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And the last time Nescient ran for a position, he didn't have to lie about his membership levels. Oh, Wait, yes, he did, in fact fake them. Nescient likes to exaggerate. Bet he is really good at it, too.
Okie dokie. Well, I hope you look forward to telling the "common sense" people the definition. It really helps a joke when you need to explain it. Sure to catch on.
I assume you say your name is fitting because someone else gave it to you? All your thoughts have been created by someone else?
If you’re trying to appeal to a crowd that favours Calvin pees on someone’s name bumper stickers you might as well just use the slurs you’re all thinking about. It’ll get you to your bumpkin in group faster.
and he's speaker, meaning he technically isn't supposed to weigh in on anything other than procedure.
also if you ever talk to him, notice how he starts blinking rapidly once you shift from polite conversation to politics. I want to play poker with him.
Nobody is going to go from government to a backbencher without party status. If you're a rural MLA, you have a better chance at winning as a UCP MLA than as an Alberta party MLA
Depends how sick of the seat-of-the-pants separatist rhetoric people are; plenty would be glad to flip for a sane Tory party, wouldn’t be surprised by a majority
The Alberta Republicans have a list of MLAs who support separatism, and it's like all the UCP. Most of the UCP MLAs were backed by Take Back Alberta, so they're pretty far right.
That’s what I mean though, I think the treason is wearing thin for even long time conservative voters, and the UCP is going to lose more seats than they think to a halfway sane conservative/tory party
The second it looks bad, the UCP will campaign on a vote split, saying that the NDP are socialists and a vote for the Alberta Party is a vote for the NDP.
I mean, rural was fed up with what 'Elitest PCs'; and then when the ANDP got in, opposition made farm safety look like the government was going to swarm in unannounced and take the farm away.
Clear messaging of policy before the slippery slope arguments come in.
UCP seems intent on easy button mashing while taking Alberta to the cleaners.
Eh, you say this, but I just spent Christmas in rural northern Alberta, and trust me, a lot of lifelong PCs are pissed with the UCP. The biggest issue I saw, is the general attitude of, "I hate the UCP, but I hate the NDP more". What a lot of them aren't aware, is that the Tories are going to be a real option in the next election, and that the UCP is controlled by a board of separatists.
Literally as soon as I mentioned that the UCP are controlled by separatists, and that the Tories are aiming to return to Lougheed's PC politics. Almost everyone of them, except for the people that are separatists, fully support the Tories.
The message that everyone needs to start pushing out there, including the NDP, is that the UCP are no longer the PC party, the are separatists wearing the conservative name to trick voters, and the Tories are the return of the legacy progressive conservative party.
I really believe the next Alberta vote will be the hardest fought in Canadian history. I am in the city and so my vote gets wiped out pretty quickly, so my attention will be focused on waiting for Carney's next measure to hurt the middle class.
Did any of you notice, the MSM has not aired any footage of Mr. Carney talking about immigration levels. No, never in Canada's modern history has 7% of the population been here less than 5 years. You are a complete idiot to think Mr. Trudeau or Mr. Carney gave ANYONE the heads up what to expect. We can't create that many houses, that many schools and hospitals so we are making hotel owner rich. We are not blaming you NDP for this problem. STOP trying to pin it on the UCP. We are all doing the best we can. Why is it only teachers and nurses and postal carriers can strike? Why can't Albertans? Seriously. The recalls are going to happen. Congratulations. There will be a vote to see if the MLA should be fired. The there will be a byelection in those ridings where the vote was to turf the person. All in all, if it goes to a byelection in those ridings. It's going to cost taxpayers over $75 million, I said $100 million before, but I was wrong it's only about $75 million, so that's what should be taken off the teacher's salaries in the negotiations. Sound fair?
Premier Danielle Smith said recently she’ll stick with the official date. Nenshi isn’t buying it.
“In the Opposition, we’re ready if they call an election in spring,” he said in a year-end interview.
“We’ll go if they call in the fall, we’ll go if they wait until 2027.
“Let’s never forget, this is the smallest majority Alberta has ever had. If any of the recalls are successful, it’s going to destabilize their government in a very big way."
I really really wish the Alberta Party had been able to get the name Progressive Conservatives of Alberta just to bleed more votes from the UCP.
Again as I said on the other post tonight it is hilarious in a dark comedy way that the UCP made sure they couldn't use the name Conservative because they are so worried about allowing conservative voters to have any other choice on the ballot that has that name.
These are con artist grifter predators that just do scandal after scandal and corruption after corruption.
Not sure a simple name is going to be enough to get moderate conservatives to switch votes, especially when they start to engage with party members and find out it is mostly left wingers LARPing as a conservative party simply to syphon votes and get the NDP to victory.
I think people are going to be able to see past that pretty quick. Unless they absolutely are not paying attention at all, might catch those ones.
Pretty sure lots of people are low information voters. Smith didn’t campaign explicitly on anything she did after elected, but she said she’d do most of this stuff in the years leading up to becoming conservative leader.
She sure does say that a lot! She really thinks that ~7k votes her party won by was an overwhelming endorsement of her being crowned an absolute ruler.
Not sure what you are basing that on, as they have not said much of anything for some time.
I used to be an AP member a few years back, and have been less political party active in the past few years.
Perhaps in the past, sure, but lately - the board has been silent, Guthrie has been in the seat long enough to make a sandwich. Anything I hear from casual party members I still talk to is that social media is just a meme farm from the hard left Reboot Alberta group, clearly looking to use the party purely to advance the NDP to power.
I am not sure what you are basing your judgement on, as they haven't produced anything of substance to go off of...
Wtf are you basing your assertions that they're LARPing liberals on?
I personally know Guthrie, and a large number of the potential candidate's none of who have been publicly announced yet.
Not a single one of them are "liberals" it's all long time PC supporters, former members, and people that strongly believe in the vision that Lougheed had for the province. All who are sick of the UCP's bullshit and don't want a massive reactionary swing to the left that will put the NDP in power and risk us trotting down BC's path.
Yea shit's been silent, because the party was down to <200 paying members before Guthrie was put in charge, and they had no real leadership for years. All that shit doesn't get magically fixed in 2 weeks after a new leader steps in, and Guthrie is balancing not only his current role as an MLA, but also rebuilding the party, and preparing for a potential February election.
I'd say that, to the extent the Progressive Tory Party is successful in getting moderate conservatives to switch votes, that's likely to hurt the ANDP more than help it. The ANDP is already the de facto centrist party, with support from plenty of "progressive conservatives" that can't stomach the UCP. The new PTP--assuming it gets off the ground enough to be relevant at all--might poach a few votes from the not-so-right flank of the UCP but I suspect it would poach more from the centrist/progressive conservative flank of the ANDP, ultimately splitting the centrist(ish) vote. Personally I think the most likely scenario is that the PTP is a relative non-factor this election, just like the Alberta Party has been, but IF they gain some momentum then I think the next most likely scenario is a UCP plurality in the popular vote and increased chances of another UCP majority in the legislature.
I appreciate that perspective, it is an interesting take but as I read it, I found it entirely plausible.
I feel like if this was the case, what we would see at election time (as we do with every election lately it seems) are the increasing cries to "vote strategically - just this time" which is turning into every time. Then, but for the few totally disenfranchised and disgruntled voters, most lose their nerve and default back to one or the other.
So, the more I think about it, the more I tend to think you are correct. That right here and now is the most we could be talking about this party, as the closer we get to game time, the less relevant they become.
How far to the insanity of the right do you have to be to see Guthrie and Sinclair as "left wingers LARPing as conservatives"?
This is just proof positive the UCP - and their voters - have gone completely off the fucking deep end.
If you see Guthrie and Sinclair as Conservative LARPers, that pretty much puts the observer as a Christofascist, or a separatist - and in either case, not someone whose political opinions should matter, at all.
Lets not intentionally obfuscate the reality here.
Guthrie and Sinclair have been in the party long enough to make a sandwich. There have been a steady trickle of new members, the ones who voted in the AGM the other month - Before Guthrie was even around - who are taking the party in a new direction of running blocker for the NDP.
Lets not make it sound like Guthrie and Sinclair started some party here. They inherited the membership and board that already existed and are going to have to deal with center right moderates and others who want a legitimate party that puts forward policy issues, and the Reboot Alberta crowd who only see the party as a sponge to soak up votes from the UCP.
Guthrie and Sinclair's political career is over as they inherited a gong show.
Please, please, PLEASE focus on Policy. We all know the UCP sucks, tell people how you're different, and what you'll change. Otherwise, people will get discouraged and WON'T GO OUT TO VOTE and we'll be stuck with more years of this shit.
As a Calgarian, I know i don't need to tell Nenshi this because he's a ridiculously smart man, and a decent politician who knows the game. This is more directed to the OTHER NDP members. Get your shit together. Ceci can also fuck off completely.
I go to the meetings, he has been very clear he knows the UCP wants this to be about culture war bullshit.
as for counter policy, an opposition party has to really pick their moment to switch from generalized counter arguments, to giving specific ones. to my mind the hour is near.
I agree. I will continue to vote NDP, but the last time they were in power, I'd say they acted like they were paralyzed by fear that if they did anything they'd be called *gasp* socialists. Despite this careful approach not to open themselves up to criticism, they lost the election in 2019, anyway. This is the time to be bold. Make noticeable, positive changes in peoples' lives through policy. The right-wing will cry over everything - so what, let them. They're as inclined to whine about the social safety net as use it.
Unfortunately for the NDP, Alberta is very little C conservative. If Notley had been more radical, she would have been out even before her four years was up. I think she was clever and did well at capitalizing on the opportunity. Trudeau was still in vogue back then and things didn't completely fall apart. Voters will remember that whenever it is the UCP finally falls out of favour.
Because no one believed it. Notley saying taxes won't be raised but somehow there will be more money for everything is just nonsense. Makes them look like they are being unserious. I think she even said they'd spend less royalty revenues as well. Like how do they think that would work?
If your whole platform is based around the UCP not spending enough money on Healthcare and Education you have to have a way to pay for it it. The fact that they don't seem capable of saying how makes talking about policy impossible for Nenshi. If he says anything substantial he'd then have to pay for it. So hes stuck talking about fringe topics constantly that majority of people don't care about
Personally they'd be better off proposing a PST and then having a list of things that it would pay for
If you increase economic activity, revenue goes up with no new taxes. existing tax revenue increases proportionally with new activity. But this time around the NDP will have to raise taxes from the extinction level the UCP has lowered them to.
That's just silly. An absolutely fantastic government policy would be lucky to get a .5% gdp increase over an average policy. And again, half of the ndp takling points are the UCP being too business friendly. So again, they're stuck.
Too business friendly because they've cut taxes that should have been generating revenue for the province to do the things that the government should be doing. Instead, they've gutted everything.
So again, gutted everything by being to business friendly but the NDP will spend more and finance it by growing the economy more.
Like you have to realize how fucking crazy that sounds to the average person. If that's their strategy again next election everyone involved should be fired.
What are you talking about? The money is there and has always been there. The issue is how the UCP spends money.
Education is a simple matter: stop building private schools and there’s your money.
Healthcare has similar issues with how they choose to spend. They blew through 100 million on dynalife. Another 70 million on Tylenol. How much wasted on private surgery clinics that they intimidated then fired the CEO over? We don’t know yet but I bet it’s another 9 figures wasted.
It’s a real shame that the tax boogeyman trope holds so much power over Albertans, the Mannings and their think tanks sure did a number on all of you.
The money isn't there though. Like wtf, we're going to have a gigantic deficit and in the mean time NDP are saying they'd raise healthcare spending by tens of billions. Shit, a new teacher contract would eat up most of those items in a year.
And they aren't going to touch private schools. The crush of people, specifically special needs children that would rush back to public schools would fuck everything up. They love only having to pay 70% for those kids. If they were in public school it would cost them 300% of a normal kid.
So, the fact that the PC’s didn’t fund special needs well enough makes you believe that the public system cannot? How does someone do it that can’t afford private school, eh?
You should be advocating for more support in public school, not more mistreatment of all our kids because you have a tenuous connection to someone that you think benefits from the private system.
You realize most private schools don’t take special needs, right? There wouldn’t be any problem with incorporating those kids back into the system, except perhaps with classrooms. There’s nothing stopping them leasing the existing spaces those kids are learning in though, eh, so those kids might not even need to learn a new path to commute.
It’s not even your kid and you’re working hard to keep it shitty for the rest of them. SMH.
I mean sure, if the public system wants to massively increase special needs funding that would be great for my niece. She'd go back to public if they spent more money.
How they think that will save money I do not understand though. My sister is funding most of it right now. If they want to cover what she spends she'd be thrilled. Public system buying out her private space and not charging tuition for the same services would in no way save money
I have a buddy who gave uo his wife to move to Vancouver because they had a school that would accept and work with his severely austistuc child.
You must understand that this is a conservative choice. They underfund our schools and have since King Ralph decided to balance the budget on the backs of the working poor.
It’s a matter of choice and I can attest to the amount of supports that showed up for special needs during the NDP. All of a sudden at my wife’s daycare there were three speech pathologists and a social worker present every week. Since the UCP cut the EA budgets it’s been nothing.
Who we vote for matters, and being allowed to pay to do the government’s job is not what parents or siblings of parents should be advocating for.
They said they would increase the corporate tax rate to 10%.
Their healthcare plans were accepted, and their economic plans were well-received, too. The economic fast pass was huge and gave tons of predictability for corporations and there were plenty more.
Corporate taxes aren't a real tax. They are a tax deferral. Corporate taxes could be 0% or 40% and same amount of money goes to the government at the end of the day. It's just less consistent.
Which again, Nenshi/Notley know that. That's not a revenue generating policy.
And unfortunately with the amount of province damage she's caused and 1 more year to cause even more damage beyond repair; Nenshi will have to say; nothing can be fixed in 4 years it'll take many years to correct the damage and malpractice she's caused; fist thing NDP will fix is the healthcare and try to hire more medical professions to make wait times more manageable not the 12+ hours just to be triaged that should be the starting point for their campaing
No. everything can be repealed quickly in a big omnibus bill and then orders in council can establish rapid fire public inquiries. A lot can change fast with the implementation of a progressive income tax and large monthly tax credits payments to anyone making less than $35k or $40k a year.
I mean, while I personally would agree with those policies, that's sure as hell not going to get the NDP elected in Alberta. It might mean they win a few Edmonton ridings by 75% instead of 60% but they'd lose overall.
A lot can change fast with the implementation of a progressive income tax and large monthly tax credits payments to anyone making less than $35k or $40k a year.
Sooooo.... we're just gonna tax people even more than they're already paying? People are already struggling to make ends meet as it is with the rediculous province and city tax we're paying currently and only taxing them even more is just gonna upset them more.
People do not in fact know the UCP sucks. Nobody’s been telling them, and conservatives are very good at shifting the blame for public service failures onto providers and local governments
You're fine with Smith because you're either a high earning, childless urbanite, or a rural knob who hasn't realized UCP policies have fucked you over yet.
Im a conservative millenial, and the UCP has objectively fucked this province over for the next 15 years. At least.
"Objectively fucked" - right-o buds. We'll see about that one, won't we.
I'll believe you're a conservative right after I believe people with penises are women. Smith isn't my favourite but I'd take her over Nenshi every time.
It's the downside of being able to curate a life for yourself when you will never come in contact with people you disagree with.
It reminds me of one of my American relatives who was based on door knocking 100% confident that his district was going to, for the first time in thirty years go Democratic. What he failed to recognize is he was volunteering for a GOTV drive and the neighbourhoods he was canvasing were already blue.
The Republicans crushed it as they always do and he was ranting and raving about Elon Musk hacking the voting machines.
If Smith understood and respected our system of Westminster democracy, she would call an election to be fought over holding an independence referendum. She did not run on a referendum and should be bringing it to the people.
We need a very strong NDP to unfuck what the ucp fucked up then sue the breaks off Daniel Smith for trans rights teachers rights n what she did to the special needs people of Alberta, I wanna see the Daniel Smith lose everything
With the progressive Tory party being a thing now, and the separatist Republicans, I feel like the vote split might JUST be enough to gut the UCP core enough to slide a second NDP win in. And Nenshi basically has a playbook on how to avoid a Naughtly style crash, especially if he manages to win out against the UCP, which was formed to prevent another NDP win specifically.
Hoping Smith pulls the trigger on an early election, so I can sprint to the booths day one and vote for the NDP for the first time.
With the progressive Tory party being a thing now, and the separatist Republicans, I feel like the vote split might JUST be enough to gut the UCP core enough to slide a second NDP win in.
Why leave it to chance?
If you want the UCP out why not push the NDP to have good policies and candidates that Albertans want.
The current polls in recent electoral history, make it plain that the UCP would win handily if an election was called tomorrow. I don’t think it’s impossible that the NDP could win eventually, but it doesn’t help that Nenshi appears to not grasp the reality of his current situation. Without acknowledging that, it’s going to be difficult to make the changes required to win.
The current polls in recent electoral history, make it plain that the UCP would win handily if an election was called tomorrow.
last polls were in november, and gave the UCP a three seat lead over NDP; recent electoral history shows a shift to the left on polling made before the writ is dropped.
she won by 1600 votes in specific calgary ridings. that makes her a perfectly legitimate leader, but her mandate extremely weak. her actions are one who won a strong mandate.
Yes, that's how things work on paper. But who actually votes for the specific candidate in their riding without reference to the leader? Nobody. When people vote for Joe Foodtruck in Cypress-Medicine Hat, they are voting for Dani and her policy platform.
reminder that the NDP did well in the polls until election day. I would love to see the UCP not make it next time but theres a point where being overconfident is a thing.
I'm confident in the NDP's chances, but what I'm certain of is that we don't have certain elections in this province anymore. a UPC blowout, like we used to expect, is the least likely outcome to my mind.
I agree… It’ll take a Herculean effort to undo the damage AND a willingness to stand up to insane amount bullshit. Good and respectable people are going to step outside their comfort zones to do what is right.
It’s a real shame that ignorance (and even treason!?!?) seems to be celebrated these days.
That's some pretty big chihuahua energy Nenshi has going on, what with the spring sitting likely not until February.
He's only daring them and ready to crush because he knows it isn't going to happen. Remember when 77,000 NDP 'members' elected him, then the year after we're down to 17,000 members?
Sure would be nice if all these convenient johnny-come-lately NDP members renewed their memberships. Prove that what he's saying is true.
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I wanna see some floor crossings to the new Tory party, it’d be such sweet, sweet poetic justice
So last time Smith was a party leader she floor crossed. Be funny as hell if muscle memory kicked in and she did it again.
It'd be even funnier if she whined about it.
Oh you know she'll go full offense if anyone crosses with a militant lack of awareness
It would be a 'No Homers' club for sure.
And the last time Nescient ran for a position, he didn't have to lie about his membership levels. Oh, Wait, yes, he did, in fact fake them. Nescient likes to exaggerate. Bet he is really good at it, too.
Might want to try something a little lower brow if you want your chosen nickname to resonate. As it is, it's pretty nonsensical.
Nescient Nenshi is fine by me. Truthful names are best. Just like mine.
Okie dokie. Well, I hope you look forward to telling the "common sense" people the definition. It really helps a joke when you need to explain it. Sure to catch on.
I assume you say your name is fitting because someone else gave it to you? All your thoughts have been created by someone else?
r/iamverysmart
If you’re trying to appeal to a crowd that favours Calvin pees on someone’s name bumper stickers you might as well just use the slurs you’re all thinking about. It’ll get you to your bumpkin in group faster.
the purges happened a while back, anyone who wanted to leave has already done so.
Rick McGiver is the only current MLA who was previously elected under PCs. They are all gone.
and he's speaker, meaning he technically isn't supposed to weigh in on anything other than procedure.
also if you ever talk to him, notice how he starts blinking rapidly once you shift from polite conversation to politics. I want to play poker with him.
That was before 20+ of them got put on notice tbf
not sure your point
They’re all self serving at the core; their positions of authority are at greater risk now because of how the UCP has been acting post-purge
Nobody is going to go from government to a backbencher without party status. If you're a rural MLA, you have a better chance at winning as a UCP MLA than as an Alberta party MLA
Depends how sick of the seat-of-the-pants separatist rhetoric people are; plenty would be glad to flip for a sane Tory party, wouldn’t be surprised by a majority
The Alberta Republicans have a list of MLAs who support separatism, and it's like all the UCP. Most of the UCP MLAs were backed by Take Back Alberta, so they're pretty far right.
That’s what I mean though, I think the treason is wearing thin for even long time conservative voters, and the UCP is going to lose more seats than they think to a halfway sane conservative/tory party
The second it looks bad, the UCP will campaign on a vote split, saying that the NDP are socialists and a vote for the Alberta Party is a vote for the NDP.
I’m sure they’ll grab at a lot of straws, making it as miserable as possible for the entire province. Would be naive to think otherwise
But ripping away our identify as Canadians? Thats a hot button that’s hard to unpress, and they’ve slapped away at it plenty by now
I mean, rural was fed up with what 'Elitest PCs'; and then when the ANDP got in, opposition made farm safety look like the government was going to swarm in unannounced and take the farm away.
Clear messaging of policy before the slippery slope arguments come in.
UCP seems intent on easy button mashing while taking Alberta to the cleaners.
Eh, you say this, but I just spent Christmas in rural northern Alberta, and trust me, a lot of lifelong PCs are pissed with the UCP. The biggest issue I saw, is the general attitude of, "I hate the UCP, but I hate the NDP more". What a lot of them aren't aware, is that the Tories are going to be a real option in the next election, and that the UCP is controlled by a board of separatists.
Literally as soon as I mentioned that the UCP are controlled by separatists, and that the Tories are aiming to return to Lougheed's PC politics. Almost everyone of them, except for the people that are separatists, fully support the Tories.
The message that everyone needs to start pushing out there, including the NDP, is that the UCP are no longer the PC party, the are separatists wearing the conservative name to trick voters, and the Tories are the return of the legacy progressive conservative party.
unfortunately, given how the CPC has threatened potential floor crossers, doubt anyone would actually dare to do it in AB
Smith --the current leader of the UCP-- while leader of the Wildrose Party, said there will be no more floor crossings, and then crossed the floor.
I really believe the next Alberta vote will be the hardest fought in Canadian history. I am in the city and so my vote gets wiped out pretty quickly, so my attention will be focused on waiting for Carney's next measure to hurt the middle class.
Did any of you notice, the MSM has not aired any footage of Mr. Carney talking about immigration levels. No, never in Canada's modern history has 7% of the population been here less than 5 years. You are a complete idiot to think Mr. Trudeau or Mr. Carney gave ANYONE the heads up what to expect. We can't create that many houses, that many schools and hospitals so we are making hotel owner rich. We are not blaming you NDP for this problem. STOP trying to pin it on the UCP. We are all doing the best we can. Why is it only teachers and nurses and postal carriers can strike? Why can't Albertans? Seriously. The recalls are going to happen. Congratulations. There will be a vote to see if the MLA should be fired. The there will be a byelection in those ridings where the vote was to turf the person. All in all, if it goes to a byelection in those ridings. It's going to cost taxpayers over $75 million, I said $100 million before, but I was wrong it's only about $75 million, so that's what should be taken off the teacher's salaries in the negotiations. Sound fair?
Nothing is stopping you from striking. It just works better when you have a collective doing it. Like a union.
When an influx of infrastructure announcement signs suddenly appear out of nowhere, you'll know an election is imminent.
They are all still up from the last election. And no work has begun.
I really really wish the Alberta Party had been able to get the name Progressive Conservatives of Alberta just to bleed more votes from the UCP.
Again as I said on the other post tonight it is hilarious in a dark comedy way that the UCP made sure they couldn't use the name Conservative because they are so worried about allowing conservative voters to have any other choice on the ballot that has that name.
These are con artist grifter predators that just do scandal after scandal and corruption after corruption.
Hustling marks is their game.
It still blows me away that a party can name themselves You See Pee and still form a majority.
I guess people forgot about the Conservative Reform Alliance Party.
Not sure a simple name is going to be enough to get moderate conservatives to switch votes, especially when they start to engage with party members and find out it is mostly left wingers LARPing as a conservative party simply to syphon votes and get the NDP to victory.
I think people are going to be able to see past that pretty quick. Unless they absolutely are not paying attention at all, might catch those ones.
Pretty sure lots of people are low information voters. Smith didn’t campaign explicitly on anything she did after elected, but she said she’d do most of this stuff in the years leading up to becoming conservative leader.
That is a fair point!
Smith says that she was given a mandate to do whatever it is that she feels like doing.
She sure does say that a lot! She really thinks that ~7k votes her party won by was an overwhelming endorsement of her being crowned an absolute ruler.
Idk how far your spectrum has been tweaked by the UCP, but the Tory party definitely reads as centre-right to me by any metric more than 10 years back
Not sure what you are basing that on, as they have not said much of anything for some time.
I used to be an AP member a few years back, and have been less political party active in the past few years.
Perhaps in the past, sure, but lately - the board has been silent, Guthrie has been in the seat long enough to make a sandwich. Anything I hear from casual party members I still talk to is that social media is just a meme farm from the hard left Reboot Alberta group, clearly looking to use the party purely to advance the NDP to power.
I am not sure what you are basing your judgement on, as they haven't produced anything of substance to go off of...
Wtf are you basing your assertions that they're LARPing liberals on?
I personally know Guthrie, and a large number of the potential candidate's none of who have been publicly announced yet.
Not a single one of them are "liberals" it's all long time PC supporters, former members, and people that strongly believe in the vision that Lougheed had for the province. All who are sick of the UCP's bullshit and don't want a massive reactionary swing to the left that will put the NDP in power and risk us trotting down BC's path.
Yea shit's been silent, because the party was down to <200 paying members before Guthrie was put in charge, and they had no real leadership for years. All that shit doesn't get magically fixed in 2 weeks after a new leader steps in, and Guthrie is balancing not only his current role as an MLA, but also rebuilding the party, and preparing for a potential February election.
Lol, "hard left"
Everything looks hard left from the far right: affordable daycare, public education, single-payer healthcare, accountability, empathy, etc.
I'd say that, to the extent the Progressive Tory Party is successful in getting moderate conservatives to switch votes, that's likely to hurt the ANDP more than help it. The ANDP is already the de facto centrist party, with support from plenty of "progressive conservatives" that can't stomach the UCP. The new PTP--assuming it gets off the ground enough to be relevant at all--might poach a few votes from the not-so-right flank of the UCP but I suspect it would poach more from the centrist/progressive conservative flank of the ANDP, ultimately splitting the centrist(ish) vote. Personally I think the most likely scenario is that the PTP is a relative non-factor this election, just like the Alberta Party has been, but IF they gain some momentum then I think the next most likely scenario is a UCP plurality in the popular vote and increased chances of another UCP majority in the legislature.
I appreciate that perspective, it is an interesting take but as I read it, I found it entirely plausible.
I feel like if this was the case, what we would see at election time (as we do with every election lately it seems) are the increasing cries to "vote strategically - just this time" which is turning into every time. Then, but for the few totally disenfranchised and disgruntled voters, most lose their nerve and default back to one or the other.
So, the more I think about it, the more I tend to think you are correct. That right here and now is the most we could be talking about this party, as the closer we get to game time, the less relevant they become.
Thanks for that input.
How far to the insanity of the right do you have to be to see Guthrie and Sinclair as "left wingers LARPing as conservatives"?
This is just proof positive the UCP - and their voters - have gone completely off the fucking deep end.
If you see Guthrie and Sinclair as Conservative LARPers, that pretty much puts the observer as a Christofascist, or a separatist - and in either case, not someone whose political opinions should matter, at all.
Lets not intentionally obfuscate the reality here.
Guthrie and Sinclair have been in the party long enough to make a sandwich. There have been a steady trickle of new members, the ones who voted in the AGM the other month - Before Guthrie was even around - who are taking the party in a new direction of running blocker for the NDP.
Lets not make it sound like Guthrie and Sinclair started some party here. They inherited the membership and board that already existed and are going to have to deal with center right moderates and others who want a legitimate party that puts forward policy issues, and the Reboot Alberta crowd who only see the party as a sponge to soak up votes from the UCP.
Guthrie and Sinclair's political career is over as they inherited a gong show.
Please, please, PLEASE focus on Policy. We all know the UCP sucks, tell people how you're different, and what you'll change. Otherwise, people will get discouraged and WON'T GO OUT TO VOTE and we'll be stuck with more years of this shit.
As a Calgarian, I know i don't need to tell Nenshi this because he's a ridiculously smart man, and a decent politician who knows the game. This is more directed to the OTHER NDP members. Get your shit together. Ceci can also fuck off completely.
I go to the meetings, he has been very clear he knows the UCP wants this to be about culture war bullshit.
as for counter policy, an opposition party has to really pick their moment to switch from generalized counter arguments, to giving specific ones. to my mind the hour is near.
I agree. I will continue to vote NDP, but the last time they were in power, I'd say they acted like they were paralyzed by fear that if they did anything they'd be called *gasp* socialists. Despite this careful approach not to open themselves up to criticism, they lost the election in 2019, anyway. This is the time to be bold. Make noticeable, positive changes in peoples' lives through policy. The right-wing will cry over everything - so what, let them. They're as inclined to whine about the social safety net as use it.
I think that's a fair criticism.
Unfortunately for the NDP, Alberta is very little C conservative. If Notley had been more radical, she would have been out even before her four years was up. I think she was clever and did well at capitalizing on the opportunity. Trudeau was still in vogue back then and things didn't completely fall apart. Voters will remember that whenever it is the UCP finally falls out of favour.
I don't know how many piles of money the UCP has to set fire to before their base clues in.
Exactly, only their problems are just and morality absolute. They are the exception.
Only they are deserving, while others aren't.
That’s some revisionism that makes it seem like they didn’t accomplish anything
The UCP was so quick to undo any lasting legacy of the ANDP ever being in power that Alberta felt whiplash.
Nobody cares about policy though. The NDP had an in-depth policy book last time, that was endorsed by lots of chambers of commerce, but nobody cared.
Because no one believed it. Notley saying taxes won't be raised but somehow there will be more money for everything is just nonsense. Makes them look like they are being unserious. I think she even said they'd spend less royalty revenues as well. Like how do they think that would work?
If your whole platform is based around the UCP not spending enough money on Healthcare and Education you have to have a way to pay for it it. The fact that they don't seem capable of saying how makes talking about policy impossible for Nenshi. If he says anything substantial he'd then have to pay for it. So hes stuck talking about fringe topics constantly that majority of people don't care about
Personally they'd be better off proposing a PST and then having a list of things that it would pay for
If you increase economic activity, revenue goes up with no new taxes. existing tax revenue increases proportionally with new activity. But this time around the NDP will have to raise taxes from the extinction level the UCP has lowered them to.
Wait, you mean if money circulates more and goods and services are exchanged at a higher rate, then we are all richer for it.
How will the shareholders benefit, will somebody please think of the shareholders!
That's just silly. An absolutely fantastic government policy would be lucky to get a .5% gdp increase over an average policy. And again, half of the ndp takling points are the UCP being too business friendly. So again, they're stuck.
Too business friendly because they've cut taxes that should have been generating revenue for the province to do the things that the government should be doing. Instead, they've gutted everything.
So again, gutted everything by being to business friendly but the NDP will spend more and finance it by growing the economy more.
Like you have to realize how fucking crazy that sounds to the average person. If that's their strategy again next election everyone involved should be fired.
It worked last time.
https://i.imgur.com/ejXd5GZ.png
Again, bragging about economic stats from 2018 is a good way to lose an election.
It's what happened when they were in charge. What is your malfunction? Oh.. Right...
What are you talking about? The money is there and has always been there. The issue is how the UCP spends money.
Education is a simple matter: stop building private schools and there’s your money.
Healthcare has similar issues with how they choose to spend. They blew through 100 million on dynalife. Another 70 million on Tylenol. How much wasted on private surgery clinics that they intimidated then fired the CEO over? We don’t know yet but I bet it’s another 9 figures wasted.
It’s a real shame that the tax boogeyman trope holds so much power over Albertans, the Mannings and their think tanks sure did a number on all of you.
The money isn't there though. Like wtf, we're going to have a gigantic deficit and in the mean time NDP are saying they'd raise healthcare spending by tens of billions. Shit, a new teacher contract would eat up most of those items in a year.
And they aren't going to touch private schools. The crush of people, specifically special needs children that would rush back to public schools would fuck everything up. They love only having to pay 70% for those kids. If they were in public school it would cost them 300% of a normal kid.
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I was referring to my niece actually. She'd go straight back to public school if her private care rates doubled or more.
They don't want her in public school and the public school don't have the resources but money talks.
So, the fact that the PC’s didn’t fund special needs well enough makes you believe that the public system cannot? How does someone do it that can’t afford private school, eh?
You should be advocating for more support in public school, not more mistreatment of all our kids because you have a tenuous connection to someone that you think benefits from the private system.
You realize most private schools don’t take special needs, right? There wouldn’t be any problem with incorporating those kids back into the system, except perhaps with classrooms. There’s nothing stopping them leasing the existing spaces those kids are learning in though, eh, so those kids might not even need to learn a new path to commute.
It’s not even your kid and you’re working hard to keep it shitty for the rest of them. SMH.
I mean sure, if the public system wants to massively increase special needs funding that would be great for my niece. She'd go back to public if they spent more money.
How they think that will save money I do not understand though. My sister is funding most of it right now. If they want to cover what she spends she'd be thrilled. Public system buying out her private space and not charging tuition for the same services would in no way save money
I have a buddy who gave uo his wife to move to Vancouver because they had a school that would accept and work with his severely austistuc child.
You must understand that this is a conservative choice. They underfund our schools and have since King Ralph decided to balance the budget on the backs of the working poor.
It’s a matter of choice and I can attest to the amount of supports that showed up for special needs during the NDP. All of a sudden at my wife’s daycare there were three speech pathologists and a social worker present every week. Since the UCP cut the EA budgets it’s been nothing.
Who we vote for matters, and being allowed to pay to do the government’s job is not what parents or siblings of parents should be advocating for.
They said they would increase the corporate tax rate to 10%.
Their healthcare plans were accepted, and their economic plans were well-received, too. The economic fast pass was huge and gave tons of predictability for corporations and there were plenty more.
Corporate taxes aren't a real tax. They are a tax deferral. Corporate taxes could be 0% or 40% and same amount of money goes to the government at the end of the day. It's just less consistent.
Which again, Nenshi/Notley know that. That's not a revenue generating policy.
And unfortunately with the amount of province damage she's caused and 1 more year to cause even more damage beyond repair; Nenshi will have to say; nothing can be fixed in 4 years it'll take many years to correct the damage and malpractice she's caused; fist thing NDP will fix is the healthcare and try to hire more medical professions to make wait times more manageable not the 12+ hours just to be triaged that should be the starting point for their campaing
No. everything can be repealed quickly in a big omnibus bill and then orders in council can establish rapid fire public inquiries. A lot can change fast with the implementation of a progressive income tax and large monthly tax credits payments to anyone making less than $35k or $40k a year.
Lol, did you forget what province you're talking about? The 2015 majority is by now a very distant memory.
I mean, while I personally would agree with those policies, that's sure as hell not going to get the NDP elected in Alberta. It might mean they win a few Edmonton ridings by 75% instead of 60% but they'd lose overall.
Sooooo.... we're just gonna tax people even more than they're already paying? People are already struggling to make ends meet as it is with the rediculous province and city tax we're paying currently and only taxing them even more is just gonna upset them more.
"Albertans Deserve Better". That's the message the ANDP establish.
Edit: needs to establish
More of the same thing the NDP delivered last time would be just fine
https://i.imgur.com/ejXd5GZ.png
What did Ceci do to you lol
He's a do-nothing chode who's incapable of balancing a fucking checkbook. He needs to move on and make room for someone who gives a shit.
People do not in fact know the UCP sucks. Nobody’s been telling them, and conservatives are very good at shifting the blame for public service failures onto providers and local governments
You *know* the UCP suck. A lot of us are just fine with Smith.
This sub is so extreme and not at all representative of the broader Alberta politik.
You're fine with Smith because you're either a high earning, childless urbanite, or a rural knob who hasn't realized UCP policies have fucked you over yet.
Im a conservative millenial, and the UCP has objectively fucked this province over for the next 15 years. At least.
"Objectively fucked" - right-o buds. We'll see about that one, won't we.
I'll believe you're a conservative right after I believe people with penises are women. Smith isn't my favourite but I'd take her over Nenshi every time.
It's the downside of being able to curate a life for yourself when you will never come in contact with people you disagree with.
It reminds me of one of my American relatives who was based on door knocking 100% confident that his district was going to, for the first time in thirty years go Democratic. What he failed to recognize is he was volunteering for a GOTV drive and the neighbourhoods he was canvasing were already blue.
The Republicans crushed it as they always do and he was ranting and raving about Elon Musk hacking the voting machines.
I mean.....there's a fair bit of suspicion that he did.
I wish I could only live alongside the folks I politically agreed with; they'd make great neighbours.
As an ancient called Mao I believe said: Power is never given it is always taken.
If Smith understood and respected our system of Westminster democracy, she would call an election to be fought over holding an independence referendum. She did not run on a referendum and should be bringing it to the people.
I wanna see the ucp lose horribly
We need a good decade of NDP governence in the province to unfuck what the UCP has fucked.
We need a very strong NDP to unfuck what the ucp fucked up then sue the breaks off Daniel Smith for trans rights teachers rights n what she did to the special needs people of Alberta, I wanna see the Daniel Smith lose everything
Yep. Another orange crush would be a beautiful thing.
Dude I will jump for joy to see Daniel Smith get the breaks suited off her after she is removed from office
I love Nenshis attitude. Hopefully, they do get crushed.
With the progressive Tory party being a thing now, and the separatist Republicans, I feel like the vote split might JUST be enough to gut the UCP core enough to slide a second NDP win in. And Nenshi basically has a playbook on how to avoid a Naughtly style crash, especially if he manages to win out against the UCP, which was formed to prevent another NDP win specifically.
Hoping Smith pulls the trigger on an early election, so I can sprint to the booths day one and vote for the NDP for the first time.
Why leave it to chance?
If you want the UCP out why not push the NDP to have good policies and candidates that Albertans want.
I would say that all i care about is smith getting booted but i really hope someone good and compatent is elected
The current polls in recent electoral history, make it plain that the UCP would win handily if an election was called tomorrow. I don’t think it’s impossible that the NDP could win eventually, but it doesn’t help that Nenshi appears to not grasp the reality of his current situation. Without acknowledging that, it’s going to be difficult to make the changes required to win.
last polls were in november, and gave the UCP a three seat lead over NDP; recent electoral history shows a shift to the left on polling made before the writ is dropped.
This is something this sub will probably never fully understand
Despite this fall shit show, if an election were held today they would likely win
Wait until closer to the election and some money will be given out, pass a few widely popular policies and Dani may even fall on a sword.
All will be forgiven and they will win again
They had better have a vote before a “leader” voted into power by less than 7000 of us in a by election can try and destroy Canada.
How in the tinfoil hat would the NDP being elected in Alberta destroy Canada.
They're talking about Dani.
She was elected as leader during a full election. I hate her but that’s the reality
she won by 1600 votes in specific calgary ridings. that makes her a perfectly legitimate leader, but her mandate extremely weak. her actions are one who won a strong mandate.
She won her seat in Medicine Hat, not Calgary. The party may have won on Calgary ridings, but Smith didn't.
1600 votes in calgary is the only thing we're talking about.
Yes, that's how things work on paper. But who actually votes for the specific candidate in their riding without reference to the leader? Nobody. When people vote for Joe Foodtruck in Cypress-Medicine Hat, they are voting for Dani and her policy platform.
Even worse, people simply look for the word "conservative" on the ballot and mark their X, policy and leader be damned.
It's the reason why she blocked the word from being used in the AP rebranding.
Well, in fact they are voting directly for Dani.
Dani is in Brooks-Medicine Hat. Cypress-Medicine Hat is Justin Wright.
I suppose I could have picked a less confusing example.
Oh sorry, my error
Yes. And?
Hahahhahahaha Nenshi is still delusional
thats bold, but is probably a losing bet at this point tbh.
most recent polling is agus reed, and has a 3 seat difference in november. a lot has happened sice then, and canadians tend to shift wildly.
reminder that the NDP did well in the polls until election day. I would love to see the UCP not make it next time but theres a point where being overconfident is a thing.
I'm confident in the NDP's chances, but what I'm certain of is that we don't have certain elections in this province anymore. a UPC blowout, like we used to expect, is the least likely outcome to my mind.
Let's all be weird in the next election and vote to the PTP
Not weird. The UCP are insane. The PTP has the potential to be a viable option for people who can’t stomach voting for the NDP…
I pity whomever replaces the UCP though. So much cleanup to do
I agree… It’ll take a Herculean effort to undo the damage AND a willingness to stand up to insane amount bullshit. Good and respectable people are going to step outside their comfort zones to do what is right.
It’s a real shame that ignorance (and even treason!?!?) seems to be celebrated these days.
Where's a bow-and-arrow wielding vigilante when you need one....
I don’t like NDP, because they have zero skills, but please crush ucp!
That's some pretty big chihuahua energy Nenshi has going on, what with the spring sitting likely not until February.
He's only daring them and ready to crush because he knows it isn't going to happen. Remember when 77,000 NDP 'members' elected him, then the year after we're down to 17,000 members?
Sure would be nice if all these convenient johnny-come-lately NDP members renewed their memberships. Prove that what he's saying is true.