Edit because of autocorrect: “Bonkers UCHealth neurology policy.”
I saw a neurologist once at one of their locations. We are not a good fit. In the first appt he gave me the trifecta of enraging female care after telling him I had 18 migraines last month: do more cardio, you’re depressed, you’re hysterical. He went on to withhold refilling my main migraine abortive Rx then told me I was anxious when nortriptyline made my heart rate 102 while sitting at my desk. He told me to stop taking it.
A few weeks later he told me to increase the nortriptyline by 2.5 times. Cool. I wonder if he’s trying to get my heart rate up to 200.
Naturally, I called the office and asked to switch. They said that their policy is that you can’t switch. I offered to get a fresh referral and come back in as a new patient. She said that if I want to switch I will be banned from care for THREE years from any noco UCHealth neurologist.
This is effing bonkers, right?
Did you talk to a manager because that is absolutely bonkers. You should reach out to the patient advocates https://www.uchealth.org/patient-representatives-counselors/
I asked to be escalated but of course they weren’t available and no one ever called me.
Call the patient advocate team. It’s literally their job to help with stuff like this. Or I’d march on down to the clinic and (hysterically) demand to talk to the manager.
I have been through the process of switching doctors after going to their patient advocate department. The new doctor clearly held a grudge, so I didn’t trust her to provide objective care. Once you get on the bad side of a department in UC Health, it is better to go outside the system.
This is a very bad suggestion
They need to talk to a human that is local. Not a call center associate whose productivity is tracked based on how many calls they take and how quickly they resolve them. The other option is to switch to Advanced Neuro which (I think) is the only non- UCHealth option in town.
Right. But going down to the clinic and causing a scene is NOT.
I did the patient advocate thing. They are not there for the patients either. They are there to minimize risk and liability.
You can email them too they have to respond
In my experience they'll send you a generic reply and then do nothing
You could reach out to a UCHealth patient’s advocate to discuss why you want to switch and see if they’ll make an exception to the policy. https://www.uchealth.org/patient-representatives-counselors/
Your notes are helpful. I would suggest rewriting what you’ve said here, and reframing it to be clearer that you’re not getting needed treatment and you’re having side effects from a medication that aren’t being addressed. Include dates, it helps document that this isn’t a one-off. His argument could be that you’ve been combative or haven’t complied with your treatment, so you need to be as straightforward and dispassionate as possible.
Changes in heart rate are a known side effect of nortriptyline, and he should be ruling out other issues before attributing it to anxiety. But even if it was anxiety, it may not be the right med for you, right? So that’s not a great answer either way.
He said that a racing heart from nortriptyline would be “extremely rare” so I was obviously anxious instead.
Umm, no. Mrs guy here. I had a doctor put me on a large amount of nortriptyline, my heart rate was 125 all the time so I had to see a cardiologist. It was a woman and she said, You've got to lower this, it's killing you. Felt much better afterward. Possible Increased heart rate is a known side effect of nortriptyline.
What??? It’s like a known side effect.
part of your patient's rights is that you are allowed to switch providers. ask to speak to a patient representative. make sure to record your calls (Colorado is a one party state).
The policy of UC Health and all of the departments is that you have to ask to switch providers, the accepting provider has to “accept you’ and the person you are leaving supposedly has to say OK. That part is usually not an issue or at least it should never be one. I do not understand why one cannot switch providers. You should go with the person that you feel comfortable with. It baffles me.
No such thing as patient rights. I know from attempts of exercising them. Wake up to the reality of medicine.
I attend doctor's appointments daily. I am well aware of my rights.
are you??
Oh wow. Let me just say, as someone who sees a lot of doctors, neurologists are my least fav. I first saw a neuro at UCHealth in 2020, didn’t like the first one-actually liked him the first time, the second time it seemed like he was on drugs or something, he was disheveled- but when I called to ask to switch they said I could change neuros one time. I’m surprised they wouldn’t let you switch at all. Also, my current neuro is leaving UCHealth and they are switching me to someone new so… Sorry they are giving you the run around. Might be worth letting your Primary know, they might be able to help.
There is a long history of problematic neurological care in FoCo with a recent criminal complaint against one who is now in an office in Cheyenne. Search the Coloradoan archives for details.
I ended up getting help from a functional medicine doctor. Because women experience migraines at 3-4x the rate as men, treating estrogen as a trigger of migraines as well as a sensitizer for intensity was helpful for me. Estrogen is moderated by natural progesterone, and the personalized protocol for this has given me a lot of relief. I mention this only because seeing a provider other than a neurologist may be helpful for some.
Neurology is not a strong discipline in our area. I would look into traveling outside of Larimer County as well as online. I had to do this for endocrinology. NoCo has amazing providers in other medical specialties. Unfortunately, we don’t have enough choice and expertise in all fields.
Fort Collins UC Health neurology was rough for me. The first doctor I saw diagnosed me with a depressive disorder and prescribed Duloxetine. Three years later, and I’m being treated at Anschutz for a mitochondrial syndrome, including progressive neuropathy, and I’m effectively stuck on the duloxetine now due to my condition.
I was assigned a second provider because I raised hell that Dr. G diagnosed me with persistent depressive disorder after our first appointment, something that requires two years of observed symptoms. I had been sick for just a few weeks at that point. Any diagnosis can have serious implications on insurance coverage.
This policy smacks of, “our docs suck and people keep changing so we need to not allow that.” Rather than clean house and get a batch with some bedside manner and patience.
It’s true. I have a severe spinal cord injury that requires surgery. My insurance only deals with UC health. I saw a pain specialist 2 years ago who decided he didn’t feel like submitting any of my records or treatment plans to the actual insurance because he had to add a single extra document being my insurance is out of state. Even though he agreed to do just that before becoming my doctor. Guess what? Now I have no pain doctor at all because no matter who I spoke to at UCH they told me it’s “their policy” even though their doctor is the one who agreed and then flaked on me. I can’t see anyone else now because of him.
Ugh. We deserve better!
I’m so sorry This is happening to you! Their neurology providers are extremely booked out and the higher-ups are making stupid decisions like this. You have to be the squeaky wheel and call back multiple times and maybe get a new person. It’s a pain in the backside.
Also, please give us the name of this asshole doctor so we can avoid him!
Yes please - Dr Hager is leaving so many of us will have to get a new neurologist after the first of the year. Please tell us who to avoid.
That's insane. I had a similar problem at the UC Health Neuro on Harmony. Dr. Barbara Heger (sp?) elected to IGNORE the findings of my MRI that indicated Intracranial Hypertension and pushed topamax on me in a MASSIVE dose. She said that it helped her migraines so it must help my "migraines". My head hurts because my brain is swelling.
JFC.
This is not unheard of, unfortunately. I had a similarly bad experience with the endocrinology department at UC Health. They take patient switching very personally. It’s bizarre.
I've also run into this issue with UCH neurology! They say it's for "continuity of care," but it doesn't actually feel like their inability to keep quality patient records should be my problem.
BCH neurology clinic has an amazingly effective migraine program. People come from literally the entire region to go there. People who move away from the area buy airline tix to come back for appointments. They are expanding...rapidly but carefully...at the request of community provider demand and increasing patient volumes.
Just an option.
Thank for this rec. I would def commute for good quality.
Yes. I had a similar experience with a female neurologist there who completely dismissed what ended up being a severe issue. I got bad enough that I needed mobility aids to achieve any basic tasks and was barely functional anymore. Thankfully I found an independent surgeon in Denver who basically saved my life.
I also was informed that I’m not allowed to switch to a different neurologist. So I still see her - but at least she treats me more seriously now, after surgery proved (and fixed) what she overlooked.
The health care system is so broken.
ugh I’m sorry that’s awful I had a similar experience with a doctor there but switched multiple times and found an amazing one so that makes no sense
I waited 6 months to see a UC neurologist in Cheyenne for botox. My other option was 11 months to see one in fort collins. 20 minutes before the appointment they told me he was moving and don't bother coming because he won't be there long enough to actually order and administer the Botox after the initial appointment. I asked when I could see someone else and they said they didn't have anyone else, and call the main line. Main line said it would be 10 months to see someone in fort collins. I have a friend who goes to their Denver location and also had to wait a year for the first appointment.
Also yes, I've heard of that policy. I agree that it's bonkers but I do think it's legal.
I had the same situation with the VA for over a decade. Same dismissive crap it seems like you’re dealing with. Then I finally saw a doctor worth a damn who gave me an MRI….turned out I had multiple TBI’s and a minor stroke. All this to say, it’s probably not a bad idea to get a scan done to rule out anything bigger like that. Good luck, I hope you find a doctor who will listen to you and actually help.
I don’t know why this is, but in the course of my life I’ve only had one neurologist with anything close to acceptable bedside manner, and I just got a letter that she is leaving UCHealth. If you don’t mind private messaging me which neurologist you saw so that I can avoid him, I would really not prefer to be stuck with someone like that for 3 years. Lol
UCHealth banned me from all services after they treated me similarly. You have no right to complain even though it is your patient right. Can’t even get a blood draw. UCHealth is horrible. A neurologist I saw from UCHealth loaded me up on adderall and antidepressants and muscle relaxants. I told her they didn’t help and I didn’t want to take them anymore. Her response was “you’re never going to get better.” I walked out of that appointment shaken. They wouldn’t let me see anyone else and dismissed me from the whole group. This kind of treatment happened with pulmonology, cardiology and sleep medicine. No one wanted to figure out what was wrong. It’s been 8 years of hell trying to figure things out and mostly on my own without support of providers. Providers are burnt out. Office managers are controlling health care services with the objective of reducing liability and maximizing profits and squashing voices. So sad. Our healthcare system is such a facade. Expensive. Disrespectful to people seeking care. Incompetent dumb downed array of wanna be doctors PAs and NPs, medical assistants instead of nurses. So bad.
I’m so sorry. I made a lot of progress with ChatGPT. I put my whole history in there and it sent me down 3 paths. One of the paths has basically cured my daily left side headache…..with Pepcid. The other path was less helpful but not the worst experiment I’ve done. The 3rd path (my GP had already started me with) was a sleep study, which didn’t show anything wrong. I have had a clean MRI too so at least I can hold onto that!
Findhelp.org includes things like attorneys to call for help in a variety of situations including, IIRC, this.
A person (patient) complaining is easy to ignore. Lawyers tend to calmly "yell" in legalese and get attention.
I'm not going to share my health details on here but I want to say a few things in case it helps someone. Our neurological systems are kind of a big unknown even to neurologists. What they know is just scratching the surface and then each of us has our own quirky brains that complicate the issue. Neurologists should know this, and many do, but way too many think they are god on earth and if your symptoms and test results don't match up to their area of knowledge, then it must be psychosomatic, i.e. it's all in your head (I mean, obviously, it IS neurological) and not real. Being honest about not having an answer doesn't match their ego.
Listen, until doctors are able to insert themselves in your brains and experience your symptoms, YOU are the one who knows your brain and body best. If what the doctor is saying is dismissive and doesn't, in your experience, take into account what is actually happening in your body, you should keep searching for someone who thinks outside the box. You have to be your own advocate because most of the specialists have already forgotten you before they left the room.
In my years-long search for an answer, I was referred by a neurologist to a UCHealth neurologist. I was told when making the appointment (in Longmont) that I wouldn't be able to switch to another neurologist. It's a really ridiculous non-medically-based policy but I was running out of options and had no choice. This neurologist, without even examining me, told me it was all psychosomatic and the test results would have found something if it was there. That turned out to be untrue and she completely ignored some test results that played into my condition. She told me I might as well cancel my upcoming appointment with another specialist because it wasn't going to do any good.
Well, I saw that specialist and she figured out what was happening and why some tests were not seeing it. She acted like I was a vital part of the solution and listened carefully and visibly considered what I said and how it meshed with her knowledge. She connected me to a one-of-a-kind OT (and knew to avoid VTs as a first option because they're not covered by insurance) and I have improved immensely. Ironically, the answer overlapped with my own theory of what was going on based on what I knew about my body.
Long story short, patients should be able to switch to different doctors and you should keep pushing and pushing and pushing. Also, if you're studying to go into the medical field, please consider neurology. We need you. Waiting 6 months to a year to see a neurologist is effing ridiculous and extends suffering, especially when you have to bounce from one niche specialist to another.
And a shout-out to Dr. Jarvis at Neurosight in Lakewood. She has the best manner with patients of any doctor I've ever seen and actually LISTENS. If you're having any optical issues that might be neurological, even if she obviously doesn't know everything, just having someone listen and willing to help is immense.
Your neurologist should be fired for gross incompetence. Tricyclic antidepressants like Nortryptyline are far more dangerous to prescribed than most abortive migraine medications.
Yeah. He wanted me to try injectable imitrex and I clarified with him that it comes with 9 pens bc I get 9 tablets etc etc. the Rx was for 2 pens with no refills. When I asked to also have the tablets he said I’m not allowed to have pens and tablets at the same time even though the pen insert says, “after injection, if still in pain you may take up to 1 100mg imitrex tablet.” When I told him this, he ghosted me on the portal messages so I had to get my regular doc to refill them. I feel so bullied.
Wtf
You were bullied.
I have a UCHealth neuro- who I actually LOVE. (I was moved from another neurologist there due to some sort of scandal) that prescribes these meds. I get two injections and the tablets, with refills every month?? He’s up at the Harmony office and feel he is a good one. Looking at this thread, it makes FAR more sense it took so long.
May I message you to compare names at that office?
Please do.
Ok, I did!
Oh it's terrible. I saw a neurotologist down in Denver and he basically told me he couldn't help me at all. So I have to seek a second opinion out of state because of the rarity of my condition. Also probably why he couldn't do the surgery well.
If this is for an acoustic neuroma, go straight to the University of San Diego - they are the best
it's for superior canal dehiscence syndrome. but maybe they can help me there lol
It's completely bonkers. My pm&r wanted a procedure done that my regular uch neurologist doesn't do and basically she had to coordinate for my regular uch neurologist to do a back door handshake with the one who does the procedure and agree it was ok for the other neurologist to do the biopsy that my normal one doesn't do. It's so wild and frustrating. I'm so sorry you're in this predicament.
Is switching with a new referral to Advanced Neurology or something like that an option?
Yes. It just comes with the 1 year wait. TBH I made more progress using ChatGPT than anything.
Same clinic(quite possibly same dr) told me that they had never heard of an extended eeg. Since I was informed of the policy you mentioned and had already waited far too long for an appt, I chose to stay. My meds are a constant dosage and unless I notice an uptick in symptoms or a change in my blood work, I am going to stay. Yes, I am settling for less than I deserve, but with a chronic condition, I cannot go without meds.
I’ve never had good neurology luck anywhere near here tbh to the point that I go to anchuntz and it’s miserable.
Had similar with endocrinology. Started off seeing one endo, he was great, helped a lot with my pituitary tumor. He retired and they automatically assigned me a replacement who was taking over his patients, never offered a choice. She was nothing short of negligent the four years I tried to stick it out with her. She would refuse to run full thyroid panels despite me having a lot of symptoms still. She pulled me off my meds and didn't follow up at all for a year. Came back significantly worse, she blamed me. Put me back on my meds, didn't run a full panel still. It was like me telling her "My car is completely totalled and folded in half" to which she'd be like "but the tires are still good". I got curious and looked at her reviews. One diabetic patient said she's the first endo that didn't check their legs during any of their visits. Finally got up the courage to fire her and get a different endo. The office gal was like "Nope, you only get one lifetime change and you already had that".. excuse me?! After some back and forth she said since my last endo retired and I didn't get a choice, I still have one change left, for the rest of my life.. I changed. Saw that endo twice before he left under mysterious circumstances, but he was still significantly better because he RAN A FULL PANEL! My hormones were so messed up it was ridiculous. They tried to push me back to her and I just about lost my mind on them.
With all these bad comments shouldn’t we all get together and do a complaint to an investigative reporter. How can we ever fight back?? UCHealth needs to be exposed. This is all so wrong and a repetitive occurrence. Why can we not change doctors? Why can we not say a medicine isn’t working? Where are our patient rights? It is disturbing and it harms patients who are seeking to feel better.
I hate UCHealth so much honestly I keep having terrible experiences with every speciality. Cardiologist there tried to say I don’t have a PFO when it was seen and confirmed on my echo, she said I was just fat and lazy 😵💫
Well this does not give me hope. My doctors from the former Associates in Family Medicine all moved to U C Health after the collapse of Village Medical. There are not a lot of options in this town, and I am now also on Medicare, which is a whole other ball of wax/poop. Don’t even ask me what our annual premium costs are !