Two sides of the coin, we weren’t questioning things before and we had no way of telling before. Now we atleast have a little window of calling fake stuff out before the ai gets too good.
A.I is enough of a reason for me to consider leaving the internet completely. It's all just marketing, ads, bots and bullshit anyway. Yet so many people are addicted to it. It's really fkn sad.
I prefer "Kurp" Metzger approach. " You never knew what was reality in the first place you dumb cow". - Kurp Metzger. The new, undisputed, heavy weight conspiracy champion of the world. He made Tripoli look like a nervous little bitch and will straight up call Rogan a stupid cow. 🤣 God I love kurp.
Infustry plant obviously… Who ever he is, based simply on the “lol, he’s a fucking savage”… Didn’t people learn from Trump? The “man of the people that has no filter and that calls them as he sees them”
Conspiracies are so easy to fall down these days, it's partially our governments fault for lying so much and then also the big conspiracy that all elites are pedos turned out to be mostly true. Then with ai plus the amount of bots on social media it's easy to believe.
Look at the website, a company called Crisis Cast. Look at their client and partner list in the menu. AMERICA uses similar services for their false flags.
They do it on purpose. That's their goal: discredit evening and everyone worth non official narratives.
That doesn't mean this wasn't a false flag as big as a house
This is AI and has been proven so.
The irony is, if their was something untoward that took place, it would now be invisible. Shrouded in shite posts and AI trash.
Perhaps the purpose.
The theory claims that certain Israeli extremists, far-right politicians, or their supporters are secretly hoping for (or engineering) escalated wars/attacks on Israel—such as the ongoing conflicts with Hamas, Hezbollah, or Iran—to create an “opportunity” for the Islamic sites to be damaged or destroyed (e.g., by missiles or chaos). They could then blame enemies, clear the site, and rebuild the Third Temple. This is tied to Christian evangelical “end-times” beliefs, where a rebuilt temple plays a role in prophecy (e.g., the Antichrist’s arrival).
I am Muslim and have been trying to tell this to people for years. IMO Muslims are lost (Hadith corruption) and most Christians are lost (Pauline corruption). Once they both realize this they’ll see how the faiths are practically the same, but that will be the end times.
Christians and jews are ahlul kitab (people of the book). Muslims ought to read. Its not like the first surah ever wasnt called READ. Lol but thankyou for opening their eyes
There is so much footage of this event from so many angles, tons of people recorded this on their cellphones. You would know if you weren't a dumbass and had even the smallest actual interest in looking it up.
It's not that complicated. At any given time, there are likely hundreds or even thousands of potential extremists that are being groomed by intelligence services, either online or via real assets. We know this specifically because the FBI has a long track record. There's a great book on this called "The Terror Factory: Inside the FBI’s Manufactured War on Terrorism".
After 9/11, the FBI didn't just find terrorists - it built cases around people who talked big but had no real capacity to act. The pattern was pretty simple: identify someone angry, isolated, or unstable; insert a paid informant who becomes a friend and ideological amplifier; slowly steer conversations from grievance to violence; then supply the missing pieces - plans, money, transport, and weapon(s) - while recording everything. At the final, theatrical moment, the FBI arrests the suspect and announces a “foiled plot,” even though the plot would not have existed without government direction and resources.
A concrete example is the 2010 Portland Christmas tree lighting case: the FBI targeted Mohamed Osman Mohamud, a young man with extremist fantasies but no means. An undercover agent encouraged the idea, helped design the attack, provided a fake bomb, drove him to the site, and coached him through the steps - before arresting him when he tried to detonate a device that was never capable of exploding.
Mossad for example is almost certainly doing this on a wide scale. And they have deeply infiltrated ISIS, mainly because ISIS share many of the same objectives of the Israeli State, which is undermining or overthrowing Hamas, Hezbollah, the Iranian regime etc. ISIS have proved to be a useful tool. They have never attacked Israel and nor has Israel joined any coalitions fighting ISIS. But having said that, some of the people carrying out attacks, like Naveed Akram, are said to have been "inspired" by ISIS but had no real connections to the ISIS command structure. That's usually a telling sign they may have been groomed. So you can imagine, instead of grooming a terrorist and then stepping in at the last minute to arrest them, they allow them to continue through with the plot.
Other telltale signs of an op is if the perpetrators leave an obvious trail to have them quickly identified - passports or id cards left in a car or ISIS flags. An op only works if their extremist motivations can be very quickly identified by the media.
Well that's the problem isn't it. The demand for a single piece of “smoking-gun evidence” misunderstands how intelligence and counter-terrorism actually operate. Intelligence services are designed around plausible deniability. That's their core business. If their activities left courtroom-grade evidence, they would be failing at their core function. So the question isn’t “where is the document that admits this?” - it’s “what pattern of behavior consistently appears across cases, jurisdictions, and time?”
In the book i mentioned about the FBI grooming terrorists,, the evidence is structural and cumulative, not confessional. There's no FBI agent signing a confession. You repeatedly see the same elements: targets with no operational capacity; paid informants under pressure to deliver results; government agents proposing targets, methods, and timelines; provision of money, transport, and fake weapons; arrests staged at the final moment; and courts that explicitly acknowledge heavy government involvement while still rejecting entrapment claims. One case could be dismissed as coincidence. Dozens following the same template become a pattern.
This is how serious analysis works in every other domain that deals with opaque power: organized crime, financial fraud, covert influence, intelligence history. We don’t wait for the CIA to publish a memo admitting Iran-Contra before concluding it happened. We infer from consistent behaviors, incentives, institutional rewards, and outcomes. In fact, U.S. courts themselves have acknowledged - on the record- that many FBI terrorism plots were government-initiated, even while upholding convictions. That alone collapses the claim that there is “no evidence.”
So the honest position is not “this is proven beyond doubt”. Im not suggesting this is proven beyond doubt but the convergence of incentives, repeated operational patterns etc which makes alternative explanations increasingly implausible. At that point, asking “where’s the evidence?” becomes less a demand for rigor and more a demand for an impossible standard - one that, conveniently, only intelligence agencies ever get to hide behind.
In other words: absence of direct proof is not absence of intelligence activity. In this domain, patterns and incentives are the evidence.
Edit: if anyone is interested in learning more about how intelligence agencies operate in practice, I recommend looking up :
- former FBI agent Michael German
- former FBI legal counsel Coleen Rowley
- former FBI translator Sibel Edmonds
- CIA head of Bin Laden Unit, Michael Scheuer
- Former CIA officer Philip Giraldi
Thank you again for the detailed and coherent response.
Maybe to clarify though, in lieu of evidence which I understand can be hard to nail down based on the nature of these alleged operations what leads you in this specific case to believe it to be more than it appears?
is your default position that something is a government op unless proven otherwise?
is there something specific?
does the existence of these operations leave no room for genuine gras roots fanaticism and violence?
I'll apologize in advance for the long answer but I appreciate the respectful dialogue. In short it's all about incentives and patterns.
I'll start with the incentives and the context. Israel has been under enormous pressure, especially in the last year, as their war against Hamas has faltered and the deaths keep piling up. The Israel lobby (Jonathan Greenblatt of ADL quotes) openly admiting they have lost young people. They are acknowledging they have a TikTok problem. In August this year, Netanyahu was essentially threatening PM Albo and the Australian Govt not to recognise Palestine as a State. In Sept, just 11 weeks ago, the Aust Govt went ahead and recognised Palestine anyway. It doesn't take much critical thinking to recognise that one way Israel can try and turn the PR tide is if radical Islam is seen as a bigger threat -and if they can equate antisemistism with criticisms of Israel. For many in Israel, losing the PR battle represents an existential security threat. And there will be some, especially within the far right extremist elements in the government, will believe anything is justified under the guise of national security. That alone of course doesn't prove or even allude to anything - but it sets the context in terms of "who benefits" or the incentive.
On to patterns - over the last decade, a set of remarkably consistent patterns appeared across ISIS-linked attacks in Europe. Time and again, perpetrators were identified almost immediately, often because IDs or passports were conveniently “found” at the scene or in nearby vehicles. ISIS flags or pledges would surface early. Within days, authorities would acknowledge that the suspect was already known to intelligence services, sometimes for years, and that there had been prior warnings, watchlists, or overseas travel to conflict-adjacent regions. Later inquiries would frame this as failure, overload, or bad luck.
One reasonable interpretation is incompetence. Another is something more prosaic and institutional: plausible deniability. If authorities already know who a suspect is, saying “we found his ID” offers a clean public explanation that avoids exposing sources, methods, or prior surveillance-and sidesteps the harder question of why the individual wasn’t stopped earlier. In that sense, the “found ID” can function less as discovery and more as narrative cover. This can also explain why google search trends are often found of the perpetrators names before the attacks take place. The people were already closely monitored.
What matters isn’t whether radicalization was organic or encouraged. End behavior can look identical either way: violence by a lone individual citing extremist ideology. The more revealing signal is how law enforcement and intelligence respond- the speed of identification, the later admission of prior knowledge, the compressed public narrative, and the familiar language of “known but not prioritized.” We see this over and over.
And we’re seeing echoes of these patterns in the Bondi case: rapid identification, acknowledgments of prior awareness, questions around overseas travel, and a tightly managed public account. The media very quickly seemed to have the narrative sorted almost the moment the shots stopped being fired. None of this proves orchestration or grooming. But it does justify skepticism about official narratives that present events as sudden, unforeseeable shocks.
When mass violence is linked to ISIS, authorities and media often move with striking speed to declare motive and ideology, but when the perpetrator is a non-Muslim, certainty evaporates. The Las Vegas shooting in 2017, the deadliest in modern U.S. history, ended with an official conclusion of no known motive, no manifesto, and a case quietly closed- despite the scale of the atrocity. Similarly, in Parkland (FL) where the shooter’s extremist views and warning signs emerged only gradually, the narrative was initially framed around mental health and institutional failure, with ideology treated as secondary or incidental. In contrast, attacks merely associated with Islamist symbolism are often labelled terrorism within hours - and we know their links to ISIS for example immediately. This can in part be potentially explained through a western culture bias to use jihadist violence as a convenient external enemy. But it's more likely because intelligence agencies knew who these people were before they committed the atrocity, and in some cases even had indications or foreknowledge an attack was imminent.
The point isn’t to claim certainty. It’s to recognize that when the same institutional responses recur across countries and years, the pattern itself becomes the evidence-not necessarily of conspiracy, but of how modern counter-terror systems manage risk, protect deniability, and tell the public a simplified version of what they already knew.
And Israeli intelligence is known to have deeply penetrated Hezbollah and the Iranian regime. They have actually bragged about this, especially in relation to the exploding pager operation and the operation to blow up Iran's nuclear program. It stands to reason they have also deeply infiltrated ISIS. And we have no reason to believe they operate any differently to the FBI, who are known to monitor and groom extremists. The difference is, Israel has no vested interest in revealing plots and arresting people like the FBI has done. Their interest is likely monitoring extremists and using them for whatever purposes they see fit.
It's also worth adding, that most often these lone wolf terror attacks are described as "inspired by ISIS". There's often no indication that the perpetrators had any direct links to ISIS command structures. "Inspired by ISIS" often suggests grooming by someone. And also important to note, ISIS by definition isn't an anti-Israel resistance movement. Their main objective is to create a region wide Caliphate. It's actually more an enemy of Muslims across the middle east who they view as apostates. This is why you'll never see ISIS attacking Israel in the middle east. And it's also why Israel has never gone to war against ISIS. Their short and medium term goals are actually pretty aligned - both Israel and ISIS view Hamas, Hezbollah and the Iranian regime as the enemy. This is why the Bondi attack in particular is unusual - ISIS inspired but attacking specifically Jews? It certainly feels the entire operation was designed to fuel a campaign about antisemistism. And the fact that an Israeli political operative, just arrived in Sydney two weeks ago, specifically on a mission to tackle antisemistism, was on the ground in Bondi, posting selfie photos covered in blood, raises suspicions. More so that fake AI generated photos of that Israeli operative went online (which were easily shown to be fake) which would then be used to discredit any "conspiracy" theories. Bares the hallmarks of a psyop.
So all of these things taken together are reasonably compelling - clear motive and incentives and a series of familiar patterns. Sure, not clear evidence of anything but enough to seriously question the official narrative.
Lol I had the same thought but I'm not gonna argue with crazy. I just took issue when I thought he was saying the shooting was a fake Ai psyop, because that's clearly not true. But his actual position, that it's a false flag meant to sow division, is not worth debating. The goal posts will always shift, not worth rolling in the mud over.
Just the fact that someone decided to create that AI image of Arsen Ostrovsky, and get it widely distributed, makes me wonder why they chose that specific person to create a misdirect. That image was ready to go. And then journalists were made aware of this AI image to widely inform everyone it's AI.
yes that's more likely... the truth is in between. the pic above is AI, but maybe he still was into some Intel about the place and time for his zionist propaganda mission. It feels too convenient.
With AI becoming more powerful and posts being 'dumped' for internet points, is it possible to make a rule to require at least a link to source material? Thanks!
I've been saying this all along. This is why the government want to have AI unregulated. So they can develop it as fast as possible and then all visual evidence of wrong-doing (real or fake) becomes deniable, even inadmissible, because no one can tell if anything is legit. With that, what the law rules in favor of comes down to who holds more power and nothing more.
Is it possible the gunmen knew he was there and we're targeting him and his entourage specifically? Really the only way I can draw a connection beyond pure, obscene coincidence
Watch his interview, he seems like he’s trying to remember rehearsed lines. “We came 2 weeks ago to……………….(think really hard for a second so I don’t slip up)….. stop antisemitism.” Lol
Clearly AI. Why would she hold the red paint on/in her hand.. the paint or whatever doesnt even look like a fluid substance. also if it was a real picture her hand would be slightly behind his shoulder.
I saw a post somewhere (can’t remember if it was this sub or X) where someone asked Grok if this was AI. They were like “THE AI SAYS THIS PHOTO IS NOT AI, IT IS REAL!”
…meanwhile people’s fingers are fused together and the cars are split open. It’s profoundly depressing.
I had a family member send me a half hour long video about some random story from WWII they thought I might be interested in. The entire thing from beginning to end was extremely low quality AI pictures with a terrible AI voice over, and they were absolutely flabbergasted when I explained to them that the entire thing was made by AI. They had zero clue until I pointed it out. I looked at the Youtube account that posted it and they had dozens of additional videos like this.
We all need to really educate ourselves on AI and be really diligent when accepting “media” as real. Why on earth would they be applying the make up outside and in public? Media literacy is so crucial in these times, as is being discerning.
Yeah I get that, but it’s allowing people Time to grieve before all this starts and people to post stuff like this when it’s obviously fake it’s disgusting tbh, just so some people can speculate online, doesn’t matter where you stand on everything, people died that isn’t speculation that’s not a stance, that’s just the truth, but I do get ya ❤️
How can one moderate a sub that definitely has been taken over by the inmates. The only obvious scene I see is that this man is an absolute attention whore who uses tragedy as a means to steer a narrative to fit his confirmation bias. Oh wait, that's you all too.
Looks like a compressed image. So compressed in fact that it would be hard to identify any of the details that people are using as evidence for AI. So it seems odd to me that it's getting such a general consensus in a conspiracy community. It's "proven AI" a lot of users are saying. I'm not sure how you can prove that. There's plenty of lower res images where it's impossible to read the words on a rippled shirt.
Not only that. The posts that are staying on the front page with regards to this topic are showing less and less of the image in question. And all the old posts are either deleted by Reddit, or float around 0 votes.
All the top comments on these posts don't mention a stance though. They simply state that AI it making it impossible to tell. But Im pretty sure you don't need AI to falsify images. That concern predates AI, despite how AI could make it worse. Big muddying the water vibes to me.
A lot of comments with attitude about it too. I know we have a lot of overconfident jerks around here. Maybe myself included. But I don't think we have that many that are all willing to agree something isn't real.
Go ahead and look at my comment history. Pretty much everything I said about this is RIGHT around 0 votes. I can tell you that they have 50-100 voters on many of them. That's unusual.
Go ahead and try to find the original image in question yourself. And be honest. If you weren't aware of the event, and you didn't have a bunch of strangers online acting certain it was a faked image, what would you think?
I believe this is a bonafide leaked image that suggests footage was recorded in advance of the event. They used footage they knew they could believably superimposes over the event so they had what they needed to promote a narrative. You don't want to gamble on getting the footage you want if you're creating a false flag.
If so everything you're seeing here is damage control.
Just my opinion. I'm not an AI image expert. Are any of us?
And fucking furthermore. Comparing the image in question to the interview on the day of, and saying that details lack continuity only provides MORE evidence it was filmed in advance. The fake video would be his cellphone clip, which does not show the details of his shirt as far as I know. The interview was clearly legitimate to the date, faking that would be easy to cross reference as false by background details.
Please ask yourself. Why is a whole conspiracy subreddit telling you not to question something, and saying it harms the integrity of the community. I didn't see them do that for flat earth the same way. There's been plenty of topics to criticize for this. Why now?
Because the image is possibly real? Please please please think for yourself on this one. I don't mind if you think I'm wrong. But I do mind if you let others tell you to believe something. Do these comments feel organic to you? Why is the image in question getting less and less of the relevant details included in the upvoted posts? Do these comments seem like they want you to think for yourself?
There's only one kind of thought. Thinking for yourself. Anything else is acceptance, and an omission of self worth. What do YOU think?!
Ffs! That pic is AI and I wish people would just check before posting because it’s one of those AI photos that will be put out purposely to make anything actual credible look crazy like this!
People are commenting that this is AI slop, so by the same token, you shouldn’t believe the fake news showing Muslims celebrating. Because, that is also fake. Thank you.
You actually think this is real lmao dude it's one of the biggest pictures and easiest to tell I've ever seen it's embarrassing if you honestly believe that that picture is real
There was a post saying that it was 13% positive to be AI generated. But most of it passed the scan as real. Honestly though who knows for sure in this day and age. It is bringing political unrest in Australia and most likely law changes.
So this is probably AI but what's really weird is it's the same guy who was apparently attacked on oct 7th in Israel. Also hearing rumours that the two muslim attackers are Isis members planted by Israel as a false flag op
So no one was killed in Australia? The son wasn’t taken down by a bystander? The dad wasn’t shot by a cop? I’m usually on board but this is complete bullshit. People lost their lives and it doesn’t matter what their ethnicity is, you are on the wrong side on this one.
AI will no doubt start all sorts of wars and conflicts. I do not trust videos anymore...really sucks we have to question EVERYTHING
You never should have stopped.
Two sides of the coin, we weren’t questioning things before and we had no way of telling before. Now we atleast have a little window of calling fake stuff out before the ai gets too good.
People have always questioned stuff. What people used to claim as ‘photoshop’ when thinking something is fake has just changed to ‘ai’ now.
You’re not wrong, but photoshop takes time to learn. Once ai gets good enough any regular joe can start his own conspiracy.
Thank you.
Stopped what?
A.I is enough of a reason for me to consider leaving the internet completely. It's all just marketing, ads, bots and bullshit anyway. Yet so many people are addicted to it. It's really fkn sad.
I prefer "Kurp" Metzger approach. " You never knew what was reality in the first place you dumb cow". - Kurp Metzger. The new, undisputed, heavy weight conspiracy champion of the world. He made Tripoli look like a nervous little bitch and will straight up call Rogan a stupid cow. 🤣 God I love kurp.
I conkurp
I also Derp, he's fucking savage!
Infustry plant obviously… Who ever he is, based simply on the “lol, he’s a fucking savage”… Didn’t people learn from Trump? The “man of the people that has no filter and that calls them as he sees them”
Kurp?
Riiiight, he’s not controlled at all. He’s just been promoted like crazy by everyone
I'm also a fan of Kurp, when did he call Rogan a stupid cow? i'd like to see that
It’s only just begun
Conspiracies are so easy to fall down these days, it's partially our governments fault for lying so much and then also the big conspiracy that all elites are pedos turned out to be mostly true. Then with ai plus the amount of bots on social media it's easy to believe.
Rip to the victims of bondi beach
Look at the website, a company called Crisis Cast. Look at their client and partner list in the menu. AMERICA uses similar services for their false flags.
go to site: Watch Video.
The show The 100 showed us how quick AI can destroy humanity
You ever seen Mountainhead? Shit was scary for how probable it seemed to me.
How do I know you aren't ai
You gave me my first smile today....thank you 🙂
Mountainhead (2025)
They do it on purpose. That's their goal: discredit evening and everyone worth non official narratives. That doesn't mean this wasn't a false flag as big as a house
Already comfirmed to not be AI. Might be photoshopped, but it isn't AI.
Stop spreading AI FUD.... it makes us legitimate conspiracy theorists look bad
This is AI and has been proven so. The irony is, if their was something untoward that took place, it would now be invisible. Shrouded in shite posts and AI trash. Perhaps the purpose.
Its a psyop. And it is also AI. This is ment to discredit the notion that it's a zionist false flag event
Ziops.
New meme initiated.
Oh we need this meme ! Ziops !! Loving this subs forethought !
Nice
Stealing this. Thanks.
So this is a double-doublecross?
Psyop-ception!
They want us to declare war on Israel so they can go build the third temple.
Netanyahu is performing his supervillain role impeccably.
Candace Owens is also performing her role as “rail against Israel” reasonably well.
I say just turn it into a parking lot and set a dollar general on top of it
🤣
Jokes on you they already built the third temple
*Rebuild, sorry.
The theory claims that certain Israeli extremists, far-right politicians, or their supporters are secretly hoping for (or engineering) escalated wars/attacks on Israel—such as the ongoing conflicts with Hamas, Hezbollah, or Iran—to create an “opportunity” for the Islamic sites to be damaged or destroyed (e.g., by missiles or chaos). They could then blame enemies, clear the site, and rebuild the Third Temple. This is tied to Christian evangelical “end-times” beliefs, where a rebuilt temple plays a role in prophecy (e.g., the Antichrist’s arrival).
Thank you Grok for that summary.
Do Christians even realise they will be fighting alongside Muslims?
I am Muslim and have been trying to tell this to people for years. IMO Muslims are lost (Hadith corruption) and most Christians are lost (Pauline corruption). Once they both realize this they’ll see how the faiths are practically the same, but that will be the end times.
Christians and jews are ahlul kitab (people of the book). Muslims ought to read. Its not like the first surah ever wasnt called READ. Lol but thankyou for opening their eyes
That is some serious food for thought.
(coughitswhyisraelinstigatednineelevencough) They wanted Christian’s to fear Muslims. They don’t want them working together.
There is so much footage of this event from so many angles, tons of people recorded this on their cellphones. You would know if you weren't a dumbass and had even the smallest actual interest in looking it up.
You misunderstand. The AI image is the psyo being discussed. The tragedy was not the psyop, the tragedy is likely a false flag event.
No don't carry on, how is it a false flag?
Please actual details of how it was executed.
It's not that complicated. At any given time, there are likely hundreds or even thousands of potential extremists that are being groomed by intelligence services, either online or via real assets. We know this specifically because the FBI has a long track record. There's a great book on this called "The Terror Factory: Inside the FBI’s Manufactured War on Terrorism".
After 9/11, the FBI didn't just find terrorists - it built cases around people who talked big but had no real capacity to act. The pattern was pretty simple: identify someone angry, isolated, or unstable; insert a paid informant who becomes a friend and ideological amplifier; slowly steer conversations from grievance to violence; then supply the missing pieces - plans, money, transport, and weapon(s) - while recording everything. At the final, theatrical moment, the FBI arrests the suspect and announces a “foiled plot,” even though the plot would not have existed without government direction and resources.
A concrete example is the 2010 Portland Christmas tree lighting case: the FBI targeted Mohamed Osman Mohamud, a young man with extremist fantasies but no means. An undercover agent encouraged the idea, helped design the attack, provided a fake bomb, drove him to the site, and coached him through the steps - before arresting him when he tried to detonate a device that was never capable of exploding.
Mossad for example is almost certainly doing this on a wide scale. And they have deeply infiltrated ISIS, mainly because ISIS share many of the same objectives of the Israeli State, which is undermining or overthrowing Hamas, Hezbollah, the Iranian regime etc. ISIS have proved to be a useful tool. They have never attacked Israel and nor has Israel joined any coalitions fighting ISIS. But having said that, some of the people carrying out attacks, like Naveed Akram, are said to have been "inspired" by ISIS but had no real connections to the ISIS command structure. That's usually a telling sign they may have been groomed. So you can imagine, instead of grooming a terrorist and then stepping in at the last minute to arrest them, they allow them to continue through with the plot.
Other telltale signs of an op is if the perpetrators leave an obvious trail to have them quickly identified - passports or id cards left in a car or ISIS flags. An op only works if their extremist motivations can be very quickly identified by the media.
Ok, thanks for at least giving a detailed answer. Literally the first time anyone has on this sub.
I'll ask the obvious next question, is there any actual proof?
Well that's the problem isn't it. The demand for a single piece of “smoking-gun evidence” misunderstands how intelligence and counter-terrorism actually operate. Intelligence services are designed around plausible deniability. That's their core business. If their activities left courtroom-grade evidence, they would be failing at their core function. So the question isn’t “where is the document that admits this?” - it’s “what pattern of behavior consistently appears across cases, jurisdictions, and time?”
In the book i mentioned about the FBI grooming terrorists,, the evidence is structural and cumulative, not confessional. There's no FBI agent signing a confession. You repeatedly see the same elements: targets with no operational capacity; paid informants under pressure to deliver results; government agents proposing targets, methods, and timelines; provision of money, transport, and fake weapons; arrests staged at the final moment; and courts that explicitly acknowledge heavy government involvement while still rejecting entrapment claims. One case could be dismissed as coincidence. Dozens following the same template become a pattern.
This is how serious analysis works in every other domain that deals with opaque power: organized crime, financial fraud, covert influence, intelligence history. We don’t wait for the CIA to publish a memo admitting Iran-Contra before concluding it happened. We infer from consistent behaviors, incentives, institutional rewards, and outcomes. In fact, U.S. courts themselves have acknowledged - on the record- that many FBI terrorism plots were government-initiated, even while upholding convictions. That alone collapses the claim that there is “no evidence.”
So the honest position is not “this is proven beyond doubt”. Im not suggesting this is proven beyond doubt but the convergence of incentives, repeated operational patterns etc which makes alternative explanations increasingly implausible. At that point, asking “where’s the evidence?” becomes less a demand for rigor and more a demand for an impossible standard - one that, conveniently, only intelligence agencies ever get to hide behind.
In other words: absence of direct proof is not absence of intelligence activity. In this domain, patterns and incentives are the evidence.
Edit: if anyone is interested in learning more about how intelligence agencies operate in practice, I recommend looking up : - former FBI agent Michael German - former FBI legal counsel Coleen Rowley - former FBI translator Sibel Edmonds - CIA head of Bin Laden Unit, Michael Scheuer - Former CIA officer Philip Giraldi
Thank you again for the detailed and coherent response.
Maybe to clarify though, in lieu of evidence which I understand can be hard to nail down based on the nature of these alleged operations what leads you in this specific case to believe it to be more than it appears?
is your default position that something is a government op unless proven otherwise?
is there something specific?
does the existence of these operations leave no room for genuine gras roots fanaticism and violence?
I'll apologize in advance for the long answer but I appreciate the respectful dialogue. In short it's all about incentives and patterns.
I'll start with the incentives and the context. Israel has been under enormous pressure, especially in the last year, as their war against Hamas has faltered and the deaths keep piling up. The Israel lobby (Jonathan Greenblatt of ADL quotes) openly admiting they have lost young people. They are acknowledging they have a TikTok problem. In August this year, Netanyahu was essentially threatening PM Albo and the Australian Govt not to recognise Palestine as a State. In Sept, just 11 weeks ago, the Aust Govt went ahead and recognised Palestine anyway. It doesn't take much critical thinking to recognise that one way Israel can try and turn the PR tide is if radical Islam is seen as a bigger threat -and if they can equate antisemistism with criticisms of Israel. For many in Israel, losing the PR battle represents an existential security threat. And there will be some, especially within the far right extremist elements in the government, will believe anything is justified under the guise of national security. That alone of course doesn't prove or even allude to anything - but it sets the context in terms of "who benefits" or the incentive.
On to patterns - over the last decade, a set of remarkably consistent patterns appeared across ISIS-linked attacks in Europe. Time and again, perpetrators were identified almost immediately, often because IDs or passports were conveniently “found” at the scene or in nearby vehicles. ISIS flags or pledges would surface early. Within days, authorities would acknowledge that the suspect was already known to intelligence services, sometimes for years, and that there had been prior warnings, watchlists, or overseas travel to conflict-adjacent regions. Later inquiries would frame this as failure, overload, or bad luck.
One reasonable interpretation is incompetence. Another is something more prosaic and institutional: plausible deniability. If authorities already know who a suspect is, saying “we found his ID” offers a clean public explanation that avoids exposing sources, methods, or prior surveillance-and sidesteps the harder question of why the individual wasn’t stopped earlier. In that sense, the “found ID” can function less as discovery and more as narrative cover. This can also explain why google search trends are often found of the perpetrators names before the attacks take place. The people were already closely monitored.
What matters isn’t whether radicalization was organic or encouraged. End behavior can look identical either way: violence by a lone individual citing extremist ideology. The more revealing signal is how law enforcement and intelligence respond- the speed of identification, the later admission of prior knowledge, the compressed public narrative, and the familiar language of “known but not prioritized.” We see this over and over.
And we’re seeing echoes of these patterns in the Bondi case: rapid identification, acknowledgments of prior awareness, questions around overseas travel, and a tightly managed public account. The media very quickly seemed to have the narrative sorted almost the moment the shots stopped being fired. None of this proves orchestration or grooming. But it does justify skepticism about official narratives that present events as sudden, unforeseeable shocks.
When mass violence is linked to ISIS, authorities and media often move with striking speed to declare motive and ideology, but when the perpetrator is a non-Muslim, certainty evaporates. The Las Vegas shooting in 2017, the deadliest in modern U.S. history, ended with an official conclusion of no known motive, no manifesto, and a case quietly closed- despite the scale of the atrocity. Similarly, in Parkland (FL) where the shooter’s extremist views and warning signs emerged only gradually, the narrative was initially framed around mental health and institutional failure, with ideology treated as secondary or incidental. In contrast, attacks merely associated with Islamist symbolism are often labelled terrorism within hours - and we know their links to ISIS for example immediately. This can in part be potentially explained through a western culture bias to use jihadist violence as a convenient external enemy. But it's more likely because intelligence agencies knew who these people were before they committed the atrocity, and in some cases even had indications or foreknowledge an attack was imminent.
The point isn’t to claim certainty. It’s to recognize that when the same institutional responses recur across countries and years, the pattern itself becomes the evidence-not necessarily of conspiracy, but of how modern counter-terror systems manage risk, protect deniability, and tell the public a simplified version of what they already knew.
And Israeli intelligence is known to have deeply penetrated Hezbollah and the Iranian regime. They have actually bragged about this, especially in relation to the exploding pager operation and the operation to blow up Iran's nuclear program. It stands to reason they have also deeply infiltrated ISIS. And we have no reason to believe they operate any differently to the FBI, who are known to monitor and groom extremists. The difference is, Israel has no vested interest in revealing plots and arresting people like the FBI has done. Their interest is likely monitoring extremists and using them for whatever purposes they see fit.
It's also worth adding, that most often these lone wolf terror attacks are described as "inspired by ISIS". There's often no indication that the perpetrators had any direct links to ISIS command structures. "Inspired by ISIS" often suggests grooming by someone. And also important to note, ISIS by definition isn't an anti-Israel resistance movement. Their main objective is to create a region wide Caliphate. It's actually more an enemy of Muslims across the middle east who they view as apostates. This is why you'll never see ISIS attacking Israel in the middle east. And it's also why Israel has never gone to war against ISIS. Their short and medium term goals are actually pretty aligned - both Israel and ISIS view Hamas, Hezbollah and the Iranian regime as the enemy. This is why the Bondi attack in particular is unusual - ISIS inspired but attacking specifically Jews? It certainly feels the entire operation was designed to fuel a campaign about antisemistism. And the fact that an Israeli political operative, just arrived in Sydney two weeks ago, specifically on a mission to tackle antisemistism, was on the ground in Bondi, posting selfie photos covered in blood, raises suspicions. More so that fake AI generated photos of that Israeli operative went online (which were easily shown to be fake) which would then be used to discredit any "conspiracy" theories. Bares the hallmarks of a psyop.
So all of these things taken together are reasonably compelling - clear motive and incentives and a series of familiar patterns. Sure, not clear evidence of anything but enough to seriously question the official narrative.
Lol I had the same thought but I'm not gonna argue with crazy. I just took issue when I thought he was saying the shooting was a fake Ai psyop, because that's clearly not true. But his actual position, that it's a false flag meant to sow division, is not worth debating. The goal posts will always shift, not worth rolling in the mud over.
Ah okay carry on my bad
A psyop for the psyop
A psyop in a psyop = ziop
Just the fact that someone decided to create that AI image of Arsen Ostrovsky, and get it widely distributed, makes me wonder why they chose that specific person to create a misdirect. That image was ready to go. And then journalists were made aware of this AI image to widely inform everyone it's AI.
lol
So not only is it not a Muslim terrorist attack, the claim it's a false flag was also a false flag?
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Its obviously AI. Look at the writing on the shirt.
Its AI, in the bigger version of the picture, you can clearly see the cars and tent in the background deformed
Also the blood stains on his shoulders don't match the same as in the original picture.
Crisis actors are a thing, and false flags are everywhere, but this image is AI
Respectfully: look at his shirt, it’s obviously AI. Look at the cars and the hands of the woman applying the makeup…
Have I gone mad?
You can't? That's a little concerning. It's painfully obvious and has been since it was first posted in this subreddit.
How would it be rare that a prominent Jewish person be at a Chanukah celebration in Sydney at the big chanukah gathering on a famous beach...
Maybe those fuckheads knew he was gonna be there
The internet did a Google trend lookup on the terrorist names and 4 days before they were trending on the search.
Skynet looked those names up? the internet itself just thought to look them up?
yes that's more likely... the truth is in between. the pic above is AI, but maybe he still was into some Intel about the place and time for his zionist propaganda mission. It feels too convenient.
With AI becoming more powerful and posts being 'dumped' for internet points, is it possible to make a rule to require at least a link to source material? Thanks!
So what is wrong with his behaviour? You sure do take a political stance very quickly for a conspiracy theorist
Wonder where his name came from, arsen is usually an armenian name
I've been saying this all along. This is why the government want to have AI unregulated. So they can develop it as fast as possible and then all visual evidence of wrong-doing (real or fake) becomes deniable, even inadmissible, because no one can tell if anything is legit. With that, what the law rules in favor of comes down to who holds more power and nothing more.
Is it possible the gunmen knew he was there and we're targeting him and his entourage specifically? Really the only way I can draw a connection beyond pure, obscene coincidence
Watch his interview, he seems like he’s trying to remember rehearsed lines. “We came 2 weeks ago to……………….(think really hard for a second so I don’t slip up)….. stop antisemitism.” Lol
Amazing comment. 👏
Clearly AI. Why would she hold the red paint on/in her hand.. the paint or whatever doesnt even look like a fluid substance. also if it was a real picture her hand would be slightly behind his shoulder.
Blood patterns on the shirt are also inconsistent with his interview video.
hes also wearing pants in this pic but shorts in the interview
I’ve seen the full image. It’s 100% AI. People in the background have warped faces
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The image was posted on the sub. Top comment was a declaration it was ai.
That picture is not real
AI PSYOP
We have entered the digital age of national enquirer. Good grief
Wow so we learned to use AI today!!!! Congratulations!!!
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The shirt doesn’t even have real words on it and people in here have been eating it up.
His shirt is also illegible. In other photos it’s very obvious’ UNITED STATES’
Yeah. It should be condemned.
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No link, no source. This sub became a copy-paste Ai-dumpster.
That has been proven to be ai. This board is as bad as it gets. 4chan incel central. Yall need to touch another human.
If you can’t tell that is an AI photo, you are telling on yourself. You should opt out of this community because you are fully cooked.
If you’re unable to discern between AI and reality this early in the game, it’s over. Throw the towel in and let the adults take over.
Twenty minutes after you made this comment a mod stickied their own comment saying they can't tell if it's AI or not lol
Edit: That comment has now been removed by a different moderator. Very interesting.
So depressing. We are cooked.
I saw a post somewhere (can’t remember if it was this sub or X) where someone asked Grok if this was AI. They were like “THE AI SAYS THIS PHOTO IS NOT AI, IT IS REAL!”
…meanwhile people’s fingers are fused together and the cars are split open. It’s profoundly depressing.
Very dark days ahead…
I had a family member send me a half hour long video about some random story from WWII they thought I might be interested in. The entire thing from beginning to end was extremely low quality AI pictures with a terrible AI voice over, and they were absolutely flabbergasted when I explained to them that the entire thing was made by AI. They had zero clue until I pointed it out. I looked at the Youtube account that posted it and they had dozens of additional videos like this.
People are willing to ignore the blatant marks of AI to believe in some conspiracy.
The party told them to reject the evidence of their eyes and they did.
Wasn't it Ai?
it was allready checked right.
This is the kind of shit they will use as an example to have Digital IDs to use AI tech
🎯
We can fix global warming by having AI rapidly destroy the human race
This sub is getting oneshotted by AI lmao
understand AI ?
AI is like Satan's PS5.
We all need to really educate ourselves on AI and be really diligent when accepting “media” as real. Why on earth would they be applying the make up outside and in public? Media literacy is so crucial in these times, as is being discerning.
Control of both sides of the narrative ensures equilibrium so status quo is maintained.
How are people like you allowed to just post absolute bullshit?
Post brought to you by Bangledesh.
But people died ? Doesn’t matter your stance on things, people died
Your stance always matters. The people who died deserve justice and their families, truth. Wherever that takes you.
Yeah I get that, but it’s allowing people Time to grieve before all this starts and people to post stuff like this when it’s obviously fake it’s disgusting tbh, just so some people can speculate online, doesn’t matter where you stand on everything, people died that isn’t speculation that’s not a stance, that’s just the truth, but I do get ya ❤️
I also respect that. As long as people keep their controversial opinions in the conspiracy forums then I see no harm. But some do not.
It would be confirmed by all the witnesses to the make up if there were any.
That was already proven to be an AI image, bro. This sub is going so downhill wtf
His little selfie was real and bad enough. Why add fake shit into this?
Mods failing this sub on the daily man
Moderate harder, daddy
Oh they are, just not what they should be moderating.
How can one moderate a sub that definitely has been taken over by the inmates. The only obvious scene I see is that this man is an absolute attention whore who uses tragedy as a means to steer a narrative to fit his confirmation bias. Oh wait, that's you all too.
The make up pic is AI...it's obvious if you look at the writing on his T shirt.
Even if this is an AI photo. No one takes a fuckin selfie when there is a mass shooting going on..
But a sociopath / narcissistic personality would have no issues taking a selfie. Not saying anyone is one. But just saying.
Oh I agree. But really that opens a can of woms as to the legitimacy of this whole thing.
The photo of the "make up" keeps getting smaller and smaller. Now it hides everything but the sausage fingers of the lady
I have been railing on this topic.
Looks like a compressed image. So compressed in fact that it would be hard to identify any of the details that people are using as evidence for AI. So it seems odd to me that it's getting such a general consensus in a conspiracy community. It's "proven AI" a lot of users are saying. I'm not sure how you can prove that. There's plenty of lower res images where it's impossible to read the words on a rippled shirt.
Not only that. The posts that are staying on the front page with regards to this topic are showing less and less of the image in question. And all the old posts are either deleted by Reddit, or float around 0 votes.
All the top comments on these posts don't mention a stance though. They simply state that AI it making it impossible to tell. But Im pretty sure you don't need AI to falsify images. That concern predates AI, despite how AI could make it worse. Big muddying the water vibes to me.
A lot of comments with attitude about it too. I know we have a lot of overconfident jerks around here. Maybe myself included. But I don't think we have that many that are all willing to agree something isn't real.
Go ahead and look at my comment history. Pretty much everything I said about this is RIGHT around 0 votes. I can tell you that they have 50-100 voters on many of them. That's unusual.
Go ahead and try to find the original image in question yourself. And be honest. If you weren't aware of the event, and you didn't have a bunch of strangers online acting certain it was a faked image, what would you think?
I believe this is a bonafide leaked image that suggests footage was recorded in advance of the event. They used footage they knew they could believably superimposes over the event so they had what they needed to promote a narrative. You don't want to gamble on getting the footage you want if you're creating a false flag.
If so everything you're seeing here is damage control.
Just my opinion. I'm not an AI image expert. Are any of us?
And fucking furthermore. Comparing the image in question to the interview on the day of, and saying that details lack continuity only provides MORE evidence it was filmed in advance. The fake video would be his cellphone clip, which does not show the details of his shirt as far as I know. The interview was clearly legitimate to the date, faking that would be easy to cross reference as false by background details.
Please ask yourself. Why is a whole conspiracy subreddit telling you not to question something, and saying it harms the integrity of the community. I didn't see them do that for flat earth the same way. There's been plenty of topics to criticize for this. Why now?
Because the image is possibly real? Please please please think for yourself on this one. I don't mind if you think I'm wrong. But I do mind if you let others tell you to believe something. Do these comments feel organic to you? Why is the image in question getting less and less of the relevant details included in the upvoted posts? Do these comments seem like they want you to think for yourself?
There's only one kind of thought. Thinking for yourself. Anything else is acceptance, and an omission of self worth. What do YOU think?!
all that to say you don't know what you're talking about lol
You are right. You are not an expert.
The ear and nose give it away.
Can someone explain like im 5 what this is about?
AI slop has taken over the world at this point.
Truth is op is doing comrade jihadist cover better than any makeup
Every one is talking about this but no one is saying who he is or what happened
Flow through you... like the diarrhea this post is.
People are waking up. Australians are commenting on IG posts in droves about how the entire thing is a false flag.
Because of the fake AI photos like this one?
We live in a deceptive hellhole ruled by evil dark psychopaths.
Wtf are the mods doing, allowing this bullshit post.
Ffs! That pic is AI and I wish people would just check before posting because it’s one of those AI photos that will be put out purposely to make anything actual credible look crazy like this!
Either way it was a psyop
People are commenting that this is AI slop, so by the same token, you shouldn’t believe the fake news showing Muslims celebrating. Because, that is also fake. Thank you.
You actually think this is real lmao dude it's one of the biggest pictures and easiest to tell I've ever seen it's embarrassing if you honestly believe that that picture is real
So the phillipino ISIS combat camps are paid for by Ishriul?
AI Psyop
So the whole bondi beach was fake… thousands of people on a film set
Please stop the BS
They were hinting Jews
Its all too perfect "she was named Matilda because she was our first Australian"
The Great Noticing
Lol
Facebook had a “page transparency” view until recently. Is it just me or did everyone else lose that view?
There was a post saying that it was 13% positive to be AI generated. But most of it passed the scan as real. Honestly though who knows for sure in this day and age. It is bringing political unrest in Australia and most likely law changes.
Adventures of Baron von Munchausen " Open the door! "
So this is probably AI but what's really weird is it's the same guy who was apparently attacked on oct 7th in Israel. Also hearing rumours that the two muslim attackers are Isis members planted by Israel as a false flag op
So no one was killed in Australia? The son wasn’t taken down by a bystander? The dad wasn’t shot by a cop? I’m usually on board but this is complete bullshit. People lost their lives and it doesn’t matter what their ethnicity is, you are on the wrong side on this one.
Where’s the link?
Now guess their early life
Calculator quality crisis actors will end when a.i gets good enough no doubt .
This is ai. You know extremist muslim is the reason bhind this. Just accept it.
There’s the psy op. Take the evil off the Israelis and place it where it rightly belongs, the Musies, right?
Taqqiya is working overtime.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/israel-middle-east/arsen-ostrovsky-interview
Fake...
A YouTuber said that every Aussie cop carries a pistol (gun) and in that 11 minutes of rampage the cops didn’t nothing.
Took one Muslim watermelon seller at the expense of two bullets in him to disarm one of the terrorist.
Bloke is a fraud
You clowns are in denial lol
So is this thread primarily antisemitic at this point?
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No, it’s AI.
Come on now. Look at the shirt.
I don't think it's ai.
Bloke is a fraud.
Sorry, not sorry
Is what it is
Look at his shirt.
You’re incredibly gullible.
You're either a bot or a goof
Look at a high quality image. Specifically, look at the fingers, cars in the background, and text on the shirt.
If you still don’t think it is AI, I would like you to explain each of those aspects and why they look AI generated.