This is the most accurate and truthful sentence I’ve read on the Internet in a very long time. Another case in point - father of measles victim in W Texas.
I have to wonder if Grace’s family could achieve some level of healing if they’d had her vaccinated, especially since she was at high risk for covid. They didn’t, she died, it’s their fault, and now they want someone else to pay.
This is like the interview with the father whose daughter died of measles in Texas. He said he would rather have a dead daughter than a live one that had a vaccine. That just blew me away.
Did some digging around and found these tidbits of information.
“Protocols have destroyed what used to be the art of medicine,” he [plaintiff's attorney] said. “Now it’s the protocols of medicine.”
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Scott Schara said he believed his family faced biases for being Christian and for the fact that Grace Schara was unvaccinated against COVID-19.
My guess is the hospital discussed with them the various options and didn't understand or didn't want to understand or thought they could pray harder.
The complaint said the Schara family did not discuss “do not resuscitate” status or end-of-life care for Grace Schara at any point.
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The story told by Randall Guse, Shokar’s attorney, was different.
It sounds like the family didn't want her intubated. Remember there was a lot of conspiracy theories floating around how hospitals were using intubation to kill patients.
His client, he said during closing arguments, was responding to the Schara family’s wish to avoid putting Grace Schara on a ventilator, which would require a breathing tube.
“If you cannot address the underlying cause of the cardiac arrest — in this case respiratory failure, and that means address it with intubation — CPR, defibrillation, all that is futile,” he said.
The ability of Christians to feel persecuted while dominating the entire culture is their most impressive trait. The hospital was named Ascension Hospital, FFS.
Being persecuted is the cornerstone of Christianity. If they aren't, they'll make up something. If they legit are, they'll milk it for what it's worth. See, being a martyr is imperative. It elevates their status into heaven. Happy Holidays.
The only religion that takes a symbol of hideous torture as its central symbol and object of veneration.
I wish I could say that the connection between a sense of persecution and the aggressive urge to persecute others was only present in fringe versions of Christianity.
Yeah, my experience of non-fake Christians is that the whole persecution thing is pretty widespread. It's not my job to defend Christianity. I'm in one of their target groups.
It's not plausible to call everyone whose Christianity doesn't match yours "fake." They're not fake; they just use their religion differently. This issue is deeply embedded in scripture and church history. It's a part of the mainstream.
Bias against Christians....
At Ascension, the hospital that won't do sterilizations because it goes against the Pope's teaching (to be fair they will refer you to a different facility)
...ok
Funny how they manage to forget just who was president of the United States during the first year of the pandemic. Honestly, you just can't reason with people who are so devoid of common sense.
I recall from some Jordan Klepper interview where the guy he was talking to was saying (during Biden's time?) that Trump was actually in charge of the military. "Completely in charge?" "Yep". "Totally?" "Yep, totally in charge of the whole military"
"Even this really egregious thing you just complained about that makes us look bad?"
Error, error, Fox News talking point not found, error...BRRZZHGY!!!)(&!*
It reminds me of that meme where the reporter asks the redneck in the MAGA hat why Obama wasn’t in the Oval Office on September 11, and the redneck says he’d sure like to find out. I have it saved on my phone, I think.
Also reminds me of the time when Bill O'Reilly, a man you'd think would surely know his facts, showed up on CNN (I think) and tried to argue that Biden was president when Jeffrey Epstein was sent to prison and died in prison (2019).
I’ve been a Christian for 41 years (my whole life) and not ONCE have I ever felt like anything in my life was done to me because of my religion. Now….i can say it has been done because I’m black but no one ever asked who I believed in before they did anything to me, questioned me or refused service. The amount of Christian “victims” is crazy….
It makes me mad when they claim to be Christian but can't cite one single Bible verse to defend their weird eschewing of medical advice from doctors, esp covid stuff and vaccines. It's not 'religious persecution' if they can't explain scripturally what their objection is.
I’ll say this in regard to my faith….I believe that God gave me common sense and has shown that when a human that has knowledge about something that is beyond my comprehension, no only will I do my own research but if it will protect me I won’t find a scripture to contradict it. I’ll take that scientific discovery as a sign from God to not be an idiot.
If more Christian’s in the US were like you, I probably wouldn’t have grown to have such a disgust of the religion in general. Now that I’m older I’m trying to reconcile that it doesn’t have to be a a binary choice of all good/bad, but damn do people like this make it hard.
Most of us are laid back non judgmental people. The ones that do use Christianity as some sort of catch all moral compass are the ones that yell the loudest. I live my life based off of what I personally believe. What others do or don’t believe is on them. I will never condemn anyone for not believing what I believe or use my religion as a weapon. They must not have read the part of the New Testament where Jesus said “I never said do any of that crap you’re doing in my name. Stop being stupid.”
Scott Schara said he believed his family faced biases for being Christian and for the fact that Grace Schara was unvaccinated against COVID-19.
He keeps a website in memory of his daughter, where he writes that the COVID-19 pandemic might have been used to kill disabled and elderly Americans, with the involvement of the federal government. On one page, he writes that COVID and its vaccines are both part of “Satan’s plan,” and that “God’s truth is outside of this fishbowl.”
The family told the hospital that they refused a ventilator. The hospital took that as a DNR given that a ventilator was the only effective treatment. There may have been some miscommunication, but if you refuse life saving treatment because the Internet told you to, don't be surprised when you don't get life saving treatment.
Scott is a moron who seems to think that if they resuscitated her she would just magically breathe on her own, without a vent they'd have to continue compressions eternally. Great idea
This is the first I've heard of this case and I am confused by the intubation and DNR. Was it that the family said "we don't want her intubated" or "we don't want her on a ventilator", and the doctor said something like "well then that is effectively a do-not-resuscitate directive, since we can't resuscitate without intubation"? Another way to phrase my confusion is that if the family is contesting the DNR, or knowledge of the DNR, then how did it come to be in the first place? Isn't that something the family has to opt into?
The father believes that vents kill people and when they took her in straight away said no vent regardless. He then started turning off all her machines as they were noisy, got kicked out, maintained the no vent rule, she crashed and there was no point attempting resus.
They didn't agree to a DNR, they agreed to a DNI. But if you can't breathe, you need a vent so it might as well be a DNR.
The need to find someone else to blame can be strong. Not Covid related, but my BIL died last year, and his widow, children, and mother still discuss suing the hospital. But realistically he had zero chance by the time he was hospitalized with mini strokes and multiple organ failures, all stemming from refusing to treat diabetes because he believed that drugs like insulin were "a big pharma scam".
Legal strategies discussed include:
Neglect. After 5 months in the hospital he had bed sores to the bone that were classified as terminal.
Bias. They refused to give him a new kidney for... weird reasons. Truth is he had been on a transplant list for almost 5 years, but kept getting bounced due to non compliance.
Failure to resuscitate. The hospital ethics panel had issued a DNR without the family signing off on it.. Or possibly his widow did sign off, without completely understanding. In either case, he just wasn't coming back, was suffering terribly, and he was going to die that day either way.
It's just talk, they don't have resources to sue and would surely lose anyway, but it's an outlet for them to blame the hospital.
No one is arguing that serious mistakes, even leading to death, aren't happening. Fortunately they are the exception. That doesn't make it any easier for you.
there were a few people misdiagnosed heart attacks as gall stones that summer. i generally inclined to side with doctors & science but these jokers dropped the ball.
Same thing happened to my FIL. They nicked his intestine in an operation refused to acknowledge it. He developed sepsis, was in ICU for 6 weeks. It accelerated dementia for hom, although he still lived a few years longer. California malpractice laws don't favor suing. So no real consequences for the doctor.
I don't think my first response adequately addressed your loss. My condolences.
Gallbladder attacks are often confused with heart attacks and vice versa, as they present very similarly. Usually, however, they rule out the coronary issues first, as they're more immediately deadly. Did they not do an ekg in the ER?
ER RN here: they most certainly got an EKG and people love to say "hospitals killed my loved one" when in fact it was a series of poor choices over a lifetime. These people are lame. Serious coronary events have a low survival rate even in the hospital, no matter the intervention. These folks will do anything but accept responsibility for their own bad decisions.
65+yo male, recent chemo parient, shortness breath, low BP, chest pains & fatigue so bad he couldn't stay awake and they say "gall stones"? no ekg or ct scan
Never underestimate the lengths brainwashed people will go to assuage their own guilt.
This is the most accurate and truthful sentence I’ve read on the Internet in a very long time. Another case in point - father of measles victim in W Texas.
I have to wonder if Grace’s family could achieve some level of healing if they’d had her vaccinated, especially since she was at high risk for covid. They didn’t, she died, it’s their fault, and now they want someone else to pay.
This is like the interview with the father whose daughter died of measles in Texas. He said he would rather have a dead daughter than a live one that had a vaccine. That just blew me away.
Then she meant nothing to him. That is incredibly sad.
That, and evading personal responsibility.
Hope they are buried with attorney fees
I'm guessing the attorneys probably took this case on a contingency fee basis... no fee unless they win.
He’s been meaning to get that business card fixed
I saw what you did there 😂
They claim it's cost a million dollars to go to trial. But that may be what it would have cost, because the award cap is lower than that.
Any attorney who is willing to take this case on contingency deserves the no-money they'll almost certainly get.
Did some digging around and found these tidbits of information.
&
My guess is the hospital discussed with them the various options and didn't understand or didn't want to understand or thought they could pray harder.
&
It sounds like the family didn't want her intubated. Remember there was a lot of conspiracy theories floating around how hospitals were using intubation to kill patients.
The ability of Christians to feel persecuted while dominating the entire culture is their most impressive trait. The hospital was named Ascension Hospital, FFS.
That’s certainly their God’s honest truth!
Being persecuted is the cornerstone of Christianity. If they aren't, they'll make up something. If they legit are, they'll milk it for what it's worth. See, being a martyr is imperative. It elevates their status into heaven. Happy Holidays.
The only religion that takes a symbol of hideous torture as its central symbol and object of veneration.
I wish I could say that the connection between a sense of persecution and the aggressive urge to persecute others was only present in fringe versions of Christianity.
Fake* “Christians”.
Please use some kind of indication that they are butchering the religion they supposedly believe in so that it means everything it preaches against…
They do not represent us, they are not indicative of what we are like, and they certainly don’t follow even the most basic of teachings in the Bible.
Yeah, my experience of non-fake Christians is that the whole persecution thing is pretty widespread. It's not my job to defend Christianity. I'm in one of their target groups.
Then you’ve met a vast number of fakes, I’m sad to say.
It's not plausible to call everyone whose Christianity doesn't match yours "fake." They're not fake; they just use their religion differently. This issue is deeply embedded in scripture and church history. It's a part of the mainstream.
The “art” of medicine?!?!! They don’t want medical practice to have proper protocols?!?! WTF.
For each patient you have to have the right amount of prayer and leeches to cure them.
Don’t forget about magic crystals. Very important to have the right ones.
And bloodletting. Don't forget the bloodletting. How else will you balance the essential humours?
They associate "protocols" with "Zion", very likely.
If the hospital really, truly wanted to kill patients, there would be much quicker and much less complicated ways to do it.
Forcing intubation as the way the kill patients is way too many extra steps.
Bias against Christians.... At Ascension, the hospital that won't do sterilizations because it goes against the Pope's teaching (to be fair they will refer you to a different facility) ...ok
Once I see someone use the word "scamdemic", I immediately begin to suspect some form of mental illness.
Also "plandemic" or new one I just heard "Bidenemic".
Funny how they manage to forget just who was president of the United States during the first year of the pandemic. Honestly, you just can't reason with people who are so devoid of common sense.
I recall from some Jordan Klepper interview where the guy he was talking to was saying (during Biden's time?) that Trump was actually in charge of the military. "Completely in charge?" "Yep". "Totally?" "Yep, totally in charge of the whole military"
"Even this really egregious thing you just complained about that makes us look bad?"
Error, error, Fox News talking point not found, error...BRRZZHGY!!!)(&!*
"Uh... no"
Edit: Found it!
Right? They love to conveniently claim it was Biden who shut the country down.
It reminds me of that meme where the reporter asks the redneck in the MAGA hat why Obama wasn’t in the Oval Office on September 11, and the redneck says he’d sure like to find out. I have it saved on my phone, I think.
Also reminds me of the time when Bill O'Reilly, a man you'd think would surely know his facts, showed up on CNN (I think) and tried to argue that Biden was president when Jeffrey Epstein was sent to prison and died in prison (2019).
A reasonable and useful assumption. If it occurs in my presence, I make myself scarce.
I just assume they suffer from TDS, which means they are deranged enough to support Trump, who is obviously incredibly stupid and incompetent.
I’ve been a Christian for 41 years (my whole life) and not ONCE have I ever felt like anything in my life was done to me because of my religion. Now….i can say it has been done because I’m black but no one ever asked who I believed in before they did anything to me, questioned me or refused service. The amount of Christian “victims” is crazy….
It makes me mad when they claim to be Christian but can't cite one single Bible verse to defend their weird eschewing of medical advice from doctors, esp covid stuff and vaccines. It's not 'religious persecution' if they can't explain scripturally what their objection is.
I’ll say this in regard to my faith….I believe that God gave me common sense and has shown that when a human that has knowledge about something that is beyond my comprehension, no only will I do my own research but if it will protect me I won’t find a scripture to contradict it. I’ll take that scientific discovery as a sign from God to not be an idiot.
If more Christian’s in the US were like you, I probably wouldn’t have grown to have such a disgust of the religion in general. Now that I’m older I’m trying to reconcile that it doesn’t have to be a a binary choice of all good/bad, but damn do people like this make it hard.
Most of us are laid back non judgmental people. The ones that do use Christianity as some sort of catch all moral compass are the ones that yell the loudest. I live my life based off of what I personally believe. What others do or don’t believe is on them. I will never condemn anyone for not believing what I believe or use my religion as a weapon. They must not have read the part of the New Testament where Jesus said “I never said do any of that crap you’re doing in my name. Stop being stupid.”
The only person getting rich from this is their scumbag lawyer. They'll never get a penny, and I'm good with that.
Me too
Christianity is a cancer to this country
What's this about a prize, though? Is someone offering a prize for the most egregious lawsuit against a hospital?
I can only assume it's a reference to the Herman Cain Award or possibly the Darwin Award!
Fuck those assholes. Straight to hell.
From a news article by Wisconsin Public Radio
The family told the hospital that they refused a ventilator. The hospital took that as a DNR given that a ventilator was the only effective treatment. There may have been some miscommunication, but if you refuse life saving treatment because the Internet told you to, don't be surprised when you don't get life saving treatment.
Scott is a moron who seems to think that if they resuscitated her she would just magically breathe on her own, without a vent they'd have to continue compressions eternally. Great idea
This is the first I've heard of this case and I am confused by the intubation and DNR. Was it that the family said "we don't want her intubated" or "we don't want her on a ventilator", and the doctor said something like "well then that is effectively a do-not-resuscitate directive, since we can't resuscitate without intubation"? Another way to phrase my confusion is that if the family is contesting the DNR, or knowledge of the DNR, then how did it come to be in the first place? Isn't that something the family has to opt into?
The father believes that vents kill people and when they took her in straight away said no vent regardless. He then started turning off all her machines as they were noisy, got kicked out, maintained the no vent rule, she crashed and there was no point attempting resus.
They didn't agree to a DNR, they agreed to a DNI. But if you can't breathe, you need a vent so it might as well be a DNR.
The need to find someone else to blame can be strong. Not Covid related, but my BIL died last year, and his widow, children, and mother still discuss suing the hospital. But realistically he had zero chance by the time he was hospitalized with mini strokes and multiple organ failures, all stemming from refusing to treat diabetes because he believed that drugs like insulin were "a big pharma scam".
Legal strategies discussed include:
Neglect. After 5 months in the hospital he had bed sores to the bone that were classified as terminal.
Bias. They refused to give him a new kidney for... weird reasons. Truth is he had been on a transplant list for almost 5 years, but kept getting bounced due to non compliance.
Failure to resuscitate. The hospital ethics panel had issued a DNR without the family signing off on it.. Or possibly his widow did sign off, without completely understanding. In either case, he just wasn't coming back, was suffering terribly, and he was going to die that day either way.
It's just talk, they don't have resources to sue and would surely lose anyway, but it's an outlet for them to blame the hospital.
They killed their daughter because random people on the internet told them to
Even the brain dead vote.
Even without a ridiculous plaintiff, the PREP Act almost guarantees any case like this will fail.
northwell mather misdiagnosed a few coranaries as gall stones. they killed my brother in law.
No one is arguing that serious mistakes, even leading to death, aren't happening. Fortunately they are the exception. That doesn't make it any easier for you.
there were a few people misdiagnosed heart attacks as gall stones that summer. i generally inclined to side with doctors & science but these jokers dropped the ball.
Same thing happened to my FIL. They nicked his intestine in an operation refused to acknowledge it. He developed sepsis, was in ICU for 6 weeks. It accelerated dementia for hom, although he still lived a few years longer. California malpractice laws don't favor suing. So no real consequences for the doctor.
I don't think my first response adequately addressed your loss. My condolences.
Gallbladder attacks are often confused with heart attacks and vice versa, as they present very similarly. Usually, however, they rule out the coronary issues first, as they're more immediately deadly. Did they not do an ekg in the ER?
ER RN here: they most certainly got an EKG and people love to say "hospitals killed my loved one" when in fact it was a series of poor choices over a lifetime. These people are lame. Serious coronary events have a low survival rate even in the hospital, no matter the intervention. These folks will do anything but accept responsibility for their own bad decisions.
65+yo male, recent chemo parient, shortness breath, low BP, chest pains & fatigue so bad he couldn't stay awake and they say "gall stones"? no ekg or ct scan
If it's really as simple as you say, that seems like complete neglect.
😆