbringings and the dynamics between us.
Looking back, it actually follows the pattern in this graphic really well. I don’t want to dismiss that this chart errs on the side of over-simplifying, but it summarizes the situation really well.
That is why so many of us are left confused, blaming ourselves, and suffering severe emotional tolls.
Sadly, often it is the victims who end up in therapy. SMH
I disagree with the "discard" part of the diagram. While this does happen in some relationships, it is not the case for the majority. For most of the abusers the relationship is about power and control, which they will want to keep rather than end the relationship. This does a good job though of highlighting the aspects of how the survivor is feeling throughout the abuse.
Totally agree - not every abusive relationship ends in discard; most continue because the abusers wants to maintain control.
I agree. I divorced my abusive ex and he refused to move out until he could find another victim.
He liked the cycle of abuse and didn’t want me to end our relationship. Thankfully he was finally able to move on but he’s doing it to someone else now.
I'm glad you are out.
Thank you. Me too.
What happens when there's no one to abuse?
I don’t know. I was a victim.
100% agree. The discard by my former partner was a direct result of my detachment having spotted the pattern. In the meantime, I have raised 3 kids alone. They were also discarded.
Her mother on the other hand, has had the same partner for 40 years, but is basically the same person. The partner in that case seems simply willing to accept the abuse. He is completely selective in what he sees, hears, tells and mentally processes.
Yes, they select what they want to believe. That is another common trait: a lack of empathy. Was someone in his immediate family an abuser he was victimized by?
I couldn't tell you, but it's entirely possible. It was/is his 2nd marriage. He's also a German, about 75 years old. Presumably his parents were war involved/denialists. But he's still in the marriage. His wife is no less of a toxic narcissist than her daughter/my ex.
He's an intelligent guy otherwise. But he has the blinders on with all of this. But willfully so. He sees it deep down.
Discard is not just about leaving the relationship.
Discard is a relative thing, you are usually kept around as supply, especially if the new flavor doesn’t work out.
If a discard does happen, it is usually because the abuser has found their next victim.
But they will treat you as disposable.
There's a stage in the cycle where they completely disinvest in the relationship, even if they don't literally leave.
They will suddenly start treating you like their loser housemate that they barely tolerate. They won't communicate or collaborate on things that couples should and normally do so on. They will treat you like you're crazy or controlling for even trying to discuss this.
This works for them on so many levels, including confusing and undermining the confidence and self esteem of their victim. It makes the victim super receptive when the abuser begins another love bombing cycle.
Exactly this. As soon as the victim has any reality check, or even have a slight doubt about the situation, they will circle back around to the love bombing. And at that point, it is such a breath of fresh air from what you've been living in so long, you're back to square one, too.
I would say that rather than labeling it as disposable or discardable, it is a purposeful abuse tactic by the abuser to get the person to devalue themselves. That is what I disagree with, because it is just another way for the abuser to lower the self esteem of the survivor in order to keep them in the relationship. If the self worth of the survivor is low, they will be more reliant on the abuser despite how terribly they are being treated.
Can these ever be gender neutral?
Good call. Yes, it happens regardless of gender.
I mean if they're using a visual representation they'll have to settle on certain genders.
I came say the same
quite a few people wish the same
because it influences the policies that govt makes regarding subjects like this.
What would that look like? A woman gaslighting a man? A gay couple abusing each other? I think the portrayal here is, unfortunately, the least problematic. Yes it can be anyone, but every choice has baggage.
androgynous characters
woah woah get out of here with your smart and simple solution
In all seriousness, why would "a woman gaslighting a man" be more "problematic" than the other way around? Physical abuse skews one way, not sure emotional abuse does.
Physical abuse skews one way, not sure emotional abuse does.
Absolutely not.
All the abuse categories skew both ways...
You use depictions of single cell amoebas.
Yeah, as soon as gender is neutral.
Tf we’re talking about a graphic here to be neutral so people see it’s from both sides, not a whole ass gender war, Christ people
Exactly, it is about people.
If you want to put it that way, there are an awful lot of double standards in society that benefit women while men are left disadvantaged. Here are just 3 major ones where we should neutralize women's massive privilege:
1) Family court, maternal preference, burden of roof on fathers, child support assymetrical enforcement.
2) Criminal sentencing: women receive significantly lighter sentences than men for equivalent crimes and criminal histories. Think women molesting kids with no/low punishment and newspaper headlines softening the situation. You argue that women should receive equally harsh sentences as men and we agree on this! Neutralize women's massive advantages here.
3) Military Draft: you've been called to serve, gals. /u/UruquianLilac wants equality so lace up those boots!
The only systemic, codified, and socially acceptable discrimination in Western countries is against men.
And here they are, they come out of the woodworks at any opportunity.
You came out of the woodwork at any opportunity and I'm just responding.
And here they are, they come out of the woodworks at any opportunity.
.. and here you are ...... gas lighting 101
It's not a good look for you to be using woke terminology.
I'm not
gas lighting is not woke, it's a term used in the field that studies this, including the phycologists,
Similar situation, and it has been a few years. As much as I want to say that O have healed completely, and that my life is better now (1000% truly is), the damage has been done. I find myself much more guarded and less trusting of others. I trust my own intuition less, and second guess everything!
But thank you for posting. Calling out the abuse patterns help victims like us identify and what really happened to us.
Yeah, spotting the pattern is the first step to breaking free or even recovering from a toxic relationship.
AI slop is never a cool guide
The Gemini slide/graphic treatment has become so obvious
This^
Literally just experienced this. It was by far the most emotionally traumatizing thing anyone has ever done to me.
You want to know the worst part?
I still blame myself and feel like I'm the one who did something wrong.
What was exactly how I felt after breaking up with me ex. You will find someone better – just learn from the mistakes. Once you see the pattern clearly, you get better at avoiding those types of people (or calling them out).
I really hate that everyone calls their Ex a Narcissist and misuses “gaslighting”. There just aren’t that many narcissists.
In reality, most people just grow apart for lots of different reasons, or feel unappreciated, or crave more ambition, or a different life than they thought they did before. It’s rarely because they’re actually a narcissist.
The “Abusers mindset” could Easily be:
“I stated my boundaries, you systematically resisted by making it about you, I responded by leaving”
There are people in the field that assert that narcissists make up 30% of the population. That's not the consensus. But the argument has been made.
It's wild though that you would dismiss the pattern laid out in the graphic as people growing apart. Healthy people can leave without inflicting psychological abuse.
The final phase is open to misinterpretation. Your partner "suddenly losing interest" could be due to you simply ignoring the signs or being in denial. How you feel after they leave may simply be your own grief and not a result of their "abuse".
So you're fine with the devaluation phase?
The cycle described has three phases. If any one of the phases happens independently without the other phases then it's not what the graphic is describing.
But you're saying that after a period of performative love bombing, after a period of psychological abuse, there's a period of complete disinvestment - that could be anything? Who are we to judge?
You sound like a person who's done this to somebody and are in complete denial that it's abnormal.
I can't for the life of me understand why else someone would split hairs over calling out abuse.
I'm saying this "process" can be easily misinterpreted as such because it fits too easily in to someone's self preservation. Someone going through a breakup can easily look back and think it was all luvvy duvvy in the beginning and then things got distant or critical and then it all fell apart. It's easy to see the other person as the cause but we can contribute just as much while "guides" like these sooth our need to say "it's not my fault, they're a narcissist". If it's intentional, then maybe they are being narcissistic but who's to know that? Stuff like this feeds misinterpretation of relationships. So many clues don't communicate and don't seek help and then when it all collapses the blame game begins.
The three phases described here don’t sound all that unique to any one personality trait or even to be a disorder.
Love bombing? Is that a technical term? Is it not completely normal for people in brand new relationships to be excited and enthusiastic and optimistic and to express that and to try really hard to impress the object of their affection?
Devaluation and Discard seem to describe a great deal of breakups, many of which are not due to any disorders. People are incompatible for lots of reasons. People can become emotionally hurt or distant for lots of reasons, and it’s very easy to feel contempt for someone when you stay in a relationship longer than you should have.
Exactly. Bunch grey area bs being depicted as cutthroat manipulation. Stuff like this just plays in to gender warfare even if it doesn't mean to.
I think it’s often used by people to avoid any personal accountability for their own shortcomings.
There just aren’t that many narcissists.
Actually there is, its just that it hasn't been recognised until fairly recently.
Part of the reason could be attributed to the various conflicts that seem to be plaguing society along with other ills
Narcissism is a personality disorder, like OCD. If a lot of people had it, then it wouldn’t be a disorder, it would just be a normal negative personality trait for a lot of people, like selfishness or untruthfulness.
Maybe 1% of people actually have Narcissistic personality disorder. But lots of people can still be shitty wives or husbands for lots of other reasons.
it would still be a disorder, and no its not normal
its similar to the issue of autism, a lot of people do have it because majority of people are considered on the spectrum, its just that it doesnt have a major impact on their lives
Totally, not every ex is a narcissist. That is not what this graphic is trying to convey.
Their point is that these guides often oversimplify things and lead people to overuse terms like narcissist for their ex partners simply because things didn't pan out.
While its somewhat accurate of syptoms of a narcisist, its sexist as fuck insinuating men are bad and women are victims. Plenty of opposite cases exist. There is a reason for male loneliness epidemic, a big reason for it is passive sexism like this.
Yeah, the gender depiction in the graphic can mislead – as others have noted. And yes, this pattern can show up regardless of gender.
This could honestly apply to any cluster B types and not necessarily only narcissism/narcissists.
The playbook changes slightly, but the cycle is extremely similar.
Agree - Cluster B types share many overlapping traits, and it's important to recognize how they can all impact relationships in different ways.
Womans can't be narcissts? Wtf is this....
Fun fact: A narcissist can do this to a whole country.
Can't argue with that.
isn’t this just life though? you think you have something, reality disagrees and you’re left heartbroken? i mean not just in relationships but everything, work, friends, education. being an adult is realizing the juice isn’t always worth the squeeze and moving on to something you think will, failing again and getting back up, no?
That is what most people do. Not saying it is wrong, but what I have seen too many people shrug it off but wounds are there. They might move on to someone new, but the damage remains – and way too often they end up in the same situation again. That's the learned, unconscious pattern at work. So I believe it is important to understand happened. Of course, every relationship is different, so it would be also wrong to force one theory onto everyone's situation. It's better to get back up the right way.
being psychologically abused by a romantic partner with a mental disorder isn't exactly a great analogy for life but sometimes it feels like it could be i guess
Where is it from .. want to learn more about subject .. Thanks
Looks like it is from GaslightingCheck.com. They also have a blog section with lots of good contents.
everyone in the 1st trump admin seeing this like 'aaaah... that explains it'
True
If I follow step 1-3 it could very well be that the couple just grew apart through normal relationship friction. When viewed from the ‘hurt’ person the whole dynamic might feel like how it is portrayed in this guide. You can project all sorts of narcissistic traits onto someone, but maybe the love-bombing was just two people in love, maybe the criticism was just and the hurt person had significant flaws that got in the way of a happy relationship, maybe there is no gaslighting going on, but just two perspectives seeing the truth differently.
Hurt people often look for someone or something to blame. But the reality is that relationships that don’t work out hurt on both sides. Words like gaslighting, narcissism and toxic relationships are used so lightly nowadays. I’m not saying it never happens, but the guide reads like it was made by someone who is bitter about their ex and projecting just to cope.
I think this is mostly bogus. What relationship doesn't start good, degrade and then end with discarding your partner? Narcasism is a thing, but it has to be a bit more complex a matter than this.
Is this a cycle?
Armchair diagnosing people is really irresponsible and unhealthy and it's a trend that needs to go away. I see more and more people in mental health spaces pushing back on this. I heard a psychologist say that when she gets calls for couples counseling and the person tells her something about the other partner being a narcissist, it is usually the person saying that that has more narcissistic traits. Armchair diagnosing people is frequently weaponized to invalidate and hurt people. If you don't have the credentials to diagnose someone, and you aren't treating that individual, you shouldn't be doing it. Period.
You can use non therapy speak to describe what you've experienced without labeling others as having serious mental health issues.
This kind of thing isn't helpful. Abusive situations have correlation, but are all very different and any "guide" misleads people into thinking that if their experience doesn't fit, it's not abusive.
Especially a Three Step Guide. It's too narrow.
Oh I totally agree with you. it is an oversimplification, like I mentioned in the post. And if someone’s experience doesn’t fit the graphic, that doesn’t mean it isn’t abusive.
Flip the genders and it happened to me
Actually same here.
My ex gf did this exact thing to me.
So what causes people to become narcissistic
Good question. It can stem from a mix of genetic, environmental, and social factoers. Sometimes, it develops in response to excessive pampering or critical parentings, where a child learn to seek validation in unhealthy ways. It is complex. What are your thoughts?
I don't know. I was going to suggest environmental influences. I had a partner who definitely exhibited these traits.
This is a perfect depiction of how corporate vp assholes hire and fire to climb the ranks of business without ever doing anything themselves.
Research does show a good percentage of upper managements exhibits traits that overlap with narcissism.
What if I’ve overthought it and I gaslighted myself that I’m being gaslighted?!
That could happen. So be very cautious not to swing to the opposite extreme. Seek professional support when needed.
ty
You're welcome. We need support from other other. You are not alone, my friend.
Yeah, gaslighting sneaks in so subtly—glad I learned to spot it early.
Yep, seeing it is the first step to breaking free and to healing.
I wish these were gender neutral. My ex-wife was a horrible narcissist.
It is also worth noting that a narcissist will often try to convince YOU that YOU are the narcissist, when you are clearly the victim.
It's a dirty game y'all.
Currently going through it and having a hard time getting away. Even while trying to be in another relationship.
What's the cure? I was gaslighted and it still hurts.
therapy/ counselling/ support etc
Respectfully I dont think you will find a "cure", but you will find a management of it that allows you to make it a smaller and smaller part of your life as time goes by,.,,,
wish you the best
It's only been 9 months and like you say it's getting easier but still hurts.
Damn, this sub is getting spammed by Google’s NoteBookLM… nice try watermarking it with your own though :)
my lovely ex maybe be a covert narcissist
Iam a male and this happened to me
Ever hear of the Dennis system?
when my ex left, I self-esteem was at its lowest. Later, I realized it was not me - it was her insecurity and past wounds, mixed with my own upbringings and the dynamics between us.
well I hope you are better or at least in a better place.
went through many years of this myself across several countries, including domestic violence, took a lot to get out( out of country as well).
Unfortunately, the behaviour does not end when you leave because you have to deal with the legal fallout( try a religious family court) and then the fallout after that( including what is done to your children).
I would encourage anyone to NEVER feel any guilt about what has happened and try to seek any kind of counselling/therapy/ online support etc . Usually it's not about a cure , but management of how it impacted you.
It appears that this behaviour is more common than people realise, not so much an increase in people doing it, but rather a recognition that it's being done..
best of luck to you all...
How but people always playing the role of victims too ?
I wonder how calculating this is per abuser? I think a lot of this is subconscious behavior, unless you are also dealing with a sociopath?
“Narcissistic,” “gaslighting,” and a healthy sprinkling of alliteration—looks like the trifecta of pop psychology bullshit punching down on mental illness.
Narcissists need low self-esteem people to feed on. Just don't be one of them, and keep the narcissist as isolated from them as possible.
A narcissist can make a low-esteem person out of a partner, friend, colleague or family member.
This is actually just a guide of how to make sure women respect you and don't manipulate you LOL