Dude I’ve been having this same thought lately for the same reasons. Like why does it feel like there’s so much money to go around but I’m just missing it???
Edit: I know the real answer is more nuanced than just “I want money” but it’s hard to not feel the cold of the pit when you’re standing at the bottom of it barefoot.
Sure, I can get that shit. I've lived and worked long enough to recognise this mindset is the one that screw everything up for everyone. Money is not worth getting a lot of when someone can decide how much to print. It's just a never-ending cycle of hustling to get a lot until it is diluted in the next print. Only those who are connected will have the most money at the end of the day. Average guy on the street gets shafted all the time.
I wasn’t trying to throw shade bro, I understand how you feel, you don’t need to be a billionaire business owner or entrepreneur you just need to make sure your family is eating, has clothes on there back,
I come from an area that is not particularly well off.
Do you know who the happiest, most successful people I know are, out of A and B? B. By a long shot. And they deserve it.
I don’t know many Cs. I know some Bs. I know a lot of As.
If the printing continues, A and B are almost proportionally affected. But they’re probably not, because it’s easier to make and manage money when you have more of it. So B is better off than A. B can also raise more money now that currency is less valuable, while A is a povvo.
This isn’t difficult to understand.
“Money is not worth getting a lot of when someone else can print it…” (not sic) is a ridiculously dumb stance. Like, inflation hits everyone. Who does the best with inflation? The people with money, you rusty spoon.
It's a difference in mindset. If everyone is greedy like person C, and keep hoarding all the money to themselves, person A will be the most affected due to inflation. There's way more person A than person C in the world right now. Person C can also be an individual or a corporation.
Sure it's easy saying go be person B or person C. But the fact is there's going to be person D and person E who will be richer due to money printing going on continuously.
34% of people actually live paycheck to paycheck. Which is insanely high. Though over 60% reported they do, a significant portion of them were determined to have an emergency fund of at least 3 months. Meaning they exaggerated their definition of paycheck to paycheck
Also, while a lot of people live paycheck to paycheck, you can usually look at their parents and you’ll make the connection that oh… mom and dad give them money.
1M NW already at 31, fully paid off house. Assuming no raises and normal growth it should be 8M around 40. Enough for fatfire. I come from a paycheck to paycheck family and during my last year of college, I could afford one meal a day after rent and utilities and tuition. My parents paid my phone bill. That's it.
My secret? Incredible luck and a lot of hard work so I could actually seize the luck. I got a very in demand degree atypically. (Accelerated program, no time for internships) No one would even give me the time of day because everyone else had internships and shit. A single big tech company told me "well let's do a phone screen".
Panick attacked for the hour before. Crushed the phone screen. "Interviews are next". Panicked for 4 hours before the interviews. Took 3 shots of whiskey to calm down. Crushed the interviews. Got a 150k offer right out of school building AI chips from a company that is not NVIDIA in a MCOL city when no one else gave me the time of day.
I stayed, grinded and made a name for myself doing things people said would take too long or were impossible while living below my means for the last 6 years and kept my money diversified. Promoted in a year and a half. Another 80k a year. Promoted again in 3 years. A whopping extra 200k because I was given an additional pay raise because leadership felt my pay still didn't reflect my value that year. On track again for a promotion in a year for another 200k or so.
So after 8 years I will be at 620K a year if I don't fuck up my next promo. I was given literally only a single chance despite thousands of applications. The chance I got, I was able to grab onto and worked my ass off to not get let go during layoffs. I made sure I was on critical projects and would actually deliver instead of being all talk.
Next promo I become effectively untouchable due to how tightly I am intertwined with our product unless we can no longer sell our chips. I will have two years of runway of doing shit before I would hit a performance plan. There is a lot of luck involved but I know many other lucky people who couldn't hang with what is expected at our pay grade.
You mention something a lot of people try to ignore or pretend isn't part of their story, luck.
People can work incredibly hard and someone else can get the step up because they had the right last name, or were just in the right place at the right time.
I remember seeing Bruce Timm, at the time the head of DC Animation, be asked the question, "What do you have to do to get your job?" And he admitted he hated the question because of how much luck played a part in his career.
Yes, he worked hard and yes he was talented, but he got his first animation job because a friend of a friend asked him to fill in after an animator left their studio. He worked on Batman the Animated Series because he was offered two projects to work on and he just thought the other one sounded boring, no one knew BTAS would take off, and all that led to him running DC Animation.
You can work incredibly hard and not get the right breaks or you can catch every break imaginable. People just don't like to admit that luck plays a part.
I tell my entire family how fucking lucky I am and they say "it was inevitable". No it wasn't. I got the perfect job. At the perfect time. Had a shitty boss but my good work got me moved under the PERFECT boss who still supports me to this day. I dodged layoffs. I didn't have to play politics for my promotions. Everything was just smooth.
None of that shit was me. I just happened to be in the right place at the right time where my traits helped me capitalize. I have friends who are FAR smarter, FAR harder working, and way more cracked at everything they do that didn't get nearly the same shot I did.
Dude I have worked with people who put food on peoples tables - they get paid fuck all… but man the work is H A R D physical labour - I seen many many grown men quite unable to ‘hang’. I also am a volunteer fire fighter if captain. We do road rescue as well… again fighting wildfires in the Australian bush can break many, and there is nothing like the mental horror of a car accident incident.
Pay grades are rarely liked to social necessities and/or hard work.
Not having a go - just pointing out the issue with link g pay to anything.
It isn't about how physically hard it is in my field. It is about how much you are expected to disrupt your life for the job RELATIVE to lower paying positions in the field. Compared to other jobs in the industry we run leaner and you are expected to be incredibly time efficient. You are also expected to disrupt your life for the job unexpectedly. My first date with my fiancee was 1 hour of date, and 3 hours of being pulled into something for my job that would have blocked my promotion if I let it slide. I can get a call at any time, any day, and I would be expected to help or give a short ETA until I can help. That is what I'm paid for.
If a persons options are "multiple fistfuls of money with anxiety, no free time, retire at 40" or "upper middle class life style with no anxiety and lots of free time, retire at 60" most would pick the second. They can not hang with the instantaneous demands day in day out without being unhappy.
I do however completely agree that hard work is not directly linked to pay. EMTs get absolutely shafted and I know few people who could hang as an EMT. I think people who have jobs that truly take a different breed of person to do, get shafted because it is expected those people wouldn't do anything else because it is their calling.
I was with you until the 40/60 retirement statement.
The is a false dichotomy - you are super lucky you are in the industry you are in and that is great. But pay structures are equally dispersed in capitalism.
Most people are never given that choice. Most people are in capped salary industries.
Yes. Everything I speak about with regards to pay and retirement is HYPER specific to my industry and field. I never claimed otherwise.
I somewhat weep for good mechanical and electrical engineers because of the caps they have relative to the difficulty of the job and how safety critical it is. It boggles my mind that they make less than the most basic vibe coder at the start and that a 3 YoE engineer in my industry makes more than most Principal engineers in their field at the peak at good companies.
Dude the world makes no sense.
I do a complete IT position for a smallish company - make less than if I o single focused on any specific part of my roll … that said, I will also risk my life for other people for $0 - so maybe it is me.
If the pandemic hadn't hit I would be sitting pretty. But I worked for myself and had no employees lost all of my income my mother caught covid and is in her '80s. She's been on an oxygen machine ever since and I am now the permanent living caretaker for her and my disabled sister. I had to drop out of management because I needed more flexibility than that which means I'm vastly underpaid and I've gone through my savings.
I have suicidal ideation but not because I'm sad or hate my life. It's more like I just keep thinking if all of my skills and all of my education and the fact that people genuinely like me and I work so hard has not made it so I can afford to live, why should I not just die? But my mom and my sister need me. So I choke and I drown. I'm a woman so this really is not my community. But I've often wished I had a place like this to post about it
Idk about others here, but I welcome women's input. I think there are some communities that are targeted at women, but when I've read them to try to see things from women's perspective it feels like a lot of the conversation is at men's expense. That is one thing I like about this community is bitching about and insulting women is frowned upon.
Yeah I do have one specific one that I do lurking a lot but even there I feel like there's a lot of gender blaming as opposed to constructive support. I love being a part of this community because of the way you guys police each other and yourselves. You don't accept negativity and when people are the cause of their own problems you tend to tell them. I have so much respect for that.
I don't need to be told that the patriarchy and the man are keeping me down. Like I get that it's the system and it sucks.
I agree with the inherited part. It seems like all of the SoCal kids watched “Wolf of Wall Street” and decided telling the rest of America (or the world) that they need to buy their lessons and their crypto while flashing off their McLarens.
The best part is, the inheritance gang will push to say how hard they work. It’s like yes but you had a million open doors and there is always a plan B. 🫠🫠
I know someone running a small Etsy business and does quite well. He started a few and can because he pays no bills, lives with the parents and has 2-3k dispoable income every month to throw at ventures. I know another guy who got a job at 23 working for markteing firm and shot up quite quickly. Then now at the age of 35, he makes around 300k a year in bonuses. I went to his house and saw him working from home in his underwear. He says he mostly deletages and manages a team now, and his job is to bring the teams work together. I find it so wild him telling me one month....oh I got a 65k bonus this month. Me thinking thats probably gonna be all I can save by the time I am 70 and it was just a monthly bonus for him ontop of his salary.
I used to work for a publicly traded company that was run like a family business where the founder’s son was made CEO in his mid 30s. The amount of work this guy put into acting like he earned the job and it wasn’t because his dad created the company and was chairman of the board was absolutely insane
He did work hard, and he did grow the company, but there is absolutely zero chance he would’ve gotten that opportunity otherwise. I’m also truly believe that he is a psychopath based off of my experiences working there
You forgot the people who are born intelligent, get a relevant degree and go into the STEM field. These people may work hard at times but they live a comfortable life.
This would be my stepson. He worked hard in middle school and high school. When others were partying and playing, he was working on stem projects through NASA. He got scholarships and graduated with a degree in physics and a minor in computer programming. He words with rocket guidance systems. Anyone who's jealous of his success and the things he has needs to check themselves.
Know two guys. They were both, what you would considered, nerds in HS and college. Big parties, Keggers? You found them in the dorm room studying instead.
Today. One runs a town as a mayor. The other is structure engineer. Both make north of $250K.
Just having conversations with them, I’m over my skis. Yes, they are bright, but most people don’t understand how much work they put in their youth.
There’s a saying, “your success will depend on how often you can postpone your instant gratification.”
The sub’s mods can create their own rules for their little piece of the internet. I was saying no in the sense that getting rid of Fiat currency doesn’t go nearly far enough. Or a whole slew of other things need to be done along side of it. Eliminating Fiat currency by itself is hardly a silver bullet.
Ha ha ha, sure, why not. I have a few other best friends, but I am not greedy. I can share them too!!
Ok, let’s say we did away with Fiat, or even money all together and we go to the barter system. People will still hoard goods and assets and use that to oppress and manipulate others.
Then there is still the issue of a few people hoarding property. Understanding the distinction between personal and private property goes a long way. Personal property is your tooth brush, house, yard etc. Private property is where that land is used to make a profit.
I believe no one should be able to own nature. That is where I draw the public/private line. You should totally own your house, but you should not own the land it is on.
Luck. It’s often pure luck, whether that’s being born in the right family, right neighborhood, being there at the right time/place, have the right ideas, etc. very rarely do you see skill/knowledge/working their ass off that gets them that rich.
Consider all of the “rags to riches” stories. Bill Gates and his friends got funding from his mother, whom sat on the board of directors for IBM. Mark Zuckerberg was a professional programmer before he even went to Harvard and had a programming tutor since middle school. Elon Musk is an heir to an emerald mining corporation that’s on par with De Biers.
The wife and I are struggling and we make over 100k. I mean rent and food are ok but trying to save money is almost impossible. It’s not just you it’s most of us.
That said...I know of people who live in other states to get themselves more comfortable margins. I guess there is a price you pay for a better commute.
Unless you win the lottery or born into generational wealth, a lot of hard work OP. Whether it's spending years building a business or working your way up in the rat race.
There are shortcuts which normally come with pretty big consequences such as crime or being an Only Fans star.
I lucked out farming, broke af out of college, struggled for seven years then hit one good year and cashed out. Paid for my wife’s college and built a nice nest egg. We bring home a little over 300k but live in a 120k house, drive a minivan and a 94 Silverado. We’re very frugal, because I’ve seen my parents piss away the good life in 2008.
Anecdotal story time that I’ll preface by saying I’m not that old, and things in general, across the board. are more expensive lately.
Without going into too many details I joined the military out of high school with a five year contract. I saved as much as possible while most everyone else spent their money on sports cars, trucks, motorcycles, food delivery, etc. When my service was done I got out and put over 25% down on a small house at 22. College was paid for, got a job for a small company, continued to save as much as possible. Bought a second property with, again a significant down payment. Head down, keep working, signed up for every overtime, made friends with owners and management, connections with clients and a small but impactful name for myself. I now have owned the company for 3 years.
I play hockey and have teammates fairly older and younger than me. I had one of the younger ones (~22 at the time) over to my house for a party a few years ago. He a fair few drinks in and started getting kinda sad and like “how do you have this? What am I doing wrong?” And all that. I had to explain the above to him (I won’t pretend there isn’t some luck involved either) but mostly had to remind him that he just got out of college and these things take time and sacrifice. Many people I see don’t make the small daily sacrifices to achieve their goal. Everyone wants instant gratification and shiny things.
I still live in my less than 1,000 square foot house, sold my almost 20yr old car for the cheapest most fuel efficient micro hatchback I could find (used), and kind of live like a peasant. But every time I drive by an apartment complex half of the cars, if not more, are brand new.
I guess all of that to say, it’s a marathon, not a sprint. Cut out frivolous spending. Make some goals, work towards them, and even if you miss them, you can trust you’re still making progress. The world is cruel and unforgiving, so take care of yourself and be kind to others.
I’m also in a fairly enviable position, and I see frivolous spending as the one people do the most. A friend of mine is always tight on money, yet every time I go to his house, there are always Amazon boxes and deliveries coming. Meanwhile I live like a monk, and buy food by dozens of pounds whenever there’s a sale
I make a little over $215k a year It’s taken me 10 straight years of busting my ass at work, me investing in myself with continuous training and letting my bosses know I was interested in moving up. One huge factor was I stopped hanging out in bars on Friday “because I worked hard and deserved a break” and I stopped hanging out with my shit bag friends with negative attitudes.
Making money requires a multi angle approach. If you’re having financial trouble it may be time to looking at your spending habits, career choice and self discipline. Also you may have to bite the bullet get a second job for the time being.
3 is exactly what I was thinking, door dashing and Uber Eats is a viable option if you're willing to put time in.
If you are willing to work 80 hours and your job only gives you 40 hours, sounds like you could potentially get yourself another job that gets you a lot of hours.
consider a line of work where working 80 hours a week is possible. if 80 hours a week is what you have to do then... so be it. it sucks man but life aint fair.
Usually it’s hard work and sacrifice - people forget the second part. They also don’t consider that many of their friends who look like they have a ton of money are living off debt. At least, if they didn’t inherit the money.
To get to where I am, I have worked since I was in middle school and I’m 49. Always worked, saved, studied, planned, etc. Worked through college and shared rooms with another person to keep it cheap (in private apartments not dorms because dorms are expensive), worked through every winter or summer break to save money for the next semester. Cooked and ate at home, didn’t drink much, didn’t buy cool clothes, had a very shitty car. Had roommates after college - even when I moved in with my boyfriend (now husband). Had a roommate even after getting married and buying a house. Worked full time while in graduate school, worked through both pregnancies and was back at work after 3 weeks with the second one. I live in a dumpy house compared to what my income can afford and I don’t get fancy nails, hair, makeup, or cosmetic procedures. My car has 200k miles and is paid for but apparently now leaking oil - I’ll fix it and keep driving it because a new car is expensive. When I buy a new car it will be a used car because it makes more financial sense.
I come from an immigrant family - no inherited money at all. All my cousins are objectively very successful people too. They came from the same recipe of hard work and sacrifice.
I assume they found what they were good at and monetized it. And a lot of it is really just right place at the right time. Everyone that studied computer science when people said it was a bad time to are making insane amounts of money now. Once everyone tells you what field to go into you're already too late. Find the next best thing and hopefully it aligns with your passions and you can go quite far. I think this is one of the most important things to figure out. Find what motivates you best.
I have teo friends that have worked extremely hard but also do say themselves that they had A LOT of luck, literally went from working a minimum wage wage and 1 year in were making 3x more, but sometimes people aren’t lucky I’ve known a lot of people that bave truly worked their asses off but just don’t land jobs that pay a lot
A big part is also how you spend your money. I buy outside aisles of the grocery store, cook at home and make my own coffee to bring to work in a thermos. Own my car, do regular maintenance and get many years out of them. My house is not the biggest in the neighborhood, but it is large enough for the family.
If you are talking about REALLY a lot of money, most likely inherited. If you are talking about a comfortable life, a combination of effort and luck of being at the right time in the right place. What most people fail to recognize it that your personal success depends to a large degree on the people around you. Parents, family, friends and the country you are born in - without those things ot doesnt really matter how hard you work.
If you watch the news, all you hear about is the "bad economy" and how everything is just terrible in the world. There are still plenty of people with money and they are still spending it. My company just had it's best year ever, and what we do (home improvement) isn't always a necessity.
Just like the Great Depression. While it was bad, it didn't affect most of the population too much. Some not at all.
I've had lean years and good ones. I work hard, live within my means. I spend money for fun and to buy things when I want. But I also don't eat every meal out. I don't waste money on stupid things (usually) and I only buy what I can afford.
Some people are born into wealth. They're born with a silver spoon in their mouth meaning they are given opportunities, education, they are loved and provided for. They are handed a college education and are set up for success. Or they never have to work a day in their life and have all the spoils given to them. They marry rich, inherited money, property, etc. Not me, I was born into abuse, neglect and had to scrape by for everything I have.
Either pay yourself ie open a business or get into a high paying field, tech is still good as well as advertising. You won’t make millions using your hands but you might make millions using someone else’s. Or just assume all of them inherited it.
Im not a nepo baby but neither had my money thrown at me, don't have that much saved, but pretty sure Im on top 5% of money saved on ny age bracket in my country.
My secret: live well below my means, even after 3 promotions, I have more or less the same lifestile when I started working.
The downside ? Not sure what to do with the money, it is not that much to buy a home, not worth it spending it in a super car, not enough time to travel, no gf. So maybe having savings is overrated ? Idk
Dude I’m usually around ppl with wayyyyyyyy more cash than me and they are typically jealous because of my physique and confidence. Money isn’t so important….until it’s time to pay bills. :)
Common illusion of late stage capitalism. Makes the lower and lower middle class wage gap increase while the 1% hoard the wealth, all while decreasing education, access to Healthcare, and increasing prices, sprinkled with distracting with politics and promises that appeal to the masses.
The secret to making lots of money is 1) get a job. 2) go to work everyday. 3) do what your told. 4) don’t piss away your money on cars and phones 5) buy don’t rent
A problem you can solve with money isn’t a problem at all and a problem you need solved with money you don’t have isn’t a money problem; it’s a behavioral one.
People who treat money like currency tend to find themselves with issues surrounding it.
People who treat money like a resource that can be applied regulating the variety of options available to solve for a given problem don’t.
Money is just a tool. How skilled you are at using it matters.
Some people work for it, some people are given it, some people get lucky, if you don’t have money you aren’t doing one of these 3 things I’m 17 and I make roughly 1800 a month not a lot but more then most people my age and coworkers, how? Through work 1k was hit at 16 10k will be hit at 17 and hopefully 100k by 18 it’s all about strategy and consistency not so much hard labor
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Dude I’ve been having this same thought lately for the same reasons. Like why does it feel like there’s so much money to go around but I’m just missing it???
Edit: I know the real answer is more nuanced than just “I want money” but it’s hard to not feel the cold of the pit when you’re standing at the bottom of it barefoot.
There's a lot of money to go around, in tenths of trillions. It's just not for you and me.
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Sure, I can get that shit. I've lived and worked long enough to recognise this mindset is the one that screw everything up for everyone. Money is not worth getting a lot of when someone can decide how much to print. It's just a never-ending cycle of hustling to get a lot until it is diluted in the next print. Only those who are connected will have the most money at the end of the day. Average guy on the street gets shafted all the time.
I wasn’t trying to throw shade bro, I understand how you feel, you don’t need to be a billionaire business owner or entrepreneur you just need to make sure your family is eating, has clothes on there back,
Well, money loses value when it’s printed, as you clearly know. So having a lot of it helps.
That seems plainly obvious.
Person A has a ten, person B has a thousand. Currency devalues by 10%, person A has the equivalent of 9, person b 900.
Who would you rather be?
Then the money printing continues, and 10000 is given to person C. Person C is connected to the elites.
Yes?
That’s irrelevant.
I come from an area that is not particularly well off.
Do you know who the happiest, most successful people I know are, out of A and B? B. By a long shot. And they deserve it.
I don’t know many Cs. I know some Bs. I know a lot of As.
If the printing continues, A and B are almost proportionally affected. But they’re probably not, because it’s easier to make and manage money when you have more of it. So B is better off than A. B can also raise more money now that currency is less valuable, while A is a povvo.
This isn’t difficult to understand.
“Money is not worth getting a lot of when someone else can print it…” (not sic) is a ridiculously dumb stance. Like, inflation hits everyone. Who does the best with inflation? The people with money, you rusty spoon.
It's a difference in mindset. If everyone is greedy like person C, and keep hoarding all the money to themselves, person A will be the most affected due to inflation. There's way more person A than person C in the world right now. Person C can also be an individual or a corporation.
Sure it's easy saying go be person B or person C. But the fact is there's going to be person D and person E who will be richer due to money printing going on continuously.
Rule 2: Respect the purpose of the subreddit.
Most people live paycheck to paycheck. They are in a massive amount of debt to keep up appearances.
34% of people actually live paycheck to paycheck. Which is insanely high. Though over 60% reported they do, a significant portion of them were determined to have an emergency fund of at least 3 months. Meaning they exaggerated their definition of paycheck to paycheck
Paycheque to Paycheque (without needing to break into my emergency fund to simply live) just doesn’t roll off the tongue that well.
True that. It’s wild how social media makes it look like everyone’s thriving when most are just barely getting by!!
"keeping up with the Jones's"
Also, while a lot of people live paycheck to paycheck, you can usually look at their parents and you’ll make the connection that oh… mom and dad give them money.
Fuck man. Go look at r/fatfire if you want to feel like you just suck. I dont understand how they get 10 plus million
1M NW already at 31, fully paid off house. Assuming no raises and normal growth it should be 8M around 40. Enough for fatfire. I come from a paycheck to paycheck family and during my last year of college, I could afford one meal a day after rent and utilities and tuition. My parents paid my phone bill. That's it.
My secret? Incredible luck and a lot of hard work so I could actually seize the luck. I got a very in demand degree atypically. (Accelerated program, no time for internships) No one would even give me the time of day because everyone else had internships and shit. A single big tech company told me "well let's do a phone screen".
Panick attacked for the hour before. Crushed the phone screen. "Interviews are next". Panicked for 4 hours before the interviews. Took 3 shots of whiskey to calm down. Crushed the interviews. Got a 150k offer right out of school building AI chips from a company that is not NVIDIA in a MCOL city when no one else gave me the time of day.
I stayed, grinded and made a name for myself doing things people said would take too long or were impossible while living below my means for the last 6 years and kept my money diversified. Promoted in a year and a half. Another 80k a year. Promoted again in 3 years. A whopping extra 200k because I was given an additional pay raise because leadership felt my pay still didn't reflect my value that year. On track again for a promotion in a year for another 200k or so.
So after 8 years I will be at 620K a year if I don't fuck up my next promo. I was given literally only a single chance despite thousands of applications. The chance I got, I was able to grab onto and worked my ass off to not get let go during layoffs. I made sure I was on critical projects and would actually deliver instead of being all talk.
Next promo I become effectively untouchable due to how tightly I am intertwined with our product unless we can no longer sell our chips. I will have two years of runway of doing shit before I would hit a performance plan. There is a lot of luck involved but I know many other lucky people who couldn't hang with what is expected at our pay grade.
You mention something a lot of people try to ignore or pretend isn't part of their story, luck.
People can work incredibly hard and someone else can get the step up because they had the right last name, or were just in the right place at the right time.
I remember seeing Bruce Timm, at the time the head of DC Animation, be asked the question, "What do you have to do to get your job?" And he admitted he hated the question because of how much luck played a part in his career.
Yes, he worked hard and yes he was talented, but he got his first animation job because a friend of a friend asked him to fill in after an animator left their studio. He worked on Batman the Animated Series because he was offered two projects to work on and he just thought the other one sounded boring, no one knew BTAS would take off, and all that led to him running DC Animation.
You can work incredibly hard and not get the right breaks or you can catch every break imaginable. People just don't like to admit that luck plays a part.
I tell my entire family how fucking lucky I am and they say "it was inevitable". No it wasn't. I got the perfect job. At the perfect time. Had a shitty boss but my good work got me moved under the PERFECT boss who still supports me to this day. I dodged layoffs. I didn't have to play politics for my promotions. Everything was just smooth.
None of that shit was me. I just happened to be in the right place at the right time where my traits helped me capitalize. I have friends who are FAR smarter, FAR harder working, and way more cracked at everything they do that didn't get nearly the same shot I did.
“Hang with what is expected at our pay grade”.
Dude I have worked with people who put food on peoples tables - they get paid fuck all… but man the work is H A R D physical labour - I seen many many grown men quite unable to ‘hang’. I also am a volunteer fire fighter if captain. We do road rescue as well… again fighting wildfires in the Australian bush can break many, and there is nothing like the mental horror of a car accident incident.
Pay grades are rarely liked to social necessities and/or hard work.
Not having a go - just pointing out the issue with link g pay to anything.
Well done - and good success to you.
It isn't about how physically hard it is in my field. It is about how much you are expected to disrupt your life for the job RELATIVE to lower paying positions in the field. Compared to other jobs in the industry we run leaner and you are expected to be incredibly time efficient. You are also expected to disrupt your life for the job unexpectedly. My first date with my fiancee was 1 hour of date, and 3 hours of being pulled into something for my job that would have blocked my promotion if I let it slide. I can get a call at any time, any day, and I would be expected to help or give a short ETA until I can help. That is what I'm paid for.
If a persons options are "multiple fistfuls of money with anxiety, no free time, retire at 40" or "upper middle class life style with no anxiety and lots of free time, retire at 60" most would pick the second. They can not hang with the instantaneous demands day in day out without being unhappy.
I do however completely agree that hard work is not directly linked to pay. EMTs get absolutely shafted and I know few people who could hang as an EMT. I think people who have jobs that truly take a different breed of person to do, get shafted because it is expected those people wouldn't do anything else because it is their calling.
I was with you until the 40/60 retirement statement.
The is a false dichotomy - you are super lucky you are in the industry you are in and that is great. But pay structures are equally dispersed in capitalism.
Most people are never given that choice. Most people are in capped salary industries.
Yes. Everything I speak about with regards to pay and retirement is HYPER specific to my industry and field. I never claimed otherwise.
I somewhat weep for good mechanical and electrical engineers because of the caps they have relative to the difficulty of the job and how safety critical it is. It boggles my mind that they make less than the most basic vibe coder at the start and that a 3 YoE engineer in my industry makes more than most Principal engineers in their field at the peak at good companies.
Dude the world makes no sense. I do a complete IT position for a smallish company - make less than if I o single focused on any specific part of my roll … that said, I will also risk my life for other people for $0 - so maybe it is me.
Fair play to you bro 👊
It's never you. It's pure luck and circumstance to get that much.
Def not lol
Not just those things. Everyone comes from somewhere though, geographically and economically
If the pandemic hadn't hit I would be sitting pretty. But I worked for myself and had no employees lost all of my income my mother caught covid and is in her '80s. She's been on an oxygen machine ever since and I am now the permanent living caretaker for her and my disabled sister. I had to drop out of management because I needed more flexibility than that which means I'm vastly underpaid and I've gone through my savings.
I have suicidal ideation but not because I'm sad or hate my life. It's more like I just keep thinking if all of my skills and all of my education and the fact that people genuinely like me and I work so hard has not made it so I can afford to live, why should I not just die? But my mom and my sister need me. So I choke and I drown. I'm a woman so this really is not my community. But I've often wished I had a place like this to post about it
Idk about others here, but I welcome women's input. I think there are some communities that are targeted at women, but when I've read them to try to see things from women's perspective it feels like a lot of the conversation is at men's expense. That is one thing I like about this community is bitching about and insulting women is frowned upon.
Yeah I do have one specific one that I do lurking a lot but even there I feel like there's a lot of gender blaming as opposed to constructive support. I love being a part of this community because of the way you guys police each other and yourselves. You don't accept negativity and when people are the cause of their own problems you tend to tell them. I have so much respect for that.
I don't need to be told that the patriarchy and the man are keeping me down. Like I get that it's the system and it sucks.
Inherited, lucky life, or extremely hard work. 9/10 the first two, and they will 9/10 try to convince you that it's the last option.
I agree with the inherited part. It seems like all of the SoCal kids watched “Wolf of Wall Street” and decided telling the rest of America (or the world) that they need to buy their lessons and their crypto while flashing off their McLarens.
Credit is a lot cheaper than in the 80s too
The best part is, the inheritance gang will push to say how hard they work. It’s like yes but you had a million open doors and there is always a plan B. 🫠🫠
Dude I worked so hard at my dads company /j
I know someone running a small Etsy business and does quite well. He started a few and can because he pays no bills, lives with the parents and has 2-3k dispoable income every month to throw at ventures. I know another guy who got a job at 23 working for markteing firm and shot up quite quickly. Then now at the age of 35, he makes around 300k a year in bonuses. I went to his house and saw him working from home in his underwear. He says he mostly deletages and manages a team now, and his job is to bring the teams work together. I find it so wild him telling me one month....oh I got a 65k bonus this month. Me thinking thats probably gonna be all I can save by the time I am 70 and it was just a monthly bonus for him ontop of his salary.
I used to work for a publicly traded company that was run like a family business where the founder’s son was made CEO in his mid 30s. The amount of work this guy put into acting like he earned the job and it wasn’t because his dad created the company and was chairman of the board was absolutely insane
He did work hard, and he did grow the company, but there is absolutely zero chance he would’ve gotten that opportunity otherwise. I’m also truly believe that he is a psychopath based off of my experiences working there
And don't forget how much of "hard work" is just screwing people over and doing scams
You forgot the people who are born intelligent, get a relevant degree and go into the STEM field. These people may work hard at times but they live a comfortable life.
This would be my stepson. He worked hard in middle school and high school. When others were partying and playing, he was working on stem projects through NASA. He got scholarships and graduated with a degree in physics and a minor in computer programming. He words with rocket guidance systems. Anyone who's jealous of his success and the things he has needs to check themselves.
Know two guys. They were both, what you would considered, nerds in HS and college. Big parties, Keggers? You found them in the dorm room studying instead.
Today. One runs a town as a mayor. The other is structure engineer. Both make north of $250K.
Just having conversations with them, I’m over my skis. Yes, they are bright, but most people don’t understand how much work they put in their youth.
There’s a saying, “your success will depend on how often you can postpone your instant gratification.”
And 0% of the people who can spend millions of dollars as if they were tens of dollars are people who got there by being good people.
The system has been fucked and it always has been. I can’t go into more details because of the no politics rule
Saying fiat money is a curse on the world isn't political, just logical. If that is what you were gonna say.
No. The fiat thing also ties in with a few political groups.
Nah, don't let them. They try to make it political so they can separate us into controllable little camps.
The sub’s mods can create their own rules for their little piece of the internet. I was saying no in the sense that getting rid of Fiat currency doesn’t go nearly far enough. Or a whole slew of other things need to be done along side of it. Eliminating Fiat currency by itself is hardly a silver bullet.
Sure it ain't a silver bullet. There would be other social issues to fix. But it's the lubricant for that machine to work.
Yes and no. Centralized power is the root of the problem. Hierarchy too, I reject the idea that hierarchy is natural.
Fuck, we can be best friends lol
I see fiat as the main thing that keeps the power structure in place.
Ha ha ha, sure, why not. I have a few other best friends, but I am not greedy. I can share them too!!
Ok, let’s say we did away with Fiat, or even money all together and we go to the barter system. People will still hoard goods and assets and use that to oppress and manipulate others.
Then there is still the issue of a few people hoarding property. Understanding the distinction between personal and private property goes a long way. Personal property is your tooth brush, house, yard etc. Private property is where that land is used to make a profit.
I believe no one should be able to own nature. That is where I draw the public/private line. You should totally own your house, but you should not own the land it is on.
Luck. It’s often pure luck, whether that’s being born in the right family, right neighborhood, being there at the right time/place, have the right ideas, etc. very rarely do you see skill/knowledge/working their ass off that gets them that rich.
Consider all of the “rags to riches” stories. Bill Gates and his friends got funding from his mother, whom sat on the board of directors for IBM. Mark Zuckerberg was a professional programmer before he even went to Harvard and had a programming tutor since middle school. Elon Musk is an heir to an emerald mining corporation that’s on par with De Biers.
The wife and I are struggling and we make over 100k. I mean rent and food are ok but trying to save money is almost impossible. It’s not just you it’s most of us.
We make over 100k combined or over 100k each? Because that’s a huge difference. Over 100k combined isn’t much anymore
Imma need more context my dude...What the actual fuck are you spending money on if rent and food are not it?
Cost of living in some areas is crazy.
That said...I know of people who live in other states to get themselves more comfortable margins. I guess there is a price you pay for a better commute.
they might live in NYC and that would do it in terms of rent
Right...Hence asking for context especially since they cited rent as not being a problem.
"struggling" ok 🙄. swear people think that "struggling" means they can't spend as frivolously as they'd like to. f off lmao
Combined or individually?
Together
Unless you win the lottery or born into generational wealth, a lot of hard work OP. Whether it's spending years building a business or working your way up in the rat race.
There are shortcuts which normally come with pretty big consequences such as crime or being an Only Fans star.
Rich parents
tbh, True, but it’s wild how some still blow through it like it’s nothing. Gotta find your own hustle, man…
They go to work and live within their means, if that’s not enough they get a second job
I got lucky with wealthy parents. It's all just a draw of cards when you're born.
Wealth inequality is a foundational aspect of capitalism sadly.
Im struggling with money too bro. I can't see myself being able to get enough money to live off.
I lucked out farming, broke af out of college, struggled for seven years then hit one good year and cashed out. Paid for my wife’s college and built a nice nest egg. We bring home a little over 300k but live in a 120k house, drive a minivan and a 94 Silverado. We’re very frugal, because I’ve seen my parents piss away the good life in 2008.
Mostly privilege and inherited wealth.
Anecdotal story time that I’ll preface by saying I’m not that old, and things in general, across the board. are more expensive lately.
Without going into too many details I joined the military out of high school with a five year contract. I saved as much as possible while most everyone else spent their money on sports cars, trucks, motorcycles, food delivery, etc. When my service was done I got out and put over 25% down on a small house at 22. College was paid for, got a job for a small company, continued to save as much as possible. Bought a second property with, again a significant down payment. Head down, keep working, signed up for every overtime, made friends with owners and management, connections with clients and a small but impactful name for myself. I now have owned the company for 3 years.
I play hockey and have teammates fairly older and younger than me. I had one of the younger ones (~22 at the time) over to my house for a party a few years ago. He a fair few drinks in and started getting kinda sad and like “how do you have this? What am I doing wrong?” And all that. I had to explain the above to him (I won’t pretend there isn’t some luck involved either) but mostly had to remind him that he just got out of college and these things take time and sacrifice. Many people I see don’t make the small daily sacrifices to achieve their goal. Everyone wants instant gratification and shiny things.
I still live in my less than 1,000 square foot house, sold my almost 20yr old car for the cheapest most fuel efficient micro hatchback I could find (used), and kind of live like a peasant. But every time I drive by an apartment complex half of the cars, if not more, are brand new.
I guess all of that to say, it’s a marathon, not a sprint. Cut out frivolous spending. Make some goals, work towards them, and even if you miss them, you can trust you’re still making progress. The world is cruel and unforgiving, so take care of yourself and be kind to others.
I’m also in a fairly enviable position, and I see frivolous spending as the one people do the most. A friend of mine is always tight on money, yet every time I go to his house, there are always Amazon boxes and deliveries coming. Meanwhile I live like a monk, and buy food by dozens of pounds whenever there’s a sale
They probably got the right connections to get the right job at the right time, perhaps due to having the right qualifications.
If there's a position in mind you can probably look up success stories for people in those fields.
My case right here.
I have just completed an IVA and I have been absolutely broke for five years,, I have glued my shoes and hand stitched my old clothes.
My colleagues have new clothes every other day it seems, foreign holidays and two new cars!!
GF's grandfather was a pioneer in the aviation industry.
My family was one of the founders of venice, my great grandfather was one of the biggest names in the steel industry during WW2.
My father has been a big name on the government of my country since before I was born.
I was a very early adopter of Bitcoin.
Generational wealth and luck in my case I reckon.
I make a little over $215k a year It’s taken me 10 straight years of busting my ass at work, me investing in myself with continuous training and letting my bosses know I was interested in moving up. One huge factor was I stopped hanging out in bars on Friday “because I worked hard and deserved a break” and I stopped hanging out with my shit bag friends with negative attitudes.
Making money requires a multi angle approach. If you’re having financial trouble it may be time to looking at your spending habits, career choice and self discipline. Also you may have to bite the bullet get a second job for the time being.
hard work. that's all it is man. that's how people do it. i work 85 hours a week if they let me have it.
3 is exactly what I was thinking, door dashing and Uber Eats is a viable option if you're willing to put time in.
If you are willing to work 80 hours and your job only gives you 40 hours, sounds like you could potentially get yourself another job that gets you a lot of hours.
I quit uber eats because a 12 hour shift only got me 100 dollars or so.
What is need is to make more money.
consider a line of work where working 80 hours a week is possible. if 80 hours a week is what you have to do then... so be it. it sucks man but life aint fair.
Usually it’s hard work and sacrifice - people forget the second part. They also don’t consider that many of their friends who look like they have a ton of money are living off debt. At least, if they didn’t inherit the money.
To get to where I am, I have worked since I was in middle school and I’m 49. Always worked, saved, studied, planned, etc. Worked through college and shared rooms with another person to keep it cheap (in private apartments not dorms because dorms are expensive), worked through every winter or summer break to save money for the next semester. Cooked and ate at home, didn’t drink much, didn’t buy cool clothes, had a very shitty car. Had roommates after college - even when I moved in with my boyfriend (now husband). Had a roommate even after getting married and buying a house. Worked full time while in graduate school, worked through both pregnancies and was back at work after 3 weeks with the second one. I live in a dumpy house compared to what my income can afford and I don’t get fancy nails, hair, makeup, or cosmetic procedures. My car has 200k miles and is paid for but apparently now leaking oil - I’ll fix it and keep driving it because a new car is expensive. When I buy a new car it will be a used car because it makes more financial sense.
I come from an immigrant family - no inherited money at all. All my cousins are objectively very successful people too. They came from the same recipe of hard work and sacrifice.
I’ve been trying my hand in stocks and the second i get serious everything i choose goes down.
I do love the quote “comparison is the thief of joy” just take a look at your own life and the loved ones you have. That’s what matters.
I assume they found what they were good at and monetized it. And a lot of it is really just right place at the right time. Everyone that studied computer science when people said it was a bad time to are making insane amounts of money now. Once everyone tells you what field to go into you're already too late. Find the next best thing and hopefully it aligns with your passions and you can go quite far. I think this is one of the most important things to figure out. Find what motivates you best.
Most people are probably in heavy debt and just don't give a shit.
Create a plan to get out of your financial situation. Create a plan for personal growth. Create a plan for career growth.
I have teo friends that have worked extremely hard but also do say themselves that they had A LOT of luck, literally went from working a minimum wage wage and 1 year in were making 3x more, but sometimes people aren’t lucky I’ve known a lot of people that bave truly worked their asses off but just don’t land jobs that pay a lot
A big part is also how you spend your money. I buy outside aisles of the grocery store, cook at home and make my own coffee to bring to work in a thermos. Own my car, do regular maintenance and get many years out of them. My house is not the biggest in the neighborhood, but it is large enough for the family.
If you are talking about REALLY a lot of money, most likely inherited. If you are talking about a comfortable life, a combination of effort and luck of being at the right time in the right place. What most people fail to recognize it that your personal success depends to a large degree on the people around you. Parents, family, friends and the country you are born in - without those things ot doesnt really matter how hard you work.
Inheritance or credit debt, if its the first then its way easier to gain more as a lot of money attracts more.
40 hour a week job and 2-4 side hustles for 15 years.
I just pick up an extra shift if I need more money.
If you watch the news, all you hear about is the "bad economy" and how everything is just terrible in the world. There are still plenty of people with money and they are still spending it. My company just had it's best year ever, and what we do (home improvement) isn't always a necessity.
Just like the Great Depression. While it was bad, it didn't affect most of the population too much. Some not at all.
I've had lean years and good ones. I work hard, live within my means. I spend money for fun and to buy things when I want. But I also don't eat every meal out. I don't waste money on stupid things (usually) and I only buy what I can afford.
Some people are born into wealth. They're born with a silver spoon in their mouth meaning they are given opportunities, education, they are loved and provided for. They are handed a college education and are set up for success. Or they never have to work a day in their life and have all the spoils given to them. They marry rich, inherited money, property, etc. Not me, I was born into abuse, neglect and had to scrape by for everything I have.
Either pay yourself ie open a business or get into a high paying field, tech is still good as well as advertising. You won’t make millions using your hands but you might make millions using someone else’s. Or just assume all of them inherited it.
Sell everything you have and put it all on red.
This thought goes through my head every time I see somebody my age driving a vehicle that costs what a house used to.
Lot of people are secretly in crushing debt
https://preview.redd.it/19tbes1hhg8g1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=359590b36f352a5ccbba61cce6129433ffe12635
Saving may be over rated though.
Im not a nepo baby but neither had my money thrown at me, don't have that much saved, but pretty sure Im on top 5% of money saved on ny age bracket in my country.
My secret: live well below my means, even after 3 promotions, I have more or less the same lifestile when I started working.
The downside ? Not sure what to do with the money, it is not that much to buy a home, not worth it spending it in a super car, not enough time to travel, no gf. So maybe having savings is overrated ? Idk
1.hard work 2 saving 3. prioritizing it over family and friends 4 luck 5 rich families members
any combination of those
I found a lot of it is family money
A lot of people may be in debt to keep up appearances. Credit card debt as a whole has been rising.
Dude I’m usually around ppl with wayyyyyyyy more cash than me and they are typically jealous because of my physique and confidence. Money isn’t so important….until it’s time to pay bills. :)
Common illusion of late stage capitalism. Makes the lower and lower middle class wage gap increase while the 1% hoard the wealth, all while decreasing education, access to Healthcare, and increasing prices, sprinkled with distracting with politics and promises that appeal to the masses.
One stat that doesn’t get talked about nearly enough.
The odds of someone escaping the class they were born into is extremely slim.
So family money and privilege is usually the reason people have so much money.
Statistically you end up stuck in the socioeconomic class you were born into.
There are clearly exceptions.
They don't. They have massive debt.
Spend less than you make.
Of course! It's so simple! Why didn't we think of that?
If you want to play by the current rules, it is literally just that. Spend less, or earn more.
Or don't play by the rules.
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Rule 1: Be respectful of everyone
No bigotry, trolling, or harassment of any kind, and no personal insults.
This includes the mods.
By not spending it on things/people you don’t need
The secret to making lots of money is 1) get a job. 2) go to work everyday. 3) do what your told. 4) don’t piss away your money on cars and phones 5) buy don’t rent
A problem you can solve with money isn’t a problem at all and a problem you need solved with money you don’t have isn’t a money problem; it’s a behavioral one.
People who treat money like currency tend to find themselves with issues surrounding it.
People who treat money like a resource that can be applied regulating the variety of options available to solve for a given problem don’t.
Money is just a tool. How skilled you are at using it matters.
Some people work for it, some people are given it, some people get lucky, if you don’t have money you aren’t doing one of these 3 things I’m 17 and I make roughly 1800 a month not a lot but more then most people my age and coworkers, how? Through work 1k was hit at 16 10k will be hit at 17 and hopefully 100k by 18 it’s all about strategy and consistency not so much hard labor
Lol