The amount of stuff that gets dropped in War Thunder is crazy.
The Ukrainian Bradley crew that smacked the Russian T-90 last year said they pulled operational/classified details from War Thunder forums/servers/discords, which, identified weakness and design flaws.
Lamo those dudes really have no chill and alot them to are service members trying to win a discord argument
, wasn't the British challengers spaced armor technical files where leaked in a Minecraft server of all things
The amount for brain-dead takes on the F-35 and Gripen will cause actual techs to leak documents to prove a point to Reddit armchair experts that think they know better.
It's almost like if you're a enemy, you ragebait members on purpose to get secured documents lmao
Which means, given that that leak was done to try and stop the Asterix deal, that the government may very well be going ahead with a plan for Gripens, and someone is trying to stop that from happening.
The government would lose all credibility that they built with the military in that case. I believe the PM had said that they were going to purchase the aircraft that won the review done by the RCAF, which was the F35 by a wide margin, so turning around and buying the gripen would dissolve that trust, especially amongst senior leaders.
Yes but who’s to say they won’t change every bid just because another contractor says they’ll create 10k jobs in Quebec and promise to build a manufacturing facility? That opens it up for davie to then bid on the river class destroyers, and then when they lose make a bunch of false promises and delay the shit out of the project
Bombardier contract would mean jobs in both Ontario and Quebec probably as they'd have to stand up new assembly lines. Even just shifting GlobalEye conversions here means more jobs and takes pressure off Saab's main swedish factory when they're trying to ramp up Gripen production. There's no longer a Bombardier operation at Mirabel, Airbus has taken over the building and C-series assembly work there, but there is still room around the airport property that a new factory could be built. Or for that matter, as I've said in other places, there's a huge Aerospace factory in Arnprior Ontario that has basically been idle for two years with most of its skilled workers laid off, but still living in the area. Its right next to an regional airport with runways long enough to accomodate Gripen operations and all it takes is a short tow across 40 feet of road between the factory property and the airport property.
Watch when the next time we have a procurement competition, companies will plain out lie and give an absurd number of job creation just to win the contract with zero plans to actually do it.
I see your argument, but the reality is that we are buying the f-35. No one is saying we aren't going to buy the f-35. And at this point it would be absolutely stupid not to.
The question then becomes are we also going to buy somebody else? And honestly, I don't think anybody is meaningfully hostile towards the addition of the Gripen, aside from folks on the sub. I've not met a single pilot, that has really strong feelings about this. In fact, most are thrilled at the idea of there being more jets how's the competition to be a fighter pilot is tough in this country
What is shows is someone (or some people) in the RCAF top brass are attempting to influence the public narrative, and manipulate the decisions of elected officials towards what they want.
As has been pointed out many times, the much of whole CAF is heavily US-captured, seemingly incapable of imagining a future without deep integration with US Forces or US kit. This manifests itself in the RCAF, in part, as "We will accept the F-35 and only the F-35."
Would you accept a shitty tank, truck, ship, for political reasons? The best aircraft was chosen twice and yet people are still pushing for the Gripen. The misinformation surrounding the Gripen vs F-35 is brutal and I’m amazed that members of the CAF are falling for it.
There is nothing wrong with leaking data, not with all the bullshit flying around.
I‘d like to know how much foreign interference there is with regards to all of this.
Really? Because you’re spreading it. There’s only ever been one full cycle of choosing and contracting for an F-18 replacement.
The attempt before that, under Harper (which never proceeded far enough to actually choose the plane and get a contract), failed because the Government and DND didn’t choose the best aircraft, and in fact went out of their way to to lie, cheat and manipulate the system to get the F-35 chosen without a proper competition or proper documentation and went so far as to lie to parliament to try and get it done.
in fact went out of their way to to lie, cheat and manipulate the system to get the F-35 chosen without a proper competition or proper documentation and went so far as to lie to parliament to try and get it done.
19 other countries did the same competition and the F-35 won.
Notable countries is Norway, Finland and the Swiss.
All of them did their own thing and F-35 still won, Finland had to leak their competition data because the public was outraged about it.
I really don't understand why people want the Gripen when they're not the ones working on or flying them.
Oh no no no; don’t go trying to change the conversation away from the actual misinformation around the F-35. You want to debate the merits of the Gripen you go find someone else but don’t you go trying to shoehorn it in to shutdown facts you don’t like.
Recurring thing in all F35 purchases, fuckery with numbers. Including Canada and even the country that provides it, USA.
All auditors found they vastly underestimated the costs of the F35. Sprinkle that with failures to deliver a proper evaluation and defense lobbied with the usual Lockheed Martin's "rent a general" strategy and you're surprised?
You're teenager warthunder forum level of gullible if you think the evaluation of the F35 in Canada was not shaped to only fit an F35 in it lol. Not even USAF would evaluate it that high.
It also doesn't change the fact that 20 countries have bought the aircraft. If it wasn't good, they would have returned it like Norway did with their maritime helicopter and sued the company.
seemingly incapable of imagining a future without deep integration with US Forces or US kit.
Considering they're still our neighbors, the highest funded military in the world, and a key player in NATO... no shit we need to be integrated, in the same way all NATO nations should be interoperable to some extent.
Like it or not, and I certainly don't, the US does manufacture some of the best equipment around, and the turnip head they have for a president will be dead and gone soon enough. I sincerely doubt the Republicans win midterms or the next election.
It shouldn't count because it wasn't leaked via the War Thunder forums.
I assume that’s a joke
war thunder nerds straight up leakidocuments every other month to justify why a tank needs more armor or why the the aim 9 lock range is worng lol
The amount of stuff that gets dropped in War Thunder is crazy.
The Ukrainian Bradley crew that smacked the Russian T-90 last year said they pulled operational/classified details from War Thunder forums/servers/discords, which, identified weakness and design flaws.
Clearly worked.
Lamo those dudes really have no chill and alot them to are service members trying to win a discord argument , wasn't the British challengers spaced armor technical files where leaked in a Minecraft server of all things
I don't blame them.
The amount for brain-dead takes on the F-35 and Gripen will cause actual techs to leak documents to prove a point to Reddit armchair experts that think they know better.
It's almost like if you're a enemy, you ragebait members on purpose to get secured documents lmao
The Asterix all over again...
Which means, given that that leak was done to try and stop the Asterix deal, that the government may very well be going ahead with a plan for Gripens, and someone is trying to stop that from happening.
That leak was done in an effort to ensure the Asterix deal was moved forward and NOT canceled or delayed by the sitting government.
Agree on the 2nd part of your comment that this was most likely done to stop the never-ending dicking around with the F-35.
The government would lose all credibility that they built with the military in that case. I believe the PM had said that they were going to purchase the aircraft that won the review done by the RCAF, which was the F35 by a wide margin, so turning around and buying the gripen would dissolve that trust, especially amongst senior leaders.
13% raises + retention allowance + IR improvements + instructor allowances can buy a lot of loyalty around here.
The Navy is getting subs are breakneck speed
The army will get....bullets? DLR should be asking for the moon right now.
And the Air Force is getting new aircraft left and right.
It may piss some people off, but overall I don't think you'll see much change tbh.
Yes but who’s to say they won’t change every bid just because another contractor says they’ll create 10k jobs in Quebec and promise to build a manufacturing facility? That opens it up for davie to then bid on the river class destroyers, and then when they lose make a bunch of false promises and delay the shit out of the project
Anyone who has been in for more than a year should know that they will do this every time.
The only thing more important than a French contract, is a contract to Irving.
Bombardier contract would mean jobs in both Ontario and Quebec probably as they'd have to stand up new assembly lines. Even just shifting GlobalEye conversions here means more jobs and takes pressure off Saab's main swedish factory when they're trying to ramp up Gripen production. There's no longer a Bombardier operation at Mirabel, Airbus has taken over the building and C-series assembly work there, but there is still room around the airport property that a new factory could be built. Or for that matter, as I've said in other places, there's a huge Aerospace factory in Arnprior Ontario that has basically been idle for two years with most of its skilled workers laid off, but still living in the area. Its right next to an regional airport with runways long enough to accomodate Gripen operations and all it takes is a short tow across 40 feet of road between the factory property and the airport property.
https://www.arnprioraerospace.com/
Watch when the next time we have a procurement competition, companies will plain out lie and give an absurd number of job creation just to win the contract with zero plans to actually do it.
So... Exactly what they try to do now?
It's procurement 101.
I see your argument, but the reality is that we are buying the f-35. No one is saying we aren't going to buy the f-35. And at this point it would be absolutely stupid not to.
The question then becomes are we also going to buy somebody else? And honestly, I don't think anybody is meaningfully hostile towards the addition of the Gripen, aside from folks on the sub. I've not met a single pilot, that has really strong feelings about this. In fact, most are thrilled at the idea of there being more jets how's the competition to be a fighter pilot is tough in this country
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What is shows is someone (or some people) in the RCAF top brass are attempting to influence the public narrative, and manipulate the decisions of elected officials towards what they want.
As has been pointed out many times, the much of whole CAF is heavily US-captured, seemingly incapable of imagining a future without deep integration with US Forces or US kit. This manifests itself in the RCAF, in part, as "We will accept the F-35 and only the F-35."
We want the best kit available.
Would you accept a shitty tank, truck, ship, for political reasons? The best aircraft was chosen twice and yet people are still pushing for the Gripen. The misinformation surrounding the Gripen vs F-35 is brutal and I’m amazed that members of the CAF are falling for it.
There is nothing wrong with leaking data, not with all the bullshit flying around.
I‘d like to know how much foreign interference there is with regards to all of this.
Really? Because you’re spreading it. There’s only ever been one full cycle of choosing and contracting for an F-18 replacement.
The attempt before that, under Harper (which never proceeded far enough to actually choose the plane and get a contract), failed because the Government and DND didn’t choose the best aircraft, and in fact went out of their way to to lie, cheat and manipulate the system to get the F-35 chosen without a proper competition or proper documentation and went so far as to lie to parliament to try and get it done.
19 other countries did the same competition and the F-35 won.
Notable countries is Norway, Finland and the Swiss.
All of them did their own thing and F-35 still won, Finland had to leak their competition data because the public was outraged about it.
I really don't understand why people want the Gripen when they're not the ones working on or flying them.
Oh no no no; don’t go trying to change the conversation away from the actual misinformation around the F-35. You want to debate the merits of the Gripen you go find someone else but don’t you go trying to shoehorn it in to shutdown facts you don’t like.
There is no misinformation.
I've physically seen and sat in one of them lmao.
We also have done many exercises with them.
What exactly is the misinformation? What the scoring system did is exactly what it was.
Lol
US's pressure on NATO countries to spend (wink wink) is the result of that.
Now most of those countries have on-going investigations into the politicians that let the F35, or general auditors finding the evaluation was skewed,
Switzerland
https://youtu.be/McIJBktvyBI?si=4c7uoxJx7oe9uINk
Norway
https://www.riksrevisjonen.no/en/reports2/en-2023-20242/introduction-of-norways-new-fighter-aircraft-f-35/
Boeing even sued Denmark because they couldn't even provide the evaluation that made them select the F35
https://ottawacitizen.com/news/national/defence-watch/legal-battle-between-boeing-and-the-danish-government-over-f-35-selection-ramps-up
And audit agency found they fucked up the numbers
https://www.defensenews.com/air/2017/11/13/danish-audit-agency-questions-data-for-f-35-purchase/
Recurring thing in all F35 purchases, fuckery with numbers. Including Canada and even the country that provides it, USA.
All auditors found they vastly underestimated the costs of the F35. Sprinkle that with failures to deliver a proper evaluation and defense lobbied with the usual Lockheed Martin's "rent a general" strategy and you're surprised?
You're teenager warthunder forum level of gullible if you think the evaluation of the F35 in Canada was not shaped to only fit an F35 in it lol. Not even USAF would evaluate it that high.
Go read Finland's report, it's in depth.
It also doesn't change the fact that 20 countries have bought the aircraft. If it wasn't good, they would have returned it like Norway did with their maritime helicopter and sued the company.
Just stop man, nobody agrees with you.
Considering they're still our neighbors, the highest funded military in the world, and a key player in NATO... no shit we need to be integrated, in the same way all NATO nations should be interoperable to some extent.
Like it or not, and I certainly don't, the US does manufacture some of the best equipment around, and the turnip head they have for a president will be dead and gone soon enough. I sincerely doubt the Republicans win midterms or the next election.