We don't have ESTA-bullshit to start with. Those free Americans can come for 90 days to every country in the EU without providing anything but a legit passport - oh and they have to leave their precious guns at home. Lucky for us they already need to do that at their airports.
I worked for a company that had e-learning. It was set up so you had to spend a set number of minutes on every page before you could click ‘next’. No that was a real pain.
I've worked at a place that did that too. Incidentally, it was all American training, for a UK company. So much useless focus on HIPAA and ameropoor things.
Why is guns specifically so fundamental to freedom? When there are so many other types of weapons, why draw the line there and not lower, at say flint axes, or higher at ICBMs? But guns specifically are so fundamental to freedom that all citizens should have one, but anything higher is too dangerous and only the government can have them.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼spot on! I’m 🇬🇧my ex is 🇺🇸When Americans would tell me how free they were, they have the best rights in the world, I started telling them what do you value more, the right to have weapons of war OR children being safe in school & getting a good quality education, children not worrying about not getting home after school, accessible healthcare for all, humanity & empathy for others? I also didn’t give to Fs if I offended them, I was over it
Because they think that unlimited gun ownership “protects them from tyranny. They think that their little militia (aka gun club with 8 members in Buttfucknowhere, Nebraska, in which all 8 members eat predominantly ultra-processed foods and can’t run more than 10 metres without keeling over) would be able to take on one of the world’s largest, most advanced (thanks to a pretty much unlimited budget with virtually no oversight) militaries and succeed.
But now there they have a big orange tyrant in charge and all of these 2nd amendment ammosexuals have done exactly nothing to challenge the current regime. So now there is absolute proof that all of their “to protect us from tyranny” talk is bullshit - they just have an inferiority complex that they are attempting to overcome by owning as many weapons capable of mass murder as possible.
Yes - but they should also implement social media history - and if there is but one negative comment about Ursula, Mark, Keir, etc. - return to sender!.
Bahhaha bold of you to assume they have any concept of the leadership of any country outside the US. Half of them think the US constitution applied globally
So many countries are bringing that in, it's fucking bullshit: a visa that's just not called a visa, because we have some treaty that says you don't need a visa, but we want to make you get one anyway, countries in the developed world are becoming way too closed off and insular IMHO
great Britain has it since October I believe and if I'm not mistaken France and Germany want to start that as well.
it's good though. if we have to go through this to be able to go there then the same should apply for them.
although Europe is not as crazy as asking for 5 years of social media to see if you insulted someone in politics...
That's the thing in the US (really everywhere though, tbh): what the law says and what the people in power actually do are often very different things.
Neighbors down the street in my hometown in the US have been arrested in the middle of the night by ICE. They're US citizens born and raised, who happen to be latino. Detained for about a day with no cause, no warrant, no accountability. Absolutely illegal according to US law, but that doesn't matter anymore.
To be fair, that policy is very clearly illegal under the 1st amendment, they're just doing it anyway.
This is the thing that makes it all ridiculous and hilarious in equal measures
They say they're free and protected because of these documents but then their government simply ignores the bits they don't like so they can do what they want, which really is the hallmark of a dictatorship
We may have our own issues here in the UK regarding broad laws and people being arrested or prosecuted for things that I don't believe are right to arrest people for but at least those things are actually within the bounds of a law instead of the government ignoring the laws and going rogue
Actually, they can do almost anything they want for non-citizens to allow them to enter the country. In fact, many countries look at people's phones if they suspect the person may be doing something illegal and/or trying to work, or find work, in the country. Countries do not really need a reason to deny entry, the border guard can deny entry for almost any reason they can think of, there is no right to entry. The full constitutional rights really only kick in once you are permitted entry.
This is mad to me, I was saying something like this would happen at some point.
No other country on earth wants to dig into your social media and family history if you visit them. God even north Korea has a more open border than the US now... Let alone the arch enemy of America... China... Who ironically has significantly better workers rights which means as much as it pains me to say it... Chinese workers are technically more free despite living in a 'communist' (bullshit, it's a single party state that is socially socialist but economically ultra capitalist) country.
If America wants no one to visit so be it. I've had quite a few conversations with people since this announcement who have genuinely said they won't be visiting America anytime soon, and in much higher numbers than before.
The 5 social media history isn't the only thing they're asking for. They will also take all your private emails, your work emails and contacts, family history, a picture of your iris and a DNA swab. It's amusing media is spinning the social media history as the worst ask in the changes they're proposing.
Your data is going to get palantir'd, Trump is just going to sell it to the highest bidder.
Here in the Netherlands we have TV programs that basically just talk shit about dumb things happening around the world and locally. Including dumb things our government sometimes does.
In Cirkusrevyen, we used to have someone dressing up as the queen and making fun of her. She loved it so much that during his last show,just after that segment, she came in, unknown to almost everyone, including him. She came and gave him an ashtray with her monogram. He died last year. Ulf Pilgård, you were a master among comedians
When you haven't got anything (major) to hide from your citizens, this makes perfect sense. Even before trump there's no way the merkins could have this level of transparency.
In the UK we also have Have I Got News For You which is basically just comedians and journalists making fun of the government and other politicians. It’s on BBC One at prime viewing time. I would probably call that free speech and free press.
The state: *fucks everyone up and disappears citizens from the streets*
Well I'm glad they feel empowered with their guns while being absolutely helpless.
The common French protestor, armed with nothing more than a black coffee, a cig, and maybe a crossaint, has more guts and power than any of those gun-bearing Americans.
They were handed a chance on a silver platter to prove that one, just one, argument for their 2nd amendment was actually valid. And yet they sit on their asses like always.
The most resistance they have managed is someone dancing in inflatable frog suits. As funny as some of those clips were, we all know it won't change a thing. And the people over there don't seem to have the balls to do something to compel the change
I know this probably doesn’t matter but the people who believe guns are freedom are typically not the same people as the ones in frog suits. And the ones in frog suits are in frog suits because unlike in France, the penal system here is designed to destroy your life or kill you. And lastly the people sitting on their asses are actually working their asses off at full-time jobs while living paycheck to paycheck. Long story short, it’s not the people, it’s the system.
Indeed, but there are also gun nutters on the left. And even discounting those, the point stands. One argument for the 2nd amendment is that it's a guard against tyranny. What is happening is tyrannical, and no one is doing anything. The fact that the nutters on the right probably collaborate on some level just makes the argument all the more hollow.
As for people bot being able to thanks to the system over there, I'd say that the people aren't trying to change that system, which is the issue. They keep their heads down and play along either directly (such as working for ICE or following orders as a national guard) or indirectly (by not resisting). No matter the brand of totalitarianism, there are always more people than oppressors. But the latter win when the former don't push back. No one ever said it would be easy or safe, but the push needs to come all the same. Otherwise, the people dooms itself to suffer the oppression
Yes, and with their rifle they're definitely going to outmatch a state that has tanks, drones, satellites, and enough firepower to delete a small country before lunch.
A small country? We're talking about a state with an arsenal capable of deleting the entire planet multiple times. Their 2nd amendment made sense when armies were still peasants firing muskets and cannon balls, the moment armoured infantry became a thing it became useless.
"Yee haw with this gun I can resist state tyranny!"
-The Entertainer plays over a loudspeaker. An ice cream truck stops on the next block.-
"What's that buzzing?"
-Looks up.-
-Drone drops grenade, the sidewalk is plastered with Freedumb. The drone returns to the rented vehicle for drone deployment. The Entertainer continues playing.-
"Good morning, dear gun owning citizen. Since you own a gun to defend against us, your government, we brought a friend to detain you. May we introduce you to Mr. Bradley (the infantery fighting vehicle). Would you like to come out peacefully ?"
I think that's always been the craziest thing to me. If someone has broken into your house and is actively threatening you? I can kinda understand that, but the whole 'stay off my property or get shot' seems to just be anywhere on their land, like their nipples are getting erect at the very idea of someone putting a toe over their property line so they get to murder someone.
Yea, I always find it hilarious too how many americans think their country is so much better and they have more freedom because of guns. I guess in their minds they think everyone wants to have a gun. It always seems like they just can't comprehend that we don't want or even feel the need to have guns.
As someone who supports gun rights, Americans making a big deal of it is the greatest argument against it.
A nation where gun culture is reserved and they are respected for the lethal tools they are there would be no issue with 9/10 adults owning one. But in a nation where "a good guy with a gun" narratives run wild it is impossible because everyone is ready to whip one out so they can be the cowboy hero
& the biggest problem when everyone has a gun & often has it on their person at all times, is it's all too easy to, in the heat of the moment, to pull it out & use it, with little to no thought to the consequences, in situations where the last fucking thing anyone needs is to bring a gun into the mix, like during road rage incidents , or neighbour disputes or arguments with your teens.. 🤦
Exactly. That's also a aspect of cowboy culture. A armed police officer in Europe is trained so that gun is the last thing they go for. It takes a lot of training to override that instinct.
the irony is Freedom of Speech is only protected from government suppression; corporations or individuals can suppress freedom of speech lawfully, by banning you or whatever.
Gun rights are also for regulated state militias vs the government. Whom can just drone strike you rather than waste manpower.
"In 1942 there were 110,000 Japanese-American citizens, in good standing, law abiding people, who were thrown into internment camps simply because their parents were born in the wrong country. That's all they did wrong. They had no right to a lawyer, no right to a fair trial, no right to a jury of their peers, no right to due process of any kind. The only right they had was...right this way! Into the internment camps.
Just when these American citizens needed their rights the most...their government took them away. and rights aren't rights if someone can take em away. They're privileges. That's all we've ever had in this country is a bill of TEMPORARY privileges; and if you read the news, even badly, you know the list gets shorter, and shorter, and shorter."
No need to go that far back in history. The incarceration rate of african americans in the US (higher than the FUCKING GULAG) is a sufficient to refute any claim of "freedom"
Meanwhile a comedian in Denmark who was known for making fun of the queen, got an ashtray with her monogram handed to him personally by the queen herself during his last performance before his retirement
This is the same US that wants to access 5 years of social media, and will arrest and if they're lucky, deport back home anyone who tries to enter the USA? This US has "free speech"? What a joke.
Freedom of speech for the orange guy and his white friends.
Normal Americans hope that their family or them don't die for going to school or drown in medical debt and their hope that they can have only one job and not 3
The index of free speech by country would like a word.
I love that not only is Scandinavia at the top as always. But that even UK which ofte. Gets bashed my usa for having less free speech actually outranks usa by quite a bit.
There's a massive hippocracy in these comments from Americans who think that constitutional rights are absolute; they aren't, and the government can change or reinterpret them if they want. There's limits like threatening, incitement, false statements of fact, defamation, some state and local laws still outlaw swearing in the vicinity of a church. When you consider all of that it's not much different from speech in any other developed country, but because other countries enact those protections in ways other than a codified constitution, Americans consider it non-existent.
Even if that is the benchmark, the US is not alone in having codified constitutional rights. I'm Canadian, and we have a codified Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
I suspect all those commenters would still argue that my country is less free because it doesn't have gun rights in it.
And I suppose I should note our Canadian Charter is only from the 1980s, and it's not like we were an unfree hellish place without rights before then.
Interestingly the (heavily criticised) UK comes quite a few places higher than the US in almost every international ranking of freedoms, including Freedom House's 'Freedom on the Net' index.
It's almost as if a negative right might not deliver optimal public goods without adjacent positive rights.
Thousands?...news to me.....Your President just suggested that people should be charged with treason ( which carries a death sentence) for speculating about his health and you say WE don't have free speech!
Man, the second half of that americans comment in the OP is obviously cooked, but this is a real thing. More than 2000 brits have been arrested this year during peaceful protest for the phrase "I support palestine action". That isn't to say that the UKs necessarily has less free speech than the US, but let's try and not sugarcoat our governments autocratic actions, because if we do, we're no better than the people being made fun of in these posts.
Although I guess defamation would be more accurate to what I was saying, in most countries truth is a defense against it. But a few places (like cited Korea) have laws that punish defamation even if true if they deem it was done purely for petty reason rather than public interest.
For example, even if you have proof and a confession it would be punishable to expose someone had to go to the hospital after inserting something inappropriate down certain body parts because although it might be true, sharing such sensitive information serves no purpose but to humiliate.
"Yeah, slander by definition is false. If you're not lying it can't be slander"
But you see, when these people are talking about "free speech" what they mean is an absolutist definition of speech that is incompatible with a civil society. They think/ want "free speech" to include lying,. misinformation, (their type of) propaganda, and all other types of speech that works to degrade debates. They like it that way because this is the only way they have to communicate in order to get express their views and ideas.
But of course they only mean this for their views, not for anyone else's. They'll slander but as soon as some slanders them (meaning the truth), well "you can't do that! That's against the law!"
Slander is not a crime in the UK. You can't be arrested for it. It is a civil matter. If you're slandered, you have to sue in a civil court for redress...(get money).
And even then the amounts are generally to do with either financial losses or reputational losses. It’s why Trump trying to sue the BBC for stupid money would never fly - he didn’t lose out financially and his reputation is already garbage, so how badly could they have damaged it!
Yeah they'd probably be awarded more in legal fees than damages. It's not like the BBC's editing of one TV program has damaged his reputation so severely that he can no longer accept bribes from Qatar & FIFA.
In fairness, the American didn't say there were arrests for slander in England/the UK, he claimed that of Germany. The person at the top of this chain was wrong in that in several countries, slander isn't a crime, it a civil matter.
Exactly. Germany is also way less arrest-happy than the US. It's a rather rare occurrence. Lying like this only shows they don't know much about a society.
While they do, and that's why anyone going to the World Cup has to submit their Bebo and MySpace accounts to make sure they didn't say America Bad as a 14 year old
It actually annoys me how often I see this shit about people being "jailed" for socialedia posts in the uk. It's like the conservative Americans go to response to anything about the UK. In fairness the media in the UK aren't helping because apparently the truth is irrelevant and clicks matter. So for anyone that's interested:
The rate of convictions under the communications act is at an all time low and continues to fall. The stats are available online for anyone to see. The number of arrests are up because when a report of a crime is made and the police "invite" someone in for an interview it's an arrest. The amount of reports of alleged crimes involving the communications misuse act are up. But very very few make it to trial.
Now investigating most of the reports is a waste of time, but the police have to investigate that is their job. There are even some cases (the ones the media always likes to shout about) from 6 years ago that were convicted and then overturned.
The laws pretty clear where we stand on inciting violence, hate speech and making death threats. If people can't comprehend that then so be it.
Fun fact: That guy complaining about his friend who got a ticket for not locking their car in Germany while living on an american military base and how America can't do that due to the fourth amendment... is actually a US military regulation: Lock your vehicle, it's the law | Article | The United States Army
Leaving a vehicle unsecured is a violation of host nation law, USAREUR Regulation AER 190-1 and garrison policy; a violation can result in a 15 euro fine by the host nation police and a notice of violation (DD 1408), which is issued to the vehicle's owner or operator by the military police and forwarded for command action.
USAREUR is the manual for US military regulations for those living on bases.
It's mandatory under German traffic law. § 14 StVo to be specific. You are required to make efforts to secure your car against use by others.
So it's actually a valid point. But in exchange for this law you can drink beer without a stupid paper bag in public in Germany, also it's actual beer and not piss.
This weird guy on the internet said Europe doesn’t have free speech, he is very obviously a leading expert on the subject, as you can tell by his extensive list of citations and sources to support his claim.
I think we all just need to accept what he says, arguing would be pointless in the face of such obvious authority.
AH AH AH...the mere idea of French people not being able to be VERY VOCAL and sometimes downright rude when speaking their mind frankly and freely.. .it's been a national sports for centuries .
But the law is very clear with what is free speech , and what constitutes hate speech. We do not tolerate illegal verbal violence , same as with guns ; in my country neither are supposed to aim at damaging people.
The Bill of Rights 😆 when you need to enumerate your rights then you probably don't have many. Most people in Britain are just free through common laws
Do American cops even respect the laws around illegal search and seizure?
Also, the "leverage" that the government doesn't have over you is instead held by corporations, and since you don't vote for them you have no say in what they do with it.
Germany doesn't arrest people for slander. If we'd do that our prisons would be as full as those of the great US of A. Also maybe they should ask their TV networks why they caved before their orange Idiot when he threatened to press slander charges because of their late night comedians ...
We even told the president of Turkey off when he wanted to do that to German comedians for making him the aim of their jokes.
Saying thousands of people in the UK are arrested over speech, ignoring that 100% of the time is it because of harassment, is like saying people are arrested for just standing in the street outside someone’s house for stalking.
Once again the UK gets a bad reputation because someone was arrested for inciting violence. Because it was online, that's just free speech, apparently.
Is Trump not doing exactly what he wants even if it is forbidden by the constitution and even his political opposition are just pretending its not happening for some reason?
I wonder who keeps coming up with these completely unfounded and abstruse claims about Europe?
Unfortunately, we have had to get used to the fact that those who spread such nonsense are completely oblivious to it.
Comments like this are the end result of a decades-long propaganda campaign that has been telling Americans that we are the best, have the best, and no one else has what we have. I've come to realize, this is how masses are brainwashed and wars are started when the wrong people take control. There is no connection with reality, just the vibes they see from their favorite propagandists.
True, we don't have free speech in germany. We only have freedom of opinion. The bigest differences are that hate speech and Nazi propaganda are banned. Why ban Nazis? Because of human dignity and democracy both being incompatible with Nazis.
They seem awfully attached to the Bill of Rights for people who voted in a fascist administration who would cancel the Constitution tomorrow if they could get away with it
I don’t know how other European countries handle it but in Germany there is indeed no freedom of speech. Instead there’s freedom of voicing your opinion. You can basically say and do everything until it is insulting, denying or glorifying crimes and so on
It all comes down to weapons grade propaganda. Pledge of allegiance is quite overbearing too, I imagine it's hard to question things when you keep swearing your loyalty
You can see across multiple international indices that the US doesn’t come close to ranking first in key measures of freedom..from economic liberty to civil rights and broader democratic indicators.
That alone is enough to counter the simplistic narratives these people push. Yet many will still dismiss the data, echoing the denialism popularised by their orange tinted president, insisting it’s all “fake.” At this point, it’s hard to argue the US hasn’t crossed a point of no return.
Someone tell that idiot that to be arrested and prosecuted for slander you must have said something genuinely untrue with the intention of causing harm.
In America they don't have this but what they do have is laws that allow you to sue someone for saying something that makes them look bad even if it's true.
We also don't ask for 5 years of social media history so we can see if you've said some mean & hurty words about the man child running the US
We don't have ESTA-bullshit to start with. Those free Americans can come for 90 days to every country in the EU without providing anything but a legit passport - oh and they have to leave their precious guns at home. Lucky for us they already need to do that at their airports.
Exactly as they were saying - no freedom.
Americans can't be asked forgo their daily active shooter drills.
We got assigned 'active shooter' trainings once. In Europe. Working from home. During lockdown.
We must have raised enough of a stink, because they weren't assigned again next year.
Was this some kind of e-learning module? Such things are a joke, usually so easy to scroll to the bottom and click "next".
yeah it was all online - they didn't send someone to my house to go bruce willis on me.
Shoulda just played a Doom deathmatch.
I worked for a company that had e-learning. It was set up so you had to spend a set number of minutes on every page before you could click ‘next’. No that was a real pain.
I've worked at a place that did that too. Incidentally, it was all American training, for a UK company. So much useless focus on HIPAA and ameropoor things.
Why is guns specifically so fundamental to freedom? When there are so many other types of weapons, why draw the line there and not lower, at say flint axes, or higher at ICBMs? But guns specifically are so fundamental to freedom that all citizens should have one, but anything higher is too dangerous and only the government can have them.
I think for a lot of gun nuts they don't draw the line at guns and do believe they should be able to own missiles.
I don't know dude, you'd have to ask the Trumpistani. It's a broken society in my understanding.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼spot on! I’m 🇬🇧my ex is 🇺🇸When Americans would tell me how free they were, they have the best rights in the world, I started telling them what do you value more, the right to have weapons of war OR children being safe in school & getting a good quality education, children not worrying about not getting home after school, accessible healthcare for all, humanity & empathy for others? I also didn’t give to Fs if I offended them, I was over it
Seppos LOVE their 'right to bear arms' but have zero clue about anything to do with 'a well-regulated militia'
Because they think that unlimited gun ownership “protects them from tyranny. They think that their little militia (aka gun club with 8 members in Buttfucknowhere, Nebraska, in which all 8 members eat predominantly ultra-processed foods and can’t run more than 10 metres without keeling over) would be able to take on one of the world’s largest, most advanced (thanks to a pretty much unlimited budget with virtually no oversight) militaries and succeed.
But now there they have a big orange tyrant in charge and all of these 2nd amendment ammosexuals have done exactly nothing to challenge the current regime. So now there is absolute proof that all of their “to protect us from tyranny” talk is bullshit - they just have an inferiority complex that they are attempting to overcome by owning as many weapons capable of mass murder as possible.
Various countries in the EU and the UK have now implemented visa requirements for US visitors
All EU countries should do this. The US is not a trustable ally any more.
They should do it so we don't have to listen to obnoxious Americans talking loudly in public in Europe.
Yes - but they should also implement social media history - and if there is but one negative comment about Ursula, Mark, Keir, etc. - return to sender!.
Bahhaha bold of you to assume they have any concept of the leadership of any country outside the US. Half of them think the US constitution applied globally
My bad..
TBH, ETIAS is going to be a thing within a year. https://travel-europe.europa.eu/etias/about-etias/what-is-etias
So many countries are bringing that in, it's fucking bullshit: a visa that's just not called a visa, because we have some treaty that says you don't need a visa, but we want to make you get one anyway, countries in the developed world are becoming way too closed off and insular IMHO
We have an ETA.
As a response to ESTA. It's called FAFO
great Britain has it since October I believe and if I'm not mistaken France and Germany want to start that as well. it's good though. if we have to go through this to be able to go there then the same should apply for them.
although Europe is not as crazy as asking for 5 years of social media to see if you insulted someone in politics...
There isn't a fundamental issue with the ESTA. It is when it is twisted to include a hunt for what SHOULD be considered protected free speach.
Uh, non EU citizens will shortly have to register for ETIAS.
However no need to provide social media details, inside leg measurement and DNA.
Soon they'll have to though, Europe is gettin its own thing.
To be fair, that policy is very clearly illegal under the 1st amendment, they're just doing it anyway.
The rights under the bill of rights aren't just those of citizens, they apply to 'people' which includes anyone visiting the country.
It's almost as if their precious constitution is just a piece of paper.
Worth nothing, like their checks and balances.
That's the thing in the US (really everywhere though, tbh): what the law says and what the people in power actually do are often very different things.
Neighbors down the street in my hometown in the US have been arrested in the middle of the night by ICE. They're US citizens born and raised, who happen to be latino. Detained for about a day with no cause, no warrant, no accountability. Absolutely illegal according to US law, but that doesn't matter anymore.
The Gestapo and their masters care nothing about law. They want power and money.
DOJ are going to be targeting and labeling anti Trump activists as domestic terrorists
This is the thing that makes it all ridiculous and hilarious in equal measures
They say they're free and protected because of these documents but then their government simply ignores the bits they don't like so they can do what they want, which really is the hallmark of a dictatorship
We may have our own issues here in the UK regarding broad laws and people being arrested or prosecuted for things that I don't believe are right to arrest people for but at least those things are actually within the bounds of a law instead of the government ignoring the laws and going rogue
Actually, they can do almost anything they want for non-citizens to allow them to enter the country. In fact, many countries look at people's phones if they suspect the person may be doing something illegal and/or trying to work, or find work, in the country. Countries do not really need a reason to deny entry, the border guard can deny entry for almost any reason they can think of, there is no right to entry. The full constitutional rights really only kick in once you are permitted entry.
Technically, it isn’t. But only because we haven’t entered the USA when they check our phones at the border so don’t fall under their laws yet.
You won't be able to enter the US for the next 5 years just because of posting that.
How do I get a permanent ban from the States? Just in case one day I get drunk and think it's a good idea to visit.
I guess try to get into the country with a bottle of CBD oil.
https://www.devorelawgroup.com/how-to-get-banned-from-entering-the-united-states/
This is mad to me, I was saying something like this would happen at some point.
No other country on earth wants to dig into your social media and family history if you visit them. God even north Korea has a more open border than the US now... Let alone the arch enemy of America... China... Who ironically has significantly better workers rights which means as much as it pains me to say it... Chinese workers are technically more free despite living in a 'communist' (bullshit, it's a single party state that is socially socialist but economically ultra capitalist) country.
If America wants no one to visit so be it. I've had quite a few conversations with people since this announcement who have genuinely said they won't be visiting America anytime soon, and in much higher numbers than before.
To be fair, going back years of social media history for stupid things said has actually happened in Sweden. On both sides of the political spectrum.
(Not specifically something that targeted (someone in) the government, but that offended someone)
The 5 social media history isn't the only thing they're asking for. They will also take all your private emails, your work emails and contacts, family history, a picture of your iris and a DNA swab. It's amusing media is spinning the social media history as the worst ask in the changes they're proposing.
Your data is going to get palantir'd, Trump is just going to sell it to the highest bidder.
do you perhaps mean President Pedophile in the Epstein files, rapist, nappy-wearing, dementia having, sleepy head Donald Trump the fascist?
Here in the Netherlands we have TV programs that basically just talk shit about dumb things happening around the world and locally. Including dumb things our government sometimes does.
And this is paid for/sponsored by the government.
In Cirkusrevyen, we used to have someone dressing up as the queen and making fun of her. She loved it so much that during his last show,just after that segment, she came in, unknown to almost everyone, including him. She came and gave him an ashtray with her monogram. He died last year. Ulf Pilgård, you were a master among comedians
British - I have always thought your Queen Margrethe is a very down to earth lady who served her citizens well.
And I am not a monarchist.
She's also one of the few who left the throne without dying
Also found it very moving that when her husband Prince Henrik was diagnosed with dementia your Royal Family announced it to the nation.
It seemed as though Margrethe and Henrik were a real love match.
Truly a loss for the whole country. RIP
When you haven't got anything (major) to hide from your citizens, this makes perfect sense. Even before trump there's no way the merkins could have this level of transparency.
That' communism! /s
We have a similar tv show in Quebec also on national TV paid by the government.
Some of the funniest remarks I've ever heard about our politicians has come from David Cochran on CBC/Power & Politics.
In the UK we also have Have I Got News For You which is basically just comedians and journalists making fun of the government and other politicians. It’s on BBC One at prime viewing time. I would probably call that free speech and free press.
Similar in the US, hosted by trump 24 hours a day. They even have a twitter clone to circulate jokes.
"the foundation of freedom is free speech and gun rights"
absolutely hilarious. you can't be free unless you have the right to point a a gun at someone.
> Without guns you're at the mercy of the state
The state: *fucks everyone up and disappears citizens from the streets*
Well I'm glad they feel empowered with their guns while being absolutely helpless.
The common French protestor, armed with nothing more than a black coffee, a cig, and maybe a crossaint, has more guts and power than any of those gun-bearing Americans.
yeah the gravy seals have been very quiet of late..
too busy running around masked up and snatching people off the streets
Running? waddling mostly - they only run when they can hurt someone.
The gravy seals are all for a fascist government as long as it's THEIR fascist government
Because its their tyrant in charge
They were handed a chance on a silver platter to prove that one, just one, argument for their 2nd amendment was actually valid. And yet they sit on their asses like always.
The most resistance they have managed is someone dancing in inflatable frog suits. As funny as some of those clips were, we all know it won't change a thing. And the people over there don't seem to have the balls to do something to compel the change
Please, they don't sit on their asses: they joined ICE to tyrannise citizens.
I know this probably doesn’t matter but the people who believe guns are freedom are typically not the same people as the ones in frog suits. And the ones in frog suits are in frog suits because unlike in France, the penal system here is designed to destroy your life or kill you. And lastly the people sitting on their asses are actually working their asses off at full-time jobs while living paycheck to paycheck. Long story short, it’s not the people, it’s the system.
Indeed, but there are also gun nutters on the left. And even discounting those, the point stands. One argument for the 2nd amendment is that it's a guard against tyranny. What is happening is tyrannical, and no one is doing anything. The fact that the nutters on the right probably collaborate on some level just makes the argument all the more hollow.
As for people bot being able to thanks to the system over there, I'd say that the people aren't trying to change that system, which is the issue. They keep their heads down and play along either directly (such as working for ICE or following orders as a national guard) or indirectly (by not resisting). No matter the brand of totalitarianism, there are always more people than oppressors. But the latter win when the former don't push back. No one ever said it would be easy or safe, but the push needs to come all the same. Otherwise, the people dooms itself to suffer the oppression
Yes, and with their rifle they're definitely going to outmatch a state that has tanks, drones, satellites, and enough firepower to delete a small country before lunch.
A small country? We're talking about a state with an arsenal capable of deleting the entire planet multiple times. Their 2nd amendment made sense when armies were still peasants firing muskets and cannon balls, the moment armoured infantry became a thing it became useless.
"Yee haw with this gun I can resist state tyranny!"
-The Entertainer plays over a loudspeaker. An ice cream truck stops on the next block.-
"What's that buzzing?"
-Looks up.-
-Drone drops grenade, the sidewalk is plastered with Freedumb. The drone returns to the rented vehicle for drone deployment. The Entertainer continues playing.-
"Good morning, dear gun owning citizen. Since you own a gun to defend against us, your government, we brought a friend to detain you. May we introduce you to Mr. Bradley (the infantery fighting vehicle). Would you like to come out peacefully ?"
Not just point a gun, but also freely kill trespassers, as another commenter from that post said
And be White(+ Be Rich), Evangelical (give tons of money to your pastor), and Straight(Can't have the frogs being gay now, can we?)
Just as a matter of interest, how do you tell if a frog is gay? I guess I need to ask a yank.lol.
If you see the frog has a grindr account, that is usually a good hint.
A gribbit account.
Then go ahead pal😉
I dunno, my French teacher never taught me how to make a pass.
You don't understand though, someone shooting someone who only has fists or a knife is just self defence/s.
Trespass cannot exist in a country with freedom.
If there are trespass laws in the United States, then it is not a free country.
I think that's always been the craziest thing to me. If someone has broken into your house and is actively threatening you? I can kinda understand that, but the whole 'stay off my property or get shot' seems to just be anywhere on their land, like their nipples are getting erect at the very idea of someone putting a toe over their property line so they get to murder someone.
Yea, I always find it hilarious too how many americans think their country is so much better and they have more freedom because of guns. I guess in their minds they think everyone wants to have a gun. It always seems like they just can't comprehend that we don't want or even feel the need to have guns.
As someone who supports gun rights, Americans making a big deal of it is the greatest argument against it.
A nation where gun culture is reserved and they are respected for the lethal tools they are there would be no issue with 9/10 adults owning one. But in a nation where "a good guy with a gun" narratives run wild it is impossible because everyone is ready to whip one out so they can be the cowboy hero
& the biggest problem when everyone has a gun & often has it on their person at all times, is it's all too easy to, in the heat of the moment, to pull it out & use it, with little to no thought to the consequences, in situations where the last fucking thing anyone needs is to bring a gun into the mix, like during road rage incidents , or neighbour disputes or arguments with your teens.. 🤦
Exactly. That's also a aspect of cowboy culture. A armed police officer in Europe is trained so that gun is the last thing they go for. It takes a lot of training to override that instinct.
The govenment also takes guns away all the time so I dont understand what they mean
the irony is Freedom of Speech is only protected from government suppression; corporations or individuals can suppress freedom of speech lawfully, by banning you or whatever.
Gun rights are also for regulated state militias vs the government. Whom can just drone strike you rather than waste manpower.
"In 1942 there were 110,000 Japanese-American citizens, in good standing, law abiding people, who were thrown into internment camps simply because their parents were born in the wrong country. That's all they did wrong. They had no right to a lawyer, no right to a fair trial, no right to a jury of their peers, no right to due process of any kind. The only right they had was...right this way! Into the internment camps.
Just when these American citizens needed their rights the most...their government took them away. and rights aren't rights if someone can take em away. They're privileges. That's all we've ever had in this country is a bill of TEMPORARY privileges; and if you read the news, even badly, you know the list gets shorter, and shorter, and shorter."
- George Carlin
I can't even begin to imagine how pissed and sad George Carlin would be at the state of things now.
In 1912 the US forcibly deported six Titanic survivors because they were Chinese.
No need to go that far back in history. The incarceration rate of african americans in the US (higher than the FUCKING GULAG) is a sufficient to refute any claim of "freedom"
ICE are arresting anyone ‘foreign looking’ ffs.
No no, you're missing the point, these are all non-white people, the Bill of Rights never applied to them in the first place. /s
Says someone from the country where TV hosts get booted for making jokes about the president and his court jesters.
Meanwhile a comedian in Denmark who was known for making fun of the queen, got an ashtray with her monogram handed to him personally by the queen herself during his last performance before his retirement
Oh WTF that's cool as hell.
This is the same US that wants to access 5 years of social media, and will arrest and if they're lucky, deport back home anyone who tries to enter the USA? This US has "free speech"? What a joke.
Freedumb
Freedom of speech for the orange guy and his white friends.
Normal Americans hope that their family or them don't die for going to school or drown in medical debt and their hope that they can have only one job and not 3
Says the country that has tried to crush dissent when Charlie Kirk died or Trump and Vance were criticised, or that is now attempting to demand to anyone who enters the country to show their social media history at the border.
Also any speech in support of Palestine
Or gets better.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-claims-it-s-illegal-for-media-to-write-bad-about-him-fueling-free-speech-concerns/ar-AA1AWYhY
https://www.whitehouse.gov/mediabias/
Whaaat? I didnt know that existed. Thats insane
That's the official website if anyone is wondering, and I would recommend people spamming it more to show this banana republic around
The Trump Admins have been fact checked too often (well, only from their pov), now they make up just some other alternative fact checking.
At this point, nobody should be surprised, because "Der Führer hat immer recht."
It gets even better
Trump administration moves to deny visas to factcheckers and content moderators
Being from a mature, liberal democracy, I just cannot comprehend the idea of leaving official websites at the mercy of political appointees.
We just govern by meme here now.
That's unhinged lol.
Official government website calls him Fake Tapper. So childish.
Wow. They're not even bothering to hold up a veil of objectivity or professionalism anymore.
It's like they're satirizing themselves at this point.
God, this is one of the comments I want to reflexively downvote sooo badly, just because the reality it describes makes me depressed
don't worry I upvoted
The only ones to downvote are bots, not even MAGAs because they cannot read
This is so fucking embarrassing for them. What a bunch of immature children.
Holy fuck.
Wasn't Trump also trying to justify hate speech laws but only for those critiquing Israel, or am I wrong in saying that?
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/countries-with-freedom-of-speech
The index of free speech by country would like a word.
I love that not only is Scandinavia at the top as always. But that even UK which ofte. Gets bashed my usa for having less free speech actually outranks usa by quite a bit.
There's a massive hippocracy in these comments from Americans who think that constitutional rights are absolute; they aren't, and the government can change or reinterpret them if they want. There's limits like threatening, incitement, false statements of fact, defamation, some state and local laws still outlaw swearing in the vicinity of a church. When you consider all of that it's not much different from speech in any other developed country, but because other countries enact those protections in ways other than a codified constitution, Americans consider it non-existent.
Even if that is the benchmark, the US is not alone in having codified constitutional rights. I'm Canadian, and we have a codified Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
I suspect all those commenters would still argue that my country is less free because it doesn't have gun rights in it.
And I suppose I should note our Canadian Charter is only from the 1980s, and it's not like we were an unfree hellish place without rights before then.
We also have it codified in Ireland, too, under Bunreacht na hÉireann (The constitution of Ireland), so yeah, the Yanks aren't alone in that.
Interestingly the (heavily criticised) UK comes quite a few places higher than the US in almost every international ranking of freedoms, including Freedom House's 'Freedom on the Net' index.
It's almost as if a negative right might not deliver optimal public goods without adjacent positive rights.
Thousands?...news to me.....Your President just suggested that people should be charged with treason ( which carries a death sentence) for speculating about his health and you say WE don't have free speech!
"Soldiers, remember you not only have the right but the legal requirement to disobey an unlawful order" retired us captain and astronaut
"He should be shot for treason!" - Draft dodging president.
Man, the second half of that americans comment in the OP is obviously cooked, but this is a real thing. More than 2000 brits have been arrested this year during peaceful protest for the phrase "I support palestine action". That isn't to say that the UKs necessarily has less free speech than the US, but let's try and not sugarcoat our governments autocratic actions, because if we do, we're no better than the people being made fun of in these posts.
I really want to say you're trolling, but I know better, so I'll just ask for you to pass the sauce
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-health-new-york-times-sedition-treason-b2881482.html
"People get arrested for slander" Yes, because slander is a crime.
And in almost every country (except Korea) truth is an absolute defense to Slander/Libel
Yeah, slander by definition is false. If you're not lying it can't be slander
Although I guess defamation would be more accurate to what I was saying, in most countries truth is a defense against it. But a few places (like cited Korea) have laws that punish defamation even if true if they deem it was done purely for petty reason rather than public interest.
For example, even if you have proof and a confession it would be punishable to expose someone had to go to the hospital after inserting something inappropriate down certain body parts because although it might be true, sharing such sensitive information serves no purpose but to humiliate.
It's not that rare actually
Inserting something inappropriate in your ass?
"Yeah, slander by definition is false. If you're not lying it can't be slander"
But you see, when these people are talking about "free speech" what they mean is an absolutist definition of speech that is incompatible with a civil society. They think/ want "free speech" to include lying,. misinformation, (their type of) propaganda, and all other types of speech that works to degrade debates. They like it that way because this is the only way they have to communicate in order to get express their views and ideas.
But of course they only mean this for their views, not for anyone else's. They'll slander but as soon as some slanders them (meaning the truth), well "you can't do that! That's against the law!"
[eye roll]
Slander is not a crime in the UK. You can't be arrested for it. It is a civil matter. If you're slandered, you have to sue in a civil court for redress...(get money).
And even then the amounts are generally to do with either financial losses or reputational losses. It’s why Trump trying to sue the BBC for stupid money would never fly - he didn’t lose out financially and his reputation is already garbage, so how badly could they have damaged it!
Yeah they'd probably be awarded more in legal fees than damages. It's not like the BBC's editing of one TV program has damaged his reputation so severely that he can no longer accept bribes from Qatar & FIFA.
Since when do the seppos care about the truth.
In fairness, the American didn't say there were arrests for slander in England/the UK, he claimed that of Germany. The person at the top of this chain was wrong in that in several countries, slander isn't a crime, it a civil matter.
It's also only a civil offence here in Germany, it's really hard to get arrested for it.
Exactly. Germany is also way less arrest-happy than the US. It's a rather rare occurrence. Lying like this only shows they don't know much about a society.
Prime example: Ursula Haverbeck for Holocaust denial, it took ages to put her into prison.
Unfortunately, yes. Lil' ol ladies are not harmless per se.
Depends where you are, in many countries it's considered a civil matter, not criminal. It is civil in the UK and US.
It shouldn't be, it's a civil matter. No one should be arrested for slander.
Meanwhile, Trump is trying to get 1 year in prison for people who burns the USAian flag and most his sycophant supporters think it's a good idea.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/08/prosecuting-burning-of-the-american-flag/
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2ObpLpv2HVc?t=18
While they do, and that's why anyone going to the World Cup has to submit their Bebo and MySpace accounts to make sure they didn't say America Bad as a 14 year old
Please excuse me...hahahahahahahahahahahah. Fucking Seppos.
i want to comment but i cannot as the UK doesnt have free speech sorry
Straight to jail for that comment. Prepare to never see the light of day again, you scum
Sorry I will never comment again please don’t send me to jail
I love that the index of free speech has UK quite a bit higher than USA.
It actually annoys me how often I see this shit about people being "jailed" for socialedia posts in the uk. It's like the conservative Americans go to response to anything about the UK. In fairness the media in the UK aren't helping because apparently the truth is irrelevant and clicks matter. So for anyone that's interested:
The rate of convictions under the communications act is at an all time low and continues to fall. The stats are available online for anyone to see. The number of arrests are up because when a report of a crime is made and the police "invite" someone in for an interview it's an arrest. The amount of reports of alleged crimes involving the communications misuse act are up. But very very few make it to trial.
Now investigating most of the reports is a waste of time, but the police have to investigate that is their job. There are even some cases (the ones the media always likes to shout about) from 6 years ago that were convicted and then overturned.
The laws pretty clear where we stand on inciting violence, hate speech and making death threats. If people can't comprehend that then so be it.
https://preview.redd.it/v7z2g4wzcn6g1.png?width=630&format=png&auto=webp&s=814a3b8c5ccb362fafe1e94e6021d5cc81957341
I was just arrested for reading this comment.
Source - “these days”
Whatever you do don't go to the UAE where you can be arrested imprisoned for a year and given 10 lashes for insulting someone on social media.
I am happy they think that way. That way they stay in their own shit country and don't come here. it's a win win.
Fun fact: That guy complaining about his friend who got a ticket for not locking their car in Germany while living on an american military base and how America can't do that due to the fourth amendment... is actually a US military regulation: Lock your vehicle, it's the law | Article | The United States Army
USAREUR is the manual for US military regulations for those living on bases.
Now that is embarrassing. Instead of making a good point, he's publicly humiliating his friend.
I was already wondering what that guy was smoking.
It's mandatory under German traffic law. § 14 StVo to be specific. You are required to make efforts to secure your car against use by others.
So it's actually a valid point. But in exchange for this law you can drink beer without a stupid paper bag in public in Germany, also it's actual beer and not piss.
Guys, I don’t understand what the issue is here.
This weird guy on the internet said Europe doesn’t have free speech, he is very obviously a leading expert on the subject, as you can tell by his extensive list of citations and sources to support his claim.
I think we all just need to accept what he says, arguing would be pointless in the face of such obvious authority.
Eveeyone knows that all leading scholars on Europe are Americans who still live in mom's basement.
That’s correct. Because as of yesterday, we’ll be denied ESTA’s if we say something the mango Mussolini doesn’t like.
AH AH AH...the mere idea of French people not being able to be VERY VOCAL and sometimes downright rude when speaking their mind frankly and freely.. .it's been a national sports for centuries .
But the law is very clear with what is free speech , and what constitutes hate speech. We do not tolerate illegal verbal violence , same as with guns ; in my country neither are supposed to aim at damaging people.
Let's compare prison populations per capita.
I noticed lately that they seem to have some problems understanding the per capita concept, lol. Too smart, too heavilly educated, no doubt.
The Bill of Rights 😆 when you need to enumerate your rights then you probably don't have many. Most people in Britain are just free through common laws
Do American cops even respect the laws around illegal search and seizure?
Also, the "leverage" that the government doesn't have over you is instead held by corporations, and since you don't vote for them you have no say in what they do with it.
Germany doesn't arrest people for slander. If we'd do that our prisons would be as full as those of the great US of A. Also maybe they should ask their TV networks why they caved before their orange Idiot when he threatened to press slander charges because of their late night comedians ...
We even told the president of Turkey off when he wanted to do that to German comedians for making him the aim of their jokes.
The US isn't even the most free country in North America...
Saying thousands of people in the UK are arrested over speech, ignoring that 100% of the time is it because of harassment, is like saying people are arrested for just standing in the street outside someone’s house for stalking.
And most of the stats are due to stalking and harassment, not some random social media post
Once again the UK gets a bad reputation because someone was arrested for inciting violence. Because it was online, that's just free speech, apparently.
After they announced social media examination for anyone entering the US, I kinda think the World Cup is gonna be a little short on spectators
Wasn't there a few people in UK arrested for inciting violence?
Not thousands a year for free speech
My kid might not even be able to wear a rainbow on their shirt in case a Christian gets offended. They might be deemed a domestic terrorist.
Is Trump not doing exactly what he wants even if it is forbidden by the constitution and even his political opposition are just pretending its not happening for some reason?
The lack of education is actually horrifying
There’s theoretical freedoms, and then there’s actual incarceration rates.
We definitely have more freedom of speech than any American will experience at home.
The heck... The one about locked cars is new to me.
I wonder who keeps coming up with these completely unfounded and abstruse claims about Europe?
Unfortunately, we have had to get used to the fact that those who spread such nonsense are completely oblivious to it.
Comments like this are the end result of a decades-long propaganda campaign that has been telling Americans that we are the best, have the best, and no one else has what we have. I've come to realize, this is how masses are brainwashed and wars are started when the wrong people take control. There is no connection with reality, just the vibes they see from their favorite propagandists.
I will admit I haven't visited our great neighbouring country of Italy since quite a few years, but I don't recall carabinieri:
a. Carrying submachine guns
b. Drawing on anyone at all, and much less for basic traffic violations
I don't know what the fuck these people are getting high with but damn...
True, we don't have free speech in germany. We only have freedom of opinion. The bigest differences are that hate speech and Nazi propaganda are banned. Why ban Nazis? Because of human dignity and democracy both being incompatible with Nazis.
When 'free speech' is a licence to be an asshole (as it is in the USA), it is a good thing most countries don't have it.
Yes, defamation is a crime in other parts of the world. And that's a good thing. We have fewer assholes.
They seem awfully attached to the Bill of Rights for people who voted in a fascist administration who would cancel the Constitution tomorrow if they could get away with it
Yes we do, we're free to tell American tourists to f**k off back where they came from anytime we like.
I can stand in the middle of my european town square and loudly proclaim that I am doing to murder my head of state, with no legal consequence.
The difference that most people miss is, in Europe we see freedom as "freedom from x" while in the US it's seen as "freedom to x"
I don’t know how other European countries handle it but in Germany there is indeed no freedom of speech. Instead there’s freedom of voicing your opinion. You can basically say and do everything until it is insulting, denying or glorifying crimes and so on
I feel sad, knowing that these people think that, while we continue into a spiral with all of this "For the kids!!!" stuff in the states
It all comes down to weapons grade propaganda. Pledge of allegiance is quite overbearing too, I imagine it's hard to question things when you keep swearing your loyalty
You can see across multiple international indices that the US doesn’t come close to ranking first in key measures of freedom..from economic liberty to civil rights and broader democratic indicators.
That alone is enough to counter the simplistic narratives these people push. Yet many will still dismiss the data, echoing the denialism popularised by their orange tinted president, insisting it’s all “fake.” At this point, it’s hard to argue the US hasn’t crossed a point of no return.
Someone tell that idiot that to be arrested and prosecuted for slander you must have said something genuinely untrue with the intention of causing harm.
In America they don't have this but what they do have is laws that allow you to sue someone for saying something that makes them look bad even if it's true.
The people arrested over social media made threats to politicians.
Im certain that'd get you arrested in America too
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_freedom_indices
Save this link for if you're ever in one of these chats. 53rd. They're 53rd. They're not even top 50 for MA FREEDUM
*cough*
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/oct/31/tennessee-man-jailed-charlie-kirk-meme
He didn't incite violence, or even say anything particularly tasteless. Five weeks in the slammer anyway.