I trust him to know what’s what in the music business. He will invite me out for tacos and the people he is hanging out with turn out to be Jack White’s manager, E from the EELS, a producer at Apple Music, Jonesy from the Sex Pistols. Also, remember the search for a drummer like 20 years ago? The drummer from System of a Down has said he was just there for content, not for an actual audition. The new guitarist they hired doesn’t gel musically (she can play though), but image wise she looks like Darcy and James had a daughter who was raised by Tila Tequila.
Kiki makes perfect sense from the point of view of an older Billy Corgan trying to keep the brand relevant and hip. She's a known TikTok star, young, conventionally attractive, lots of stage presence. What was the biggest critique of Jeff? That he was boring and just stood still off to the side of the stage. It also helps she brings the "girl in a band" aspect back that has been a core identity of The Smashing Pumpkins since the beginning.
Respectfully, you proved the point I was going to make. It was based off image and branding, not sonic identity. Also, why would a band with its two original guitarist need a permanent third guitarist? That in of itself is weird. When Jimmy came back did they have two drummers?
Because they had been functioning as a band with 3 guitarists for 5 years before Jeff left in 2023. It's what they're used to, it allows for Billy to take a break from playing guitar which he seems to enjoy as there's always at least one song on the setlist he puts it down for, and it allows for extra guitar parts that are normally restricted to the albums to be pulled off live without using backing tracks.
No, they didn't have two drummers when Jimmy came back, but they did have three for the Adore tour ;)
That’s kinda the whole point. In a band setting you need to gel into one unit or else it’s just people playing music at the same time. I’m not saying socially gel, I’m saying musically gel. Billy has said it before, a great band is when “the sum is greater than the parts”.
I meant the album Monuments to a Eulogy by SP. it feels like that era. Here’s a random album suggestion that you may like Dangerous Dreams by Moving Units. It’s underground indie from LA that helped set off a chain of events. They were adjacent to a ton of bands that became famous.
I don't think so, the top contenders were all flown out to LA to audition with the band, if it were decided from the start there'd be no point in wasting the time and money on that.
I think u/smashingpumpkinsgear was one of the finalists? Might be misremembering but he can correct me if so.
That’s doesn’t mean it wasn’t predetermined. Bands at the level of SP are corporations that make so much money they need tax write offs. Plane tickets, hotels, meals all help them reduce their taxes, so flying some people out for an audition (predetermined or not) is no big deal. And if content was created then it definitely wasn’t a waste of time since it creates fan engagement.
Agree to disagree on this one. I know people who are connected to the SP machine, all accounts point to it being a real audition process. Billy and company may have had their eyes on a few contenders already prior and it most definitely was not unbiased, but Kiki was not the predetermined winner all along. Eden Gallup was the number 2 choice. Trevor Lukather was also a top contender. It'd be more accurate to say that the average joe didn't have a chance.
They definitely knew who they wanted. They say 10,000 people applied, and let’s say each audition was 5 minutes, that’s well over 800 hours of auditions.
You know pro wrestling is fake too, right? Those major bands are LLCs selling concert tickets and merch while earning royalties off internet streaming and disguising social media engagement as marketing.
You keep talking. And still aren’t getting any closer to knowing what the fuck you’re talking about. But at least you think you’re smart. Hope that works out for you.
I have a friend who played with lots of bands in LA. I’m talking studio work with Mars Volta, he jams out with John Frusciante, he was signed and left music saying it’s an evil business. His favorite band is SP and I urged him to audition and he said the decision was already made and the whole thing was to generate some sort of buzz. The fact he knew about it and didn’t audition said everything because as jaded as he is jamming with SP would be a dream come true for him. His playing is like a weird hybrid of Frusciante and Billy because that’s what he grew up studying. Dude would’ve either tried to create something spectacular or died trying.
I’m not saying you’re wrong or don’t have the inside info or anything but it would be extremely unethical to fake audition people (and make them travel on their own dime to attend the audition) just for internet hype. I think your friend should have taken a shot, if he was a better fit or impressed the band during an audition then you think he would have had a shot. I know one person who got an audition and I’d like to think they weren’t just strung along.
I’ve seen him around Volta since Bedlam. He jams out and whatever they do with it is up to the Omar. He is never told what it’s for. We’ve heard some albums and he’ll laugh and say “I played that”. I used to not believe him but then he’ll pick up his guitar and play it flawlessly. He’ll say the session it was from and some insights on to his musical idea while recording and then just change the subject very casually like I asked him what he ate last weekend. And yeah he still jams out with John. He’s just this stoner living like a rockstar without the fame. If you’re in the LA underground you might know who I’m talking about lol
So do you mean he would write stuff with john and omar and then that idea would get used in the song with him uncredited or does he actually play that stuff on the album and still get uncredited?
Both. He usually learns a part from Omar and then records it, usually getting bored and morphing it into his style take after take. Other times he jams in recorded sessions and sometimes those jams find their way on to albums. He doesn’t get credited, but that’s normal with Volta. A lot of people play on those records and only the contracted band get credited. Ikey exposed this publicly when he was credited on Amputecture and didn’t play a single note on it. He doesn’t write songs with John as far I know, they just hang out, smoke weed and jam. Dude is super interesting and has stories for days.
I’m pretty sure Marcel and Money Mark mostly played on those. Marcel can do a Diet Coke version of Ikey’s style. Those albums were parallel to a ton of sessions that became ORL solo records (which had a ton of people coming and going during the jams). Ikey was touring with them but not recording with them, which is how he ended up with Jack White. I miss Ikey he was one of a kind
I do find it funny that Kiki is the only one who auditioned (that I’ve seen) that showed any form of stage presence, I.e standing up and rocking out as if performing on a stage - I know Billy made his choice from the start of the comp but her audition tape was pretty legendary
Thanks man!! Yeah that’s a very interesting point! I think I submitted some stuff of me performing live, but also I’m in Australia and probably wouldn’t bother with someone so far away
That’s awesome dude I’d love to check the band out if you got any socials for it.
If you’re by chance in Sydney, I’d love to come catch a show some time!
Ive doodled on guitar for years but I’m trash at it haha
I’m sure you’re not! We’re Tassie based, we’ve got a show in Melbourne in a couple of weeks but no Sydney show planned yet… but I’d really like to do it!
Sick you are keen to check us out! You can stream our latest album here 😊
Just listened to Trash King and really dug the sound. I’ll spin the whole album tomorrow when at work
If you ever get a syd show booked, I need to know!!
Gonna follow your insta as well
I trust him to know what’s what in the music business. He will invite me out for tacos and the people he is hanging out with turn out to be Jack White’s manager, E from the EELS, a producer at Apple Music, Jonesy from the Sex Pistols. Also, remember the search for a drummer like 20 years ago? The drummer from System of a Down has said he was just there for content, not for an actual audition. The new guitarist they hired doesn’t gel musically (she can play though), but image wise she looks like Darcy and James had a daughter who was raised by Tila Tequila.
Kiki makes perfect sense from the point of view of an older Billy Corgan trying to keep the brand relevant and hip. She's a known TikTok star, young, conventionally attractive, lots of stage presence. What was the biggest critique of Jeff? That he was boring and just stood still off to the side of the stage. It also helps she brings the "girl in a band" aspect back that has been a core identity of The Smashing Pumpkins since the beginning.
Respectfully, you proved the point I was going to make. It was based off image and branding, not sonic identity. Also, why would a band with its two original guitarist need a permanent third guitarist? That in of itself is weird. When Jimmy came back did they have two drummers?
Because they had been functioning as a band with 3 guitarists for 5 years before Jeff left in 2023. It's what they're used to, it allows for Billy to take a break from playing guitar which he seems to enjoy as there's always at least one song on the setlist he puts it down for, and it allows for extra guitar parts that are normally restricted to the albums to be pulled off live without using backing tracks.
No, they didn't have two drummers when Jimmy came back, but they did have three for the Adore tour ;)
Haha! Well, do you need to gel with Billy? Surely he just tells you what to play
That’s kinda the whole point. In a band setting you need to gel into one unit or else it’s just people playing music at the same time. I’m not saying socially gel, I’m saying musically gel. Billy has said it before, a great band is when “the sum is greater than the parts”.
I’m with ya! And I agree. When we’ve used a fill in drummer it fucked up, I hate it, won’t do it again!
Here is a SP influenced song from our latest album, interested if you dig it
Musically it reminds me of Monuments. It feels like post reunion Pumpkins, especially on the guitar
Thanks for listening! Always very appreciative when someone checks out our stuff. What should I listen to by Monuments?
I meant the album Monuments to a Eulogy by SP. it feels like that era. Here’s a random album suggestion that you may like Dangerous Dreams by Moving Units. It’s underground indie from LA that helped set off a chain of events. They were adjacent to a ton of bands that became famous.
Ah yep I’m with ya!
Sick I’ll check them out!
Love it - cracking song!
Agreed! 🥰
Killer!
Thank you!!
Great playing!
Thank you for the kind words!
Nice man! Props to you for even trying.
Wasn’t the whole audition thing a scam anyway?
By the way nice playing man.
I don't think so, the top contenders were all flown out to LA to audition with the band, if it were decided from the start there'd be no point in wasting the time and money on that.
I think u/smashingpumpkinsgear was one of the finalists? Might be misremembering but he can correct me if so.
That’s doesn’t mean it wasn’t predetermined. Bands at the level of SP are corporations that make so much money they need tax write offs. Plane tickets, hotels, meals all help them reduce their taxes, so flying some people out for an audition (predetermined or not) is no big deal. And if content was created then it definitely wasn’t a waste of time since it creates fan engagement.
Agree to disagree on this one. I know people who are connected to the SP machine, all accounts point to it being a real audition process. Billy and company may have had their eyes on a few contenders already prior and it most definitely was not unbiased, but Kiki was not the predetermined winner all along. Eden Gallup was the number 2 choice. Trevor Lukather was also a top contender. It'd be more accurate to say that the average joe didn't have a chance.
They definitely knew who they wanted. They say 10,000 people applied, and let’s say each audition was 5 minutes, that’s well over 800 hours of auditions.
You sure have a lot to say for not knowing what the fuck you’re talking about.
You know pro wrestling is fake too, right? Those major bands are LLCs selling concert tickets and merch while earning royalties off internet streaming and disguising social media engagement as marketing.
You keep talking. And still aren’t getting any closer to knowing what the fuck you’re talking about. But at least you think you’re smart. Hope that works out for you.
Thank you 😊I assumed probably yeah, I know Billy likes to work the socials etc these days… but was still an exciting time when I heard about it haha
I have a friend who played with lots of bands in LA. I’m talking studio work with Mars Volta, he jams out with John Frusciante, he was signed and left music saying it’s an evil business. His favorite band is SP and I urged him to audition and he said the decision was already made and the whole thing was to generate some sort of buzz. The fact he knew about it and didn’t audition said everything because as jaded as he is jamming with SP would be a dream come true for him. His playing is like a weird hybrid of Frusciante and Billy because that’s what he grew up studying. Dude would’ve either tried to create something spectacular or died trying.
I’m not saying you’re wrong or don’t have the inside info or anything but it would be extremely unethical to fake audition people (and make them travel on their own dime to attend the audition) just for internet hype. I think your friend should have taken a shot, if he was a better fit or impressed the band during an audition then you think he would have had a shot. I know one person who got an audition and I’d like to think they weren’t just strung along.
Your friend wasn’t strung along. Congrats to them for getting that far. This guy doesn’t know what he is talking about.
What was he doing in studio with mars volta and does he still jam with john?
I’ve seen him around Volta since Bedlam. He jams out and whatever they do with it is up to the Omar. He is never told what it’s for. We’ve heard some albums and he’ll laugh and say “I played that”. I used to not believe him but then he’ll pick up his guitar and play it flawlessly. He’ll say the session it was from and some insights on to his musical idea while recording and then just change the subject very casually like I asked him what he ate last weekend. And yeah he still jams out with John. He’s just this stoner living like a rockstar without the fame. If you’re in the LA underground you might know who I’m talking about lol
So do you mean he would write stuff with john and omar and then that idea would get used in the song with him uncredited or does he actually play that stuff on the album and still get uncredited?
Both. He usually learns a part from Omar and then records it, usually getting bored and morphing it into his style take after take. Other times he jams in recorded sessions and sometimes those jams find their way on to albums. He doesn’t get credited, but that’s normal with Volta. A lot of people play on those records and only the contracted band get credited. Ikey exposed this publicly when he was credited on Amputecture and didn’t play a single note on it. He doesn’t write songs with John as far I know, they just hang out, smoke weed and jam. Dude is super interesting and has stories for days.
Im pretty sure he didnt play on octa but played on ampu. Credited on both
I’m pretty sure Marcel and Money Mark mostly played on those. Marcel can do a Diet Coke version of Ikey’s style. Those albums were parallel to a ton of sessions that became ORL solo records (which had a ton of people coming and going during the jams). Ikey was touring with them but not recording with them, which is how he ended up with Jack White. I miss Ikey he was one of a kind
This is a really cool thread. Imagine just getting stoned and jamming with John, would be such a great experience. Very curious who this cat is!!
So he played only on deloused and frances?
That is such a cool story, thanks for sharing. I love music but it does seem like a truly brutal business
Oh man you can hear the feeling in those fingers! Phenomenal playing, so expressive!
Ahh thank you so much, I live for it!
I agree! I play a lot of Smashing Pumpkins songs and you're not playing it right unless your really bending and sustaining those strings.
You can tell Billy's left handed for sure in his playing. Very strong aggressive vibrato and bends.
It’s a great lead style Billy has. Have you seen the video of him shredding in high school?
Haha yeah! My favourite perfomance I've seen of Billy was at Featival Hall in Melbourne when he played Gossamer, it was mind melting
Jimmy and Billy going off is always a pleasure to see
This is a great cover dude!
I do find it funny that Kiki is the only one who auditioned (that I’ve seen) that showed any form of stage presence, I.e standing up and rocking out as if performing on a stage - I know Billy made his choice from the start of the comp but her audition tape was pretty legendary
Interesting. Where did you see this “audition tape”.
Thanks man!! Yeah that’s a very interesting point! I think I submitted some stuff of me performing live, but also I’m in Australia and probably wouldn’t bother with someone so far away
Oh mad, I’m in Aus as well! You don’t do a SP cover band by chance??
Nope just a shit kickin’ originals band! How about you?
That’s awesome dude I’d love to check the band out if you got any socials for it. If you’re by chance in Sydney, I’d love to come catch a show some time!
Ive doodled on guitar for years but I’m trash at it haha
I’m sure you’re not! We’re Tassie based, we’ve got a show in Melbourne in a couple of weeks but no Sydney show planned yet… but I’d really like to do it!
Sick you are keen to check us out! You can stream our latest album here 😊
Verticoli - Silverlinings
Just listened to Trash King and really dug the sound. I’ll spin the whole album tomorrow when at work If you ever get a syd show booked, I need to know!! Gonna follow your insta as well
Ahh you legend! Thanks so much 😊 definitely will!
Here's the real question....is it pronounced Vertico-lie or Vertico-lee
The latter I’m reading it correctly!