Reasonable suspicion is a very low bar for federal agents and allowing them to violate the 4th ammendment is dangerous for everyone. Thats the point of outrage for most people. Plus racial profiling as policy is just gross lets be honest
But it’s working? It’s not like they are just storming the streets and sweeping up tons of brown people like Reddit fantasy resistance fighters are pretending they’re doing. They do targeted ops with deportation orders, go after license plates registered to people w deportation orders, stuff like that. And then if people are picked up and found to be illegal via reasonable suspicion, that’s a bonus.
There’s a reason reasonable suspicion exists, if we did everything on a technicality people would get away with anything. Well, you didn’t see X stab that person so you can’t PROVE they did it, even though X is standing above them covered in scratches and holding the knife. We have to use common sense. There’s a reason reasonable suspicion, officer discretion exists. If ICE/DHS rolls up to a spot frequented by illegals on a deportation order, and they watch someone hanging out in that area notice the feds and begin booking it, common sense says they are running for a reason. At that point if caught they run their name and birth and if they’re a citizen, nothing to worry about. If they don’t check out, then we get another illegal out.
If I’m not mistaken, those additional factors are pretty subjective. I’m pretty sure it includes wind speed, pollen count, and certainly ICE agent mood.
Easy there with that leap, Evil Knievel! Just because people complain of ICE doesn’t mean they are complicit with illegals. It’s the manner of execution by ICE protected by sketchy laws without due process that people have a problem with. If it’s too complicated for you to comprehend, I’d understand. We’re not a 3rd world country but our education system resembles one.
While your first statement is partially true, your overall argument still falls short of the truth. The matter of execution in ICE's enforcement isn't corrupt, or else they wouldn't be enforced to begin with. Plus, if people have a problem with the way the law is enforced, no one is forcing them to continue to reside here. If it's avoided due process, then why was every judicial review in approval of it's very existence?
To conclude,
There is no shame in not knowing everything. Everyone plays this game on the internet where they quickly google or ai search for responses and act as if they’re experts on hundreds of topics. For instance, I don’t know much about native Americans. Does that make me an idiot? I just want our state to be safe. People act like that's committing a crime 🤷♂️.
I saw a story today about a Chinese father and his 6 year old son who lived in NYC who got deported back to China. They ran away from there, and entered into US from Mexico.
DHS was like "We are happy to report we were able to remove the family back to their home country."
It's like wow, I feel safer already guys. It's part of America, and part of these big cities like LA and NY. You can do it, but why do you have to be happy about it?
Will you work at a poultry plant for $10 an hour? You won’t. An illegal immigrant will. The corporation and the illegal immigrant win because they can get away with paying an illegal immigrant $10 an hour and the immigrant gets a wage much much more than they could in Mexico. The person born in Los Angeles is the real loser here. “But but corporations should just pay them both $30 an hour at the poultry plant!!!1!1!” Ok and free ice cream and no homework for life.
So either the wages go up so much that chicken at the store costs a lot more, or everyone imports it from other countries
I think it's wrong to want illegal immigrants to be here so we can pay them less than a fair wage and exploit them just so that we can have cheaper goods.
It's unskilled labor, whether legal or illegal, and America depends on it and does not have enough of it, so it depends in immigrants in some fashion for that part of the economy. That's what I've read and heard experts say
Sure, but you can't just pay people less because they're not legal then advocate to keep illigal immigrants because they're cheap and you don't want to pay more for your food.
Immigrants, and illegal immigration, is a fact in the United States of America. It always has been (although for a big part there was no such thing as illegal immigration).
This rabidly anti-immigrant and nativist "America first" stuff, where they expect people born in America to do all the jobs -- see the rejection of HB1 visas for instance -- is going to backfire big time.
The ICE crackdowns, which are politically motivated, are part and parcel of the whole movement
Most agree and we think the poultry plant owner should go to prison, not the person making pennies to support their family. Get rid of the opportunity for work by punishing the companies not the people. You’ll see undocumented worker number drop quickly.
Agreed. For years I've been saying that if you fine companies $50,000 per violation for the first offense then $100,000 per second offense and owners/upper management goes for prison for mandatory 6 months term, within 1 year the majority of undocumented would drop as they would leave on their own. You wouldn't even have to round them up.
If course it's not as simple as I've made it out to be, but the concept is there.
Executive management and company directors should face minimum prison time that is based both on volume of persons employed and duration of employment. Fines should be both calculated based on lost tax revenue and punitive based on a significant multiple to make it crippling to the business. Bankruptcy should force the company to new ownership if the business is necessary to the population (food) or permanent closure.
That is a poor analogy that doesn't fit any legal doctrine because our nation is not 'personal property'.
Walking across the border has always been a misdemeanor, because it is a minor infraction. It isn't analogous to posing a threat of stealing one's property or anything that violent because we are a society of many, not a house of a few.
The only thing I can think of that would be analogous to what you said would be an army of another country invading ours.
People coming here for work, to pay taxes into our system with out many of the benefit from them, often without even the benefit of the protection of our labor laws, only pose a benefit to our society as cheap labor that we exploit.
When they rise up from those circumstances, they have literally earned it - something this country generally respects.
You have been mislead into directing your fear and hate at immigrants, literally talked into persecuting a scapegoat.
It is not admirable, and it only continues the worst parts of this country's legacies instead of its best.
You mean "squatting" like white Europeans have been doing to indigenous people, then Californios, then freed slaves, then descendants of slaves, and are currently doing in the West Bank, and like MAGA is threatening to do in Greenland Canada, and wherever else they feel entitled to? You mean squatting like that?
The vast majority of them have taxes deducted by default.
Honestly, since they do not get many public services, I don't really care about any that maybe find a loophole or are paid under the table.
The majority of them get paid far less than a citizen would for the same work - which again, benefits their boss and likely any customers of their goods, so generally, it benefits us. It is ridiculous to punish or resent them for that.
When it comes to "obey our laws" - it really depends on the laws. I do not care that they technically "broke the law" by getting here. I do not care that the situation we put them in forces them to skirt some regulations just to survive here.
Let's work on a framework of a "criminal". This is someone who seeks to take advantage of others via harm or fear. Drug dealers? Yes fine, deport them. Car jackers? Gone. Pimps or human traffickers who are physically abusing their wards? Fuck them.
But guess what? Criminals are dangerous. ICE doesn't want to fuck with them. If anything, ICE would like to recruit them because they are looking for people who have no problem bashing the skulls of parents into the ground in front of their screaming children, and then zip-tying the children and telling them to shut the fuck up or they'll get the same as they are all dragged to hellish ghettos.
OUR GOVERNMENT is building an army of violent criminals with badges. I care a lot more about that.
How do these people afford to live in LA and just hang out on bridges making signs all day? I live here and I actually have to work to live. Must be nice.
This is disingenuous and demonstrates bad faith. You don’t seem to understand that (1) we don’t worship Obama and think he had plenty of bad policy, and (2) his deportations used due process with judicial oversight and sought to deport people actually worth deporting. Good job, though.
Mexicans Ain't Going Anywhere
No one said all mexicans need to go anywhere.
Just the illegal ones.
Apparently you missed when the Supreme Court said ICE can arrest based on the color of your skin and not your legal status.
Partially true. Race alone cannot be a basis for questioning. Additional factors must also be present.
Kavanaugh disagrees with you, and, because this country has no standards, he got to make rules.
It’s still not the ruling you claim it is. Did you even read the ruling?
Nope, these people only read headlines
Reasonable suspicion is a very low bar for federal agents and allowing them to violate the 4th ammendment is dangerous for everyone. Thats the point of outrage for most people. Plus racial profiling as policy is just gross lets be honest
But it’s working? It’s not like they are just storming the streets and sweeping up tons of brown people like Reddit fantasy resistance fighters are pretending they’re doing. They do targeted ops with deportation orders, go after license plates registered to people w deportation orders, stuff like that. And then if people are picked up and found to be illegal via reasonable suspicion, that’s a bonus.
There’s a reason reasonable suspicion exists, if we did everything on a technicality people would get away with anything. Well, you didn’t see X stab that person so you can’t PROVE they did it, even though X is standing above them covered in scratches and holding the knife. We have to use common sense. There’s a reason reasonable suspicion, officer discretion exists. If ICE/DHS rolls up to a spot frequented by illegals on a deportation order, and they watch someone hanging out in that area notice the feds and begin booking it, common sense says they are running for a reason. At that point if caught they run their name and birth and if they’re a citizen, nothing to worry about. If they don’t check out, then we get another illegal out.
GTFOH
If I’m not mistaken, those additional factors are pretty subjective. I’m pretty sure it includes wind speed, pollen count, and certainly ICE agent mood.
Proof?
All I had to do was google “Kavanaugh stop”.
Here is the original PDF.
Here is a summary and analysis from Stanford’s law school.
It’s an analysis by a law school student who admittedly has a bias against the deportations going on.
I'm not googling that for you. Stop being lazy.
Bro can’t even be bothered to give a source
90% of reddit users my guy
Remember, no one is illegal on stolen land.
Are there areas of the world that were never “stolen” from someone else?
A lot of em are
going to California
Lots of bots in this comment section…
Yeah the maga bat signal (a leaky diaper?) went up I guess.
Bro what does that even mean lmao
Trump shits himself so I assume the maga bots in the comments were called at once by an alternate version of the Batman bat signal
They’re not sending their best
1200 upvotes and just 70 comments. Totally organic and legit positive engagement for this post I’m sure.
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Every single ice agent is a fucking coward and a traitor.
So you're saying we should just allow illegal immigrants to take advantage of our benefits without penalty? We're not a 3rd world country lol
Yall got benefits taken away either way 😂 we still pay for our own insurance and everything . We get taxed for breathing bro
Easy there with that leap, Evil Knievel! Just because people complain of ICE doesn’t mean they are complicit with illegals. It’s the manner of execution by ICE protected by sketchy laws without due process that people have a problem with. If it’s too complicated for you to comprehend, I’d understand. We’re not a 3rd world country but our education system resembles one.
While your first statement is partially true, your overall argument still falls short of the truth. The matter of execution in ICE's enforcement isn't corrupt, or else they wouldn't be enforced to begin with. Plus, if people have a problem with the way the law is enforced, no one is forcing them to continue to reside here. If it's avoided due process, then why was every judicial review in approval of it's very existence?
To conclude, There is no shame in not knowing everything. Everyone plays this game on the internet where they quickly google or ai search for responses and act as if they’re experts on hundreds of topics. For instance, I don’t know much about native Americans. Does that make me an idiot? I just want our state to be safe. People act like that's committing a crime 🤷♂️.
I saw a story today about a Chinese father and his 6 year old son who lived in NYC who got deported back to China. They ran away from there, and entered into US from Mexico.
DHS was like "We are happy to report we were able to remove the family back to their home country."
It's like wow, I feel safer already guys. It's part of America, and part of these big cities like LA and NY. You can do it, but why do you have to be happy about it?
Happy about ensuring the law is applied fairly and evenly to everyone in violation of it. Sounds like a win to me.
Tell that to the citizens being pulled from their cars like that nurse, must be nice to be cruel
Will you work in a poultry plant? I won't either.
So either the wages go up so much that chicken at the store costs a lot more, or everyone imports it from other countries
Will you work at a poultry plant for $10 an hour? You won’t. An illegal immigrant will. The corporation and the illegal immigrant win because they can get away with paying an illegal immigrant $10 an hour and the immigrant gets a wage much much more than they could in Mexico. The person born in Los Angeles is the real loser here. “But but corporations should just pay them both $30 an hour at the poultry plant!!!1!1!” Ok and free ice cream and no homework for life.
I think it's wrong to want illegal immigrants to be here so we can pay them less than a fair wage and exploit them just so that we can have cheaper goods.
IMO it's a form of slavery.
It's unskilled labor, whether legal or illegal, and America depends on it and does not have enough of it, so it depends in immigrants in some fashion for that part of the economy. That's what I've read and heard experts say
Sure, but you can't just pay people less because they're not legal then advocate to keep illigal immigrants because they're cheap and you don't want to pay more for your food.
That take is pretty reprehensible imo.
Immigrants, and illegal immigration, is a fact in the United States of America. It always has been (although for a big part there was no such thing as illegal immigration).
This rabidly anti-immigrant and nativist "America first" stuff, where they expect people born in America to do all the jobs -- see the rejection of HB1 visas for instance -- is going to backfire big time.
The ICE crackdowns, which are politically motivated, are part and parcel of the whole movement
Most agree and we think the poultry plant owner should go to prison, not the person making pennies to support their family. Get rid of the opportunity for work by punishing the companies not the people. You’ll see undocumented worker number drop quickly.
Agreed. For years I've been saying that if you fine companies $50,000 per violation for the first offense then $100,000 per second offense and owners/upper management goes for prison for mandatory 6 months term, within 1 year the majority of undocumented would drop as they would leave on their own. You wouldn't even have to round them up.
If course it's not as simple as I've made it out to be, but the concept is there.
Executive management and company directors should face minimum prison time that is based both on volume of persons employed and duration of employment. Fines should be both calculated based on lost tax revenue and punitive based on a significant multiple to make it crippling to the business. Bankruptcy should force the company to new ownership if the business is necessary to the population (food) or permanent closure.
Agree 100%
This has been my argument that the Republicans aren't serious about stopping illigal immigration.
Wait until you find out about prison labor
New legal immigrants will.
Bingo. Break the law and face the consequences. Not a tough concept to grasp
Can’t wait for these fools, many recently hired with no training, to be fired.
I love my city!!!
Back lash against these facists, is coming, no need to hold back anymore.
✊
Dope, my neighborhood. That bridge gets used for protest all the time, I love it!
They out there everyday.
Sponsored by the New World Globalists
No no thank you. Deport those ho ho hoes
This one offends me
Don’t worry, they’re all going to HELLLLL!!!
There is a little bit of irony in that statement
No there is not.
When people immigrate here, this becomes their home.
And it is good for all of us when they come, work, build their families here, and make our culture richer and stronger.
It is the legacy of the vast majority of us.
Illegally crossing the border isnt immigration.
This is like saying is a squatter walks into your home when you leave the front door unlocked, you are required to make them part of your family.
Apparently you also need to read the Constitution again. You sure are commentong fast for not knowing anything.
That is a poor analogy that doesn't fit any legal doctrine because our nation is not 'personal property'.
Walking across the border has always been a misdemeanor, because it is a minor infraction. It isn't analogous to posing a threat of stealing one's property or anything that violent because we are a society of many, not a house of a few.
The only thing I can think of that would be analogous to what you said would be an army of another country invading ours.
People coming here for work, to pay taxes into our system with out many of the benefit from them, often without even the benefit of the protection of our labor laws, only pose a benefit to our society as cheap labor that we exploit.
When they rise up from those circumstances, they have literally earned it - something this country generally respects.
You have been mislead into directing your fear and hate at immigrants, literally talked into persecuting a scapegoat.
It is not admirable, and it only continues the worst parts of this country's legacies instead of its best.
You mean "squatting" like white Europeans have been doing to indigenous people, then Californios, then freed slaves, then descendants of slaves, and are currently doing in the West Bank, and like MAGA is threatening to do in Greenland Canada, and wherever else they feel entitled to? You mean squatting like that?
Would you say that regardless if they pay taxes or obey our laws?
The vast majority of them have taxes deducted by default. Honestly, since they do not get many public services, I don't really care about any that maybe find a loophole or are paid under the table.
The majority of them get paid far less than a citizen would for the same work - which again, benefits their boss and likely any customers of their goods, so generally, it benefits us. It is ridiculous to punish or resent them for that.
When it comes to "obey our laws" - it really depends on the laws. I do not care that they technically "broke the law" by getting here. I do not care that the situation we put them in forces them to skirt some regulations just to survive here.
Let's work on a framework of a "criminal". This is someone who seeks to take advantage of others via harm or fear. Drug dealers? Yes fine, deport them. Car jackers? Gone. Pimps or human traffickers who are physically abusing their wards? Fuck them.
But guess what? Criminals are dangerous. ICE doesn't want to fuck with them. If anything, ICE would like to recruit them because they are looking for people who have no problem bashing the skulls of parents into the ground in front of their screaming children, and then zip-tying the children and telling them to shut the fuck up or they'll get the same as they are all dragged to hellish ghettos.
OUR GOVERNMENT is building an army of violent criminals with badges. I care a lot more about that.
Awesome
That's like telling the American Indians to go home. They're already home. Dumbass
Lol Reddit
OPEN BORDERS is the ONLY WAY. Any “enforcement” operation will ALWAYS lead to separation of families
The no kings flag in Cali is hilarious. Remember when newscum was sending swat teams to arrest families on the beach? Lol. Pepperidge farm remembers.
https://preview.redd.it/e10ol8i9dl8g1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ce499ab2d14fd1ac7e0c9ee236adc124a6774059
Whatever happen to American Pride?
How do these people afford to live in LA and just hang out on bridges making signs all day? I live here and I actually have to work to live. Must be nice.
Man, if only there were an agency whose sole purpose is to kick unwelcomed people out.
I love ICE. Thankfully they're deporting the bad guys ❤️
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Meaning ICE and their illegal search and seizure, right?
Get ready for the downvotes 😂😂
The downvoted comments are the best 🤣 Angry liberals are pure comedy.
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Can they do them with due process like Obama did?
This is disingenuous and demonstrates bad faith. You don’t seem to understand that (1) we don’t worship Obama and think he had plenty of bad policy, and (2) his deportations used due process with judicial oversight and sought to deport people actually worth deporting. Good job, though.
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It's kinda like how saying it's still true that you can overdose and die on water. Yes, it's still true, but you're still fucking stupid.
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Nah
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