During this recent storm, I was the only “have” on my street, but that’s because I was fortunate enough to own a home and to be able to afford solar and battery backup. This is one of the secondary divides that’s be created over the last few years. I would much rather the grid work for everyone, and provide cheap power for everyone. But I’ll be damned if I’m not going to do what’s right by me until we can get this solved.
Is your battery installation more than 20 kWh (before the battery restrictions)?
I’ve been thinking about installing home battery backup, but the 20 kWh limit doesn’t seem nearly enough for anything useful for a multifamily building in an event like this.
We are at exactly 20kWh. That was on the high end of what our installer claimed we needed. I agree with the idea of wanting more, though. 20kWh is barely enough to make it to the next time the sun comes out, especially if it’s raining.
I think the only way to get more is to get an EV that can do vehicle to home charging, because my car already has like 90kWh which makes this restriction sorta dumb
From a cursory Google search, it looks like you can have up to 80 in a garage. You just can’t have more than 20 in a 3 foot space, so you need the space to install multiple 20kWh packs away from each other.
We in Santa Clara kept power, because we the people own the power company. That's right, Socialism. Therefore, we're not cutting corners on maintenance and upgrades trying make money for shareholders, bonuses for execs and taxes for the feds. We actually keep our systems well maintained and up to date so they can withstand severe weather. All the while, charging our users 4x less than what PG&E charges their users.
Our neighborhood in Santa Clara lost power for about three hours. By the time I got to the website, they had already identified the outage, and not even 15 minutes later they had a truck in the neighborhood. They quoted restoration times and restored power way ahead of schedule. A couple of UPS kept the internet going, I didn't even have to fire up the power station.
My last power outage on PGE they kept postponing the restoration time.
Silicon Valley Power was one of the reasons I went back to Santa Clara. If you count all utilities, even paying more rent, I'm still ahead.
The real power is in not having to subsidize maintenance costs (and liability from wildfires) for transmission and distribution lines over a hundred miles away in the Sierra.
I think this model makes sense, but would mean power would get a lot more expensive for people in certain parts of the state (which it probably should, to reflect the true costs of living in those rural locations)
Great. Make people bear the costs for choosing to live where they do. If society decides to subsidize those for whatever reason it should come through the government, not some arbitrarily distributed monopoly.
Many remote locations could be served by low voltage micro grids using solar and batteries or in some cases small hydro with gravity storage.
Non-remote locations could also benefit from such micro grids while also being connected to distant large hydro, geothermal, large solar and nuclear. But first we gotta take the wolves of Wall Street out of the equation.
It would cost the same as it costs PG&E, minus the shareholder dividends, exec bonuses, and fed taxes. Plus costs would eventually come down, because the money saved would be rolled back into to maintenance and upgrades leading to fewer incidents and lawsuits, saving even more money.
That's just not true, the current cost structure is distributed. The majority of the burden would fall to local ratepayers in those locations. Even if it was converted to publicly run, the costs are still there to deal with the liabilities and maintenance. It would stabilize over time, but would reflect the real costs of living in a rural landscape in a state like CA with challenging terrain, aging infrastructure, and a rapidly changing climate.
That's just not true. It would be the same, minus dividend payouts, exec bonuses and fed taxes. The terrain doesn't change just because there's a new owner.
PG&E covers a large area and forces many people to pay more to cover those higher costs elsewhere. If it’s broken into smaller parts (like the neighborhood example), some would likely stop subsidizing rural areas outside their coverage area.
Don't break it into smaller parts. Keep it the same, just have the state take over ownership. No more paying dividends to shareholders, no bonuses to execs, no paying fed taxes. Everything else can stay the same.
It also helps that most of Santa Clara's power distribution system is below the streets and not on power poles like the older neighborhoods of San Francisco where it's exposed to the harsh weather.
If you take everything PG&E has...their infrastructure, their workforce, their assets...and then you subtract the dividend payouts to shareholders, the bonuses for execs, and the federal taxes they pay...which would cost more...the current PG&E, or the PG&E minus those things? Would the cost of maintaining those above ground lines go up just because you're not paying taxes on them? Would the cost on the above ground lines go up just because you're not paying dividends to shareholders? Would the cost of those above ground lines go up just because you're not paying exec bonuses?
You can shill all you want for PG&E, but your math just doesn't add up.
if this is a concern, rent/buy a house or apartment close to a hospital. areas of the grid where hospitals reside are prioritized for obvious reasons. there have been thousands of power outages in the last ten years in my area, but I can count on one hand the number of hours I've been without electricity in that time. been in the Bay area for 25 years and the difference is aparrent.
“Thousands of power outages in the last ten years”… excuse me, but where the heck do you live, South Africa? You’re talking about an outage at least once every three days?
Here in the Bay, such outages are so rare that you’d be pretty crazy to weigh it so heavily in your calculus on where to live. I feel like living next to a hospital would carry plenty of its own downsides that are there EVERY DAY like ambulances screaming down the road
It does not, I'm not op, but if you count all the distinct outages across the bay, it's likely that high.
Besides that, I was responding to this, specifically: "such outages are so rare that you’d be pretty crazy to weigh it so heavily in your calculus on where to live"
If I knew that buying a house a quarter mile from where I did meant dozens of fewer outages, I would have. They are not very rare for many in the bay area.
It's tricky, they don't publish the boundaries of the grid areas as far as I know (and this is probably why.) You can usually look up your own, and maybe individual addresses, but I don't think there's a public database you can just browse.
"Some of the disparities appeared due to PG&E’s prioritizations: While much of the Richmond remained without power Sunday evening, the company touted on social media that it had helped “secure temporary generation” that allowed the 7 p.m. performance of “The Nutcracker” at the War Memorial Opera House to go on. "
Too bad Gavin Newsom's CPUC probably agrees this is highest in importance second only to hospitals.
I was in living in Danville/San Ramon a couple of years ago and they are doing rolling blackouts and sent out a map of areas that were going to be without power.
It was almost comical how the borders were drawn. Blackhawk, Alamo and half of Danville were fine. But the areas with low income/affordable housing complexes in Danville/San Ramon were cut off. Seemed a little suspicious.
Yeah batteries have their place, but not everyone owns and/or can afford $10k or more for a system that can run for days. A generator for a few to several hundred will power essentials or more for basically unlimited time as long as you can get a few more gallons of fuel after a day.
Keep fuel stabilizer in it if using gasoline and you’re always good to go.
2-3 years ago, the power in my neighborhood was out for four days straight, up for 1/2 day, then out again for another two days. Brutal storm. Rain and high-winds. It happens. Seeing the PG&E workers going on power poles in that torrential weather gave me new respect for the dangerous work they do.
What I ended up doing was buying a generator, and high-capacity battery-powered lantern, battery DC-AC adapter, and a few high-capacity batteries which I always keep charged during this kind of weather. I also would walk a few blocks where there was power and enjoy a good cocktail, restaurant and even bump into my neighbors doing the exact same thing. Walking the neighborhood at night during a full blackout I also found quite relaxing.
That one 4-day blackout had me realizing that it was the first major blockout in years. Four days out of hundreds. I consider that pretty good regardless. Many Redditors crying about it would be the first ones to go in a zombie apocalypse.
During this recent storm, I was the only “have” on my street, but that’s because I was fortunate enough to own a home and to be able to afford solar and battery backup. This is one of the secondary divides that’s be created over the last few years. I would much rather the grid work for everyone, and provide cheap power for everyone. But I’ll be damned if I’m not going to do what’s right by me until we can get this solved.
Same here, I’m in a circle and only one other house has solar with battery backup. I always feel like my house is lit up like a target in the Purge.
Is your battery installation more than 20 kWh (before the battery restrictions)?
I’ve been thinking about installing home battery backup, but the 20 kWh limit doesn’t seem nearly enough for anything useful for a multifamily building in an event like this.
We are at exactly 20kWh. That was on the high end of what our installer claimed we needed. I agree with the idea of wanting more, though. 20kWh is barely enough to make it to the next time the sun comes out, especially if it’s raining.
I think the only way to get more is to get an EV that can do vehicle to home charging, because my car already has like 90kWh which makes this restriction sorta dumb
From a cursory Google search, it looks like you can have up to 80 in a garage. You just can’t have more than 20 in a 3 foot space, so you need the space to install multiple 20kWh packs away from each other.
We in Santa Clara kept power, because we the people own the power company. That's right, Socialism. Therefore, we're not cutting corners on maintenance and upgrades trying make money for shareholders, bonuses for execs and taxes for the feds. We actually keep our systems well maintained and up to date so they can withstand severe weather. All the while, charging our users 4x less than what PG&E charges their users.
Our neighborhood in Santa Clara lost power for about three hours. By the time I got to the website, they had already identified the outage, and not even 15 minutes later they had a truck in the neighborhood. They quoted restoration times and restored power way ahead of schedule. A couple of UPS kept the internet going, I didn't even have to fire up the power station.
My last power outage on PGE they kept postponing the restoration time.
Silicon Valley Power was one of the reasons I went back to Santa Clara. If you count all utilities, even paying more rent, I'm still ahead.
The real power is in not having to subsidize maintenance costs (and liability from wildfires) for transmission and distribution lines over a hundred miles away in the Sierra.
I think this model makes sense, but would mean power would get a lot more expensive for people in certain parts of the state (which it probably should, to reflect the true costs of living in those rural locations)
Great. Make people bear the costs for choosing to live where they do. If society decides to subsidize those for whatever reason it should come through the government, not some arbitrarily distributed monopoly.
Many remote locations could be served by low voltage micro grids using solar and batteries or in some cases small hydro with gravity storage.
Non-remote locations could also benefit from such micro grids while also being connected to distant large hydro, geothermal, large solar and nuclear. But first we gotta take the wolves of Wall Street out of the equation.
I'm with you on that.
It would cost the same as it costs PG&E, minus the shareholder dividends, exec bonuses, and fed taxes. Plus costs would eventually come down, because the money saved would be rolled back into to maintenance and upgrades leading to fewer incidents and lawsuits, saving even more money.
That's just not true, the current cost structure is distributed. The majority of the burden would fall to local ratepayers in those locations. Even if it was converted to publicly run, the costs are still there to deal with the liabilities and maintenance. It would stabilize over time, but would reflect the real costs of living in a rural landscape in a state like CA with challenging terrain, aging infrastructure, and a rapidly changing climate.
That's just not true. It would be the same, minus dividend payouts, exec bonuses and fed taxes. The terrain doesn't change just because there's a new owner.
PG&E covers a large area and forces many people to pay more to cover those higher costs elsewhere. If it’s broken into smaller parts (like the neighborhood example), some would likely stop subsidizing rural areas outside their coverage area.
Don't break it into smaller parts. Keep it the same, just have the state take over ownership. No more paying dividends to shareholders, no bonuses to execs, no paying fed taxes. Everything else can stay the same.
State run utilities are common in every free market nation. No need to get all commie.
I like to toy with the mouth breathers.
It also helps that most of Santa Clara's power distribution system is below the streets and not on power poles like the older neighborhoods of San Francisco where it's exposed to the harsh weather.
If you take everything PG&E has...their infrastructure, their workforce, their assets...and then you subtract the dividend payouts to shareholders, the bonuses for execs, and the federal taxes they pay...which would cost more...the current PG&E, or the PG&E minus those things? Would the cost of maintaining those above ground lines go up just because you're not paying taxes on them? Would the cost on the above ground lines go up just because you're not paying dividends to shareholders? Would the cost of those above ground lines go up just because you're not paying exec bonuses?
You can shill all you want for PG&E, but your math just doesn't add up.
How do you know the systems are well maintained in Santa Clara? Do you work for the utility? Do you physically maintain the equipment?
if this is a concern, rent/buy a house or apartment close to a hospital. areas of the grid where hospitals reside are prioritized for obvious reasons. there have been thousands of power outages in the last ten years in my area, but I can count on one hand the number of hours I've been without electricity in that time. been in the Bay area for 25 years and the difference is aparrent.
Don't forget jail. The houses around b Santa Rita jail never lose power
Can confirm, near a hospital. One to two outages in 10 years.
“Thousands of power outages in the last ten years”… excuse me, but where the heck do you live, South Africa? You’re talking about an outage at least once every three days?
Here in the Bay, such outages are so rare that you’d be pretty crazy to weigh it so heavily in your calculus on where to live. I feel like living next to a hospital would carry plenty of its own downsides that are there EVERY DAY like ambulances screaming down the road
It really depends on where in the bay you live. My suburban peninsula house sees multiple per year.
“Multiple per year” x 25 years does not equal “thousands.”
It does not, I'm not op, but if you count all the distinct outages across the bay, it's likely that high.
Besides that, I was responding to this, specifically: "such outages are so rare that you’d be pretty crazy to weigh it so heavily in your calculus on where to live"
If I knew that buying a house a quarter mile from where I did meant dozens of fewer outages, I would have. They are not very rare for many in the bay area.
Where are you that the PG&E is so stable?
PG&E drops my connection 2-3 times a week. The power comes back in a minute or two, but my rice maker has to get plugged into a UPS.
Or near a fire station.
It's tricky, they don't publish the boundaries of the grid areas as far as I know (and this is probably why.) You can usually look up your own, and maybe individual addresses, but I don't think there's a public database you can just browse.
Or get a Generac
How near?
Or a fire station. Pure luck bet we're on the same circuit as the local fire station. We have lost power before but usually not for long.
living next to a hospital sounds like a very smart move for multiple reasons.
Con: Lots of ambulance noise.
ah, yes. of course there will always be compromise. maybe near a hospital, but not too close.
We had power, but we also had an open neutral. That was fun.
"Some of the disparities appeared due to PG&E’s prioritizations: While much of the Richmond remained without power Sunday evening, the company touted on social media that it had helped “secure temporary generation” that allowed the 7 p.m. performance of “The Nutcracker” at the War Memorial Opera House to go on. "
Too bad Gavin Newsom's CPUC probably agrees this is highest in importance second only to hospitals.
Anyone else lose power again yesterday? We were dark for five hours between 10-3 in the outer sunset.
I would invest in portsble batteries between 1kw to 3lw at least. Those will keep the essentials running for days if needed.
Yup.
I'd just like to add that they should ideally be LFP batteries. They can survive many more cycles compared to lithium ion.
I noticed once I moved to a "Nicer" neighborhood my power never went out. Go figure 🤷🏻♂️
Nothing to do with neighborhood. My Los Altos hills house in 8 figure house price neighborhood had 5-6 blackouts this year.
If you are in newer neighborhoods power lines are underground, that’s the main difference.
I was in living in Danville/San Ramon a couple of years ago and they are doing rolling blackouts and sent out a map of areas that were going to be without power.
It was almost comical how the borders were drawn. Blackhawk, Alamo and half of Danville were fine. But the areas with low income/affordable housing complexes in Danville/San Ramon were cut off. Seemed a little suspicious.
we wouldnt have noticed any blackout until we saw neighbor’s house, or a text from pg&e
Thank god we have a tri fuel generator. Honestly it’s why we kept power going. Yall need to invest in one it’s a great clutch tool
Yeah batteries have their place, but not everyone owns and/or can afford $10k or more for a system that can run for days. A generator for a few to several hundred will power essentials or more for basically unlimited time as long as you can get a few more gallons of fuel after a day.
Keep fuel stabilizer in it if using gasoline and you’re always good to go.
2-3 years ago, the power in my neighborhood was out for four days straight, up for 1/2 day, then out again for another two days. Brutal storm. Rain and high-winds. It happens. Seeing the PG&E workers going on power poles in that torrential weather gave me new respect for the dangerous work they do.
What I ended up doing was buying a generator, and high-capacity battery-powered lantern, battery DC-AC adapter, and a few high-capacity batteries which I always keep charged during this kind of weather. I also would walk a few blocks where there was power and enjoy a good cocktail, restaurant and even bump into my neighbors doing the exact same thing. Walking the neighborhood at night during a full blackout I also found quite relaxing.
That one 4-day blackout had me realizing that it was the first major blockout in years. Four days out of hundreds. I consider that pretty good regardless. Many Redditors crying about it would be the first ones to go in a zombie apocalypse.
We got a couple of teslawalls for the exactly same reason - overpriced and unreliable PG&E