Additionally, the student-athlete’s prior school indicated it had no documentation on medical treatment, injury reports or medical conditions involving the student-athlete during that time frame and cited “developmental needs and our team’s competitive circumstances” as its reason the student-athlete did not play in the 2022-23 season.
Yeah we didn’t need Trinidad to play in 2022. Gulker (who just transferred to MSU) ran for 31 touchdowns at QB that year while we had another two QBs running the passing offense.
Chambliss was too far down the depth chart to contribute.
Tony Annese is probably a Power 5 level offensive-mind and great talent evaluator, thus allowing him to recruit at a high level for players that fit his offensive scheme to a T.
Even then he was hired in 2012 and it took until 2021 to actually win the title so it took 9 years of program building.
2020 was also vital imo as there was no football season at the DII level, that allowed Ferris to build an absolutely insane amount of depth for this level. Like, there were drives in ‘21 and ‘22 where Ferris would just rotate out their starting O-line and put in an entirely fresh, starting caliber line to continue running the ball. It was hilarious.
TLDR: Annese and staff are offensive geniuses and great skill evaluators. Circumstances allowed them to also build great depth and has helped the team turn into a powerhouse.
When I moved to the area near Michigan Tech in 2010, we had a few years of games where Ferris-Tech was the big game in the conference that year. Because both were pretty good.
Amazing the heights Ferris has gone on to reach since those days. Next level.
That’s absolutely nuts to have 31 rushing touchdowns as the part time quarterback. Looked at his stats that year and he scored about every 6 rushing attempts.
Dude it was so funny, we’d just get inside the 15 yard line and put him in alongside four new offensive linemen and just run him up the gut over and over
Brother he was supposed to split time with Gulker the year he led us to the Natty in 2024! Only because Gulker broke his leg was Trinidad given the full time gig.
I think a lot of people underestimate the skill of good d2 conferences like the one in Michigan, the Minnesota heavy one, and the Missouri/Kansas one. Most of those schools are close to mid level FCS if not better
The issue with Ferris is that there isn’t a ton of turnout to games (partially due to how rural the area is) so revenue would likely tank even more due to the extra travel and the facilities still needing a few million in investments.
GVSU has Ferris beat in their athletics facilities, like an indoor practice facility, better football stadium (we joke that the high school stadium where the national title is played is miles ahead of Ferris States stadium)
It’s getting closer, but by the time Ferris pulls the trigger on a move, Annese likely retires and the dynasty possibly falls apart. If that happens then Ferris would likely be in trouble at the FCS level.
GVSU tried and got denied a few years ago. They were telling recruits that they were going. Ferris has no chance of making the jump. Their basketball facilities are no where near good enough. D1 isn’t about football. It’s basketball
On the other hand, it does also appear that had Ferris State handled the paperwork differently, his situation could have fit into medical hardship waiver guidelines.
Yes, the decision that he wasn't going to play was made prior to his tonsil issue. But if he had been the starter and had the same tonsil issue, he probably would have qualified for a medical hardship waiver. (Assuming they didn't just flood him with antibiotics and get him back on the field.)
The missing piece is a signed affidavit by a medical professional stating that the condition was season-ending. We don't have that for a number of reasons, most likely because the condition was not, in fact, season ending.
I think the NCAA is 100% correct to not issue a medical hardship waiver, but I also think that the argument "The NCAA is denying me a year of top earning potential because I was too sick to perform." has a good chance of convincing a judge to at least issue a temporary injunction. He doesn't have to win his case, just get a temporary injunction.
The NCAA staff also has very little room for interpretation. When a waiver request like this goes to Indianapolis, all the staff does is confirm whether or not he qualifies for the waiver by the book. If he's missing a requirement like a signed affidavit that the illness was season-ending, they have to deny it. Then you file an appeal which goes to an NCAA committee made up of employees at NCAA member schools. Because the members make the rules, they have more leeway to say something like "Well they don't have the affidavit but the medical documentation makes it clear that he couldn't play, so approve the waiver." Schools send waivers they know are going to get denied by the staff all the time because they know their real chance to make an argument based on the circumstances is on appeal. But with the NCAA's legal troubles over the past decade, there's sort of an assumption that the player is always right and the NCAA should roll over for every request or get sued.
Yes I'm intimately familiar with how the entire process works. That's why it's infuriating to see the lawsuits because you know it's BS or stuff people are saying it untrue but you can't say anything.
Would suck more if he had no chance of going pro but this seems like the right move. Wish they start denying more. Ever since Covid, there's been a crazy amount of 6-7 year guys still playing. Time to move on and start giving younger guys a chance to play
Yeah, I kind of understand (don't like, but understand) guys like Diego Pavia continuing to try to get more eligibility, but he has a future in the NFL.
Chambliss will have a pro chance but I don’t think he’s going to viewed as massively superior to Pavia in an nfl scheme. Most of what he does is throwing simplish reads to Ole Miss platoon of tall WRs and use his legs.
Yeah a lot of things to hate on Pavia for but like I don’t blame him for trying to play in college for as long as possible since he probably isn’t an nfl level qb
Pavia would get paid peanuts playing the XFL or CFL (he would probably kill in the CFL actually) when he can make 20x more in college. If there is no chance at being drafted to the NFL, they will all try and get extra years. This isn’t probably over either, the lawyers will be happy sue there way unlimited years and a cut of the income.
6th year players has always existed. All it took was redshirting their first year and then getting a medical redshirt in the next four years. The 7th year (and beyond) players are the abominations that shouldn’t exist, but 6th year players are fine under the right circumstances.
It used to be that you only had sixth year players when they had two medical redshirts. The change to allow for a sixth year when you had one normal redshirt and one medical redshirt is recent. It also coincided with the COVID waiver, so you had this explosion of sixth year guys. Luckily this is the last season of the COVID classes.
As someone who obviously would have loved for him to be approved, I agree. Would have been amazing for us but the precedent set would have made me really uncomfortable
Plus, I personally wouldn’t want to shut the door on another Chris Weinke/Brandon Weeden situation with a guy who never used his eligibility enrolling in college.
An age limit is good in theory, but has unintended consequences.
He's worth more next year as a QB for Ole Miss than he would be in the NFL, but he could definitely hurt his draft prospect and longterm future by sticking around another year.
NFL teams are desperate for QBs every year, he can declare whenever he wants and get drafted.
Ironically the reason he benefits from being able to do this is because nfl teams keep drafting dudes like Chambliss in the 1st round expecting them to be the next Mahomes after one season of starting in CFB.
NFL teams should take risks on rookie QBs. Fact is, QB is the most important position, and there are not 32 starter-caliber QBs at any given time. If you need one, you can cripple your cap space by stealing someone else's, or you can take a risk on a rookie. He probably won't pan out, but rookie contracts are cheap, and you can try again in a couple years. Give yourself as many chances as possible, because hitting on a QB out of the draft is the easiest way to build a contender.
You’re getting way too specific here. Every year there are QBs drafted way too early and teams think they’ll be their qb of the future. There’s very few QBs that are going to be that yet they still keep drafting them every year way too early.
Not saying he’s his build. Saying they’re two guys that are overhyped for one year in CFB that will
get drafted super high and won’t do anything in the nfl.
ARich was never a good quarterback at any point in his collegiate career. It wasn’t until the combine that Irsay got himself hyped up on the measurables and measurables alone. ARich was/is a freak athletic specimen but never a good QB.
Chambliss has major flaws, but at least he’s shown something tangible on the field.
“Additionally, the student-athlete’s prior school indicated it had no documentation on medical treatment, injury reports or medical conditions involving the student-athlete during that time frame and cited “developmental needs and our team’s competitive circumstances” as its reason the student-athlete did not play in the 2022-23 season.”
Well that’s going to be very hard to argue around. Basically looks like they tried preserving his season through a medical redshirt when he was otherwise healthy.
If he had an illness so bad that it effected nearly an entire season of his career, don’t you don’t think he or the school would have some documentation about it?
I agree he should be denied, as much as that sucks as a fan. Gotta call balls and strikes as you see it though, and there just isn’t a good reason for more eligibility.
May I introduce you gentlemen to Chinadad Trambliss, a 23 year old QB who comes from a college no one has ever heard of but we promise he has 4 years of eligibility left?
Yeah but it’s way more likely a Mormon who didn’t do a mission leaves the church, so they vastly prefer them doing it right after high school to indoctrinate them
That and there are plenty of freshman that come in older because their parents held them back when they were younger and are almost 20 by the time they get to college.
Also it’s very common in other sports to start later. For example in hockey, it’s common for players to start at 20-21 making a universal age limit almost impossible among different sports.
It's a matter of time before athletes are legally considered state employees at public universities. While a blanket age discrimination lawsuit would fail (that only protects people over 40), with the equal protection clause you'd almost certainly have a judge say there's no rational reason to prevent people over 24 from playing sports.
Gotcha. If the theory of illegality is based on the Fourteenth Amendment, you can color me skeptical. Cases in which a classification fails rational basis review are vanishingly rare. I’m not saying a 24 year old cutoff would certainly survive, but the odds would be quite good.
If Little League and other youth sports organizations cant enforce their age limits (and depending on the sporting federation it goes up to U23) what do you think happens?
Little league isn't an industry where teams and coaches are shitpiles of money. Little league also has an issue where it become dangerous to players to have grown men playing against 12 year olds. Little league is itself an independent company that licensed out the name to chapters throughout the world. It can set age limits because it isn't a third party controlling labor for everyone. It also has leagues that still go up to 16 I think. They discontinued their age 18 league because too many US kids would simply stop and were playing in high school.
This is important because individual schools could very easily institute rules where players can only play for 4 or 5 years, and then not allow them on the team anymore. Schools have this ability, but the NCAA cannot make this a rule and force schools to adhere to it. This is because the NCAA is essentially a cartel created by a bunch of independent entities who use the NCAA to control the labor force.
It would be perfectly fine for Microsoft to fire employees after five years. It would be illegal if all major tech firms created an entity that banned employees from working at all of them after 5 combined years of working.
And one of the biggest reasons is most of those leagues don't make tons of money and operate as businesses. There are also typically not people being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep playing in those leagues.
What comes down to it is potential damages. A football player not being able to get paid hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars is monetary damages they can suffer. Someone not being able to keep competing in a league simply because they want to keep playing isn't significant damages.
I think the current system is fine as we move away from the covid year. NCAA was quick to give it's side. I feel like this is just a high profile rejection given a history of leniency.
We had to do this process for my daughter who was a volleyball player. She had a concussion. We had to make sure the doctor ruled her out for the rest of the season and it was well documented. This came up a couple years later after she transferred and the documentation was all she needed
The way he reacted after the game I think he knew his time in college was likely done. They’ve approved waivers for a lot more random things though so I hope it works out for him.
“Doing very well” is boilerplate doctor-speak and irrelevant to whether someone can play football safely, this is just the NCAA cherry picking notes to find a reason to say no. You’ll see notes that someone is “doing very well” 10 days post-op from a poly-trauma ortho surgery where they can’t walk.
It could've, but then they cited other reasons for him not playing. So there's a lack of documentation that it was for medical reasons and actual documentation that it was for player development reasons.
Well that contradicts what the NCAA told Ole Miss when we submitted his medical paperwork and they said it would be enough to get another year. Oh well. On to the next QB
Additionally, the student-athlete’s prior school indicated it had no documentation on medical treatment, injury reports or medical conditions involving the student-athlete during that time frame and cited “developmental needs and our team’s competitive circumstances” as its reason the student-athlete did not play in the 2022-23 season.
Ole Miss is bringing almost every key player back next year, there is no reason to think they won’t be as good next year with a lot of the same guys as this year.
What’s the solution to this? It seems like it’s just pure chaos with every situation in CFB, and everything is case-by-case.
They should just change the rules to allow for 5 years of eligibility and the only way to play for a 6th-year is an injury that occurs during the 5th year, and they need to miss more than 1/3 of games or something similar.
As for guys that never went to college or JUCO guys, they should make a rule that every 2 years removed from high school counts as a year of eligibility. Thus 2nd-year juco guys would technically be in their freshman year. Most people graduate at ~18, so you’re no longer eligible at 28. I think that’s reasonable and allows for plenty of opportunities, without negatively affecting younger recruits.
this info is from the original waiver submission. Mars was enlisted recently and has uncovered and sent a ton of supposed "evidence" so idk why that wouldn't be mentioned here...
I mean, that seems pretty fair.
Yeah we didn’t need Trinidad to play in 2022. Gulker (who just transferred to MSU) ran for 31 touchdowns at QB that year while we had another two QBs running the passing offense.
Chambliss was too far down the depth chart to contribute.
How tf did Ferris become this juggernaut? I played in the GLIAC when GVSU was running things.
Tony Annese is probably a Power 5 level offensive-mind and great talent evaluator, thus allowing him to recruit at a high level for players that fit his offensive scheme to a T.
Even then he was hired in 2012 and it took until 2021 to actually win the title so it took 9 years of program building.
2020 was also vital imo as there was no football season at the DII level, that allowed Ferris to build an absolutely insane amount of depth for this level. Like, there were drives in ‘21 and ‘22 where Ferris would just rotate out their starting O-line and put in an entirely fresh, starting caliber line to continue running the ball. It was hilarious.
TLDR: Annese and staff are offensive geniuses and great skill evaluators. Circumstances allowed them to also build great depth and has helped the team turn into a powerhouse.
I don’t mind Ferris being good because if I say “The Bulldogs will win the D2 natty”, I could be referring to UMD or Ferris 🤣
Don't they have an NIL program too? Thought I heard that on the radio here in Arkansas leading up to the game against Harding.
Yep, Forbes has a decent article on it. They have a deal with Opendorse, which helps for sure.
When I moved to the area near Michigan Tech in 2010, we had a few years of games where Ferris-Tech was the big game in the conference that year. Because both were pretty good.
Amazing the heights Ferris has gone on to reach since those days. Next level.
,
The Weld Engineering program is just THAT attractive
Same as me. I played at UIndy. How about you?
NMU
That’s absolutely nuts to have 31 rushing touchdowns as the part time quarterback. Looked at his stats that year and he scored about every 6 rushing attempts.
Dude it was so funny, we’d just get inside the 15 yard line and put him in alongside four new offensive linemen and just run him up the gut over and over
I only know the outline of the Chambliss story and it keeps getting crazier. He didn't start at Ferris State a year when he was healthy? 🫨
Brother he was supposed to split time with Gulker the year he led us to the Natty in 2024! Only because Gulker broke his leg was Trinidad given the full time gig.
He didn’t start until he was a RS junior!
I think a lot of people underestimate the skill of good d2 conferences like the one in Michigan, the Minnesota heavy one, and the Missouri/Kansas one. Most of those schools are close to mid level FCS if not better
There’s been rumors of GVSU moving up to FCS for years, wouldn’t be surprised if Ferris joins them if it does eventually happen
The issue with Ferris is that there isn’t a ton of turnout to games (partially due to how rural the area is) so revenue would likely tank even more due to the extra travel and the facilities still needing a few million in investments.
GVSU has Ferris beat in their athletics facilities, like an indoor practice facility, better football stadium (we joke that the high school stadium where the national title is played is miles ahead of Ferris States stadium)
It’s getting closer, but by the time Ferris pulls the trigger on a move, Annese likely retires and the dynasty possibly falls apart. If that happens then Ferris would likely be in trouble at the FCS level.
AFAIK FWIW, GVSU isn't interested in moving up to FCS/D1.
GVSU tried and got denied a few years ago. They were telling recruits that they were going. Ferris has no chance of making the jump. Their basketball facilities are no where near good enough. D1 isn’t about football. It’s basketball
I'm aware that it's not about football.
"shit, I have a lot of money on the line, I need a valid medical reason as to why I sat on the bench in 2022."
That's absolutely what this looks like.
On the other hand, it does also appear that had Ferris State handled the paperwork differently, his situation could have fit into medical hardship waiver guidelines.
Yes, the decision that he wasn't going to play was made prior to his tonsil issue. But if he had been the starter and had the same tonsil issue, he probably would have qualified for a medical hardship waiver. (Assuming they didn't just flood him with antibiotics and get him back on the field.)
The missing piece is a signed affidavit by a medical professional stating that the condition was season-ending. We don't have that for a number of reasons, most likely because the condition was not, in fact, season ending.
I think the NCAA is 100% correct to not issue a medical hardship waiver, but I also think that the argument "The NCAA is denying me a year of top earning potential because I was too sick to perform." has a good chance of convincing a judge to at least issue a temporary injunction. He doesn't have to win his case, just get a temporary injunction.
You wouldn't believe how many of these denials that have the public foaming at the mouth are actually very fair...
The NCAA staff also has very little room for interpretation. When a waiver request like this goes to Indianapolis, all the staff does is confirm whether or not he qualifies for the waiver by the book. If he's missing a requirement like a signed affidavit that the illness was season-ending, they have to deny it. Then you file an appeal which goes to an NCAA committee made up of employees at NCAA member schools. Because the members make the rules, they have more leeway to say something like "Well they don't have the affidavit but the medical documentation makes it clear that he couldn't play, so approve the waiver." Schools send waivers they know are going to get denied by the staff all the time because they know their real chance to make an argument based on the circumstances is on appeal. But with the NCAA's legal troubles over the past decade, there's sort of an assumption that the player is always right and the NCAA should roll over for every request or get sued.
Yes I'm intimately familiar with how the entire process works. That's why it's infuriating to see the lawsuits because you know it's BS or stuff people are saying it untrue but you can't say anything.
Oh man you could pay me a lot of money to passionately argue about the definition of “developmental needs” and “competitive circumstances”
Most of us in this sub have developmental needs for sure
Secondary flair checks out. I might have to get me one of those …
Yes, I would absolutely take a dump truck’s worth of money to do it.
Doesn’t mean I believe any of it and I will be sure to tell you repeatedly that you’re probably going to lose.
Bro is gonna be 25. Move on. Let college kids play
That is indeed a fair counterpoint. At least the issue at hand is just if he was actually hurt/sick and not anything else
Well you just hate Ole Miss and dont want to be fair to him
Would suck more if he had no chance of going pro but this seems like the right move. Wish they start denying more. Ever since Covid, there's been a crazy amount of 6-7 year guys still playing. Time to move on and start giving younger guys a chance to play
Yeah, I kind of understand (don't like, but understand) guys like Diego Pavia continuing to try to get more eligibility, but he has a future in the NFL.
Chambliss will have a pro chance but I don’t think he’s going to viewed as massively superior to Pavia in an nfl scheme. Most of what he does is throwing simplish reads to Ole Miss platoon of tall WRs and use his legs.
Pavia? Highly unlikely he has a future in the NFL. Maybe the XFL .
He’s talking about Trin
That's exactly what I'm saying. He's never going to make what he's making now. Trinidad still has a future in the NFL though.
And again, I'm not saying Pavia or anyone else should have unlimited eligibility, but I understand why he would want to continue playing.
Yeah a lot of things to hate on Pavia for but like I don’t blame him for trying to play in college for as long as possible since he probably isn’t an nfl level qb
I don’t blame him for trying. I blame the courts for not saying no.
The Zakai Ziegler case was DOA, so they’ve shown that there is a line somewhere, which is encouraging.
I absolutely can hate on Pavia for being imo overly litigious.
lol
Pavia would get paid peanuts playing the XFL or CFL (he would probably kill in the CFL actually) when he can make 20x more in college. If there is no chance at being drafted to the NFL, they will all try and get extra years. This isn’t probably over either, the lawyers will be happy sue there way unlimited years and a cut of the income.
6th year players has always existed. All it took was redshirting their first year and then getting a medical redshirt in the next four years. The 7th year (and beyond) players are the abominations that shouldn’t exist, but 6th year players are fine under the right circumstances.
Yep. Case Keenum is the first that comes to mind.
It used to be that you only had sixth year players when they had two medical redshirts. The change to allow for a sixth year when you had one normal redshirt and one medical redshirt is recent. It also coincided with the COVID waiver, so you had this explosion of sixth year guys. Luckily this is the last season of the COVID classes.
Since covid the 7th year is as common as 6th year used to be because everyone got the covid year but that will end soon
People down voting this can't count to 7 apparently
As someone who obviously would have loved for him to be approved, I agree. Would have been amazing for us but the precedent set would have made me really uncomfortable
We really need to just establish to make this stuff way stricter. It’s 5 years to play 4 years. No exceptions.
There should be an age limit, too, something like you have to start the academic year at 23 years or younger.
I don’t necessarily disagree, but probably needs to go up to 25. Probably some legal issues with it as well
Yea that would disqualify a lot of Mormons from their junior/senior years who go on their 2 year missions after high school.
Cannot forget those who choose to serve in the Armed Forces prior to college
Plus, I personally wouldn’t want to shut the door on another Chris Weinke/Brandon Weeden situation with a guy who never used his eligibility enrolling in college.
An age limit is good in theory, but has unintended consequences.
Or us old fat farts that want to try out to be a kicker.
Age exceptions for kickers punters and long snappers only lmao
They probably don't deny more because they're afraid of being sued
Agreed
Right, hell even Beck is a 7th year guy.
6th year. The Covid era should be coming to an end now
6th year (class of 2020 recruit, so COVID exemption, and 4 years + one redshirt after that)
Don’t know why you wouldn’t wanna come out with this QB class if you have NFL aspirations. Also what does this mean for Simmons in the portal?
He's worth more next year as a QB for Ole Miss than he would be in the NFL, but he could definitely hurt his draft prospect and longterm future by sticking around another year.
Especially since he'll be with a completely different offensive staff. Seems like a pretty big gamble for him to stay.
Simmons is going to Missouri
NFL teams are desperate for QBs every year, he can declare whenever he wants and get drafted.
Ironically the reason he benefits from being able to do this is because nfl teams keep drafting dudes like Chambliss in the 1st round expecting them to be the next Mahomes after one season of starting in CFB.
NFL teams should take risks on rookie QBs. Fact is, QB is the most important position, and there are not 32 starter-caliber QBs at any given time. If you need one, you can cripple your cap space by stealing someone else's, or you can take a risk on a rookie. He probably won't pan out, but rookie contracts are cheap, and you can try again in a couple years. Give yourself as many chances as possible, because hitting on a QB out of the draft is the easiest way to build a contender.
who, besides Bryce Young, has the NFL drafted in the first round and expected to be the next mahomes that fits Chambliss’ play style and build?
You’re getting way too specific here. Every year there are QBs drafted way too early and teams think they’ll be their qb of the future. There’s very few QBs that are going to be that yet they still keep drafting them every year way too early.
But to answer your question Anthony Richardson.
richardson still has tools that chambliss doesnt. which is what i meant. i guess i misinterpreted what you meant by “dudes like chambliss”
In what world is ar chambliss' build
Not saying he’s his build. Saying they’re two guys that are overhyped for one year in CFB that will get drafted super high and won’t do anything in the nfl.
ARich was never a good quarterback at any point in his collegiate career. It wasn’t until the combine that Irsay got himself hyped up on the measurables and measurables alone. ARich was/is a freak athletic specimen but never a good QB.
Chambliss has major flaws, but at least he’s shown something tangible on the field.
Then you didnt answer his question
Kyler Murray
Robert Griffin III Taller, but Caleb Williams Justin Fields
He might get drafted by the Titans lol
Did you forget Cam Ward
Never bet against the Titans doing something stupid.
[deleted]
“Additionally, the student-athlete’s prior school indicated it had no documentation on medical treatment, injury reports or medical conditions involving the student-athlete during that time frame and cited “developmental needs and our team’s competitive circumstances” as its reason the student-athlete did not play in the 2022-23 season.”
That’s not a great way to try to get an extra year due to medical…
worth a shot i guess
I don’t buy the case based on what I know.
But it’s certainly possible a D2 school wasn’t maintaining records on their backup QBs respiratory issues.
He was dealing with something for a significant period of time that fall. That much is evident from notes that the NCAA referenced in their statement.
Whether that something warrants an extra year of eligibility….that’s another story.
[deleted]
Or there just isn’t any documentation.
For now
Lawyers are not magicians
Well that’s going to be very hard to argue around. Basically looks like they tried preserving his season through a medical redshirt when he was otherwise healthy.
There's no logical reason he should get another year.
But Reddit likes him
because he played 2 games in one year when he had an illness
If he had an illness so bad that it effected nearly an entire season of his career, don’t you don’t think he or the school would have some documentation about it?
I agree he should be denied, as much as that sucks as a fan. Gotta call balls and strikes as you see it though, and there just isn’t a good reason for more eligibility.
An honest take that I agree with. Need to focus on getting a QB in the portal now not this lawsuit business
Need to throw some suitcases of money and voodoo magic, anything to get Deuce Knight now.
May I introduce you gentlemen to Chinadad Trambliss, a 23 year old QB who comes from a college no one has ever heard of but we promise he has 4 years of eligibility left?
This was the right decision. I didn't see a valid reason to give him another year tbh.
Give everyone 5 years to do 5 seasons. No red shirts and no waivers. Have to be completed by age 24.
Idk if the age 24 thing would stick due to BYU and their missions.
Not to mention a lot of Aussie punters
I’m ok with excluding the 28 year old freshman punters
The easy way around that is fuck BYU.
Secret Utah 3rd flair?
Military ?
*soak BYU
LDS do missions later in life. Some in their 60s and 70s. They can choose to do them whenever they want and they aren't required to go on missions.
Yeah but it’s way more likely a Mormon who didn’t do a mission leaves the church, so they vastly prefer them doing it right after high school
to indoctrinate themI mean I don’t disagree with you
Seconded
With flairs like yours I don’t think you’re allowed an opinion 😂
That and there are plenty of freshman that come in older because their parents held them back when they were younger and are almost 20 by the time they get to college.
Oh no BYU doesn’t get a special exemption to play grown ass men
I’m not saying I agree with it lol
I disagree with age commitments, at least without a waiver process. Case in point: walk on players on the GI bill.
Only issue with setting an age limit is that you get guys that start much older. Look at some of these Aussie punters being like 25-27.
Also it’s very common in other sports to start later. For example in hockey, it’s common for players to start at 20-21 making a universal age limit almost impossible among different sports.
Why should we bend the rules so semi pros who flame out in Australia can play football in America?
Nobody is bending the rules. They’re not playing college football over there to begin with.
Yes, let's make more unenforceable rules. Until you get over that hump, there is no point in even trying to make new rules.
The only thing enforceable there is the Age 24 limit
How? A court would 100% say that is illegal.
I don’t think they can, there are U23 and other age-restricted competitions across sports in the US
If they struck that down, so many other organizations would have to scramble before a lawsuit
Yeah but that doesn’t make such age discrimination legal. And those U23 leagues haven’t been tested in court afaik.
Age discrimination is only a thing for 40+
Why? Honest question
It's a matter of time before athletes are legally considered state employees at public universities. While a blanket age discrimination lawsuit would fail (that only protects people over 40), with the equal protection clause you'd almost certainly have a judge say there's no rational reason to prevent people over 24 from playing sports.
Gotcha. If the theory of illegality is based on the Fourteenth Amendment, you can color me skeptical. Cases in which a classification fails rational basis review are vanishingly rare. I’m not saying a 24 year old cutoff would certainly survive, but the odds would be quite good.
And now we go back to the US Under-23 teams in various sports, which end up being their core defense
Those are private organizations. Most member institutions under the NCAA are state actors.
I thought there were more private institutions than public institutions overall
Also the NSFs with any power generally have some public oversight
Sherman act baby. Rule of reason go brrrrr
Age discrimination obviously
How so?
If Little League and other youth sports organizations cant enforce their age limits (and depending on the sporting federation it goes up to U23) what do you think happens?
Also, age discrimination only applies for 40+
Has anyone ever tried to challenge Little League in court?
No, but you think people wouldn’t if given half a chance
Think they wouldn’t try to sue the USSF/USAB to get overage players on junior teams?
Little league isn't an industry where teams and coaches are shitpiles of money. Little league also has an issue where it become dangerous to players to have grown men playing against 12 year olds. Little league is itself an independent company that licensed out the name to chapters throughout the world. It can set age limits because it isn't a third party controlling labor for everyone. It also has leagues that still go up to 16 I think. They discontinued their age 18 league because too many US kids would simply stop and were playing in high school.
This is important because individual schools could very easily institute rules where players can only play for 4 or 5 years, and then not allow them on the team anymore. Schools have this ability, but the NCAA cannot make this a rule and force schools to adhere to it. This is because the NCAA is essentially a cartel created by a bunch of independent entities who use the NCAA to control the labor force.
It would be perfectly fine for Microsoft to fire employees after five years. It would be illegal if all major tech firms created an entity that banned employees from working at all of them after 5 combined years of working.
The issue is that you can still age out players regardless, and the highest level of age-gated junior play is generally U23 in most sports
And one of the biggest reasons is most of those leagues don't make tons of money and operate as businesses. There are also typically not people being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep playing in those leagues.
What comes down to it is potential damages. A football player not being able to get paid hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars is monetary damages they can suffer. Someone not being able to keep competing in a league simply because they want to keep playing isn't significant damages.
I think the current system is fine as we move away from the covid year. NCAA was quick to give it's side. I feel like this is just a high profile rejection given a history of leniency.
I don't like the age rule. I want Brandon Weedon's. Also BYU
And then someone sues and the rule is done
Why do you people not get that? There is no rule that limits a citizen that will survive a legal challenge. We have seen this already.
Its alright unc time for the NFL
Nothing like relying on some treatment notes from a DII student athletic trainer! Goodbye millions
Sucks for us, but go ball in the NFL
And yet sorry ass TJ Finley is about to go to his 7th school
Finley actually needs a wavier himself to get another year. Also I don't know why any school would take him but 6 have so maybe one more will
Just go to the league bro
Pain
We had to do this process for my daughter who was a volleyball player. She had a concussion. We had to make sure the doctor ruled her out for the rest of the season and it was well documented. This came up a couple years later after she transferred and the documentation was all she needed
Was he practicing?
The way he reacted after the game I think he knew his time in college was likely done. They’ve approved waivers for a lot more random things though so I hope it works out for him.
“Doing very well” is boilerplate doctor-speak and irrelevant to whether someone can play football safely, this is just the NCAA cherry picking notes to find a reason to say no. You’ll see notes that someone is “doing very well” 10 days post-op from a poly-trauma ortho surgery where they can’t walk.
Yea it basically just means “recovering as expected at this stage.” Doing very well 1 day postop and 4 years postop would look totally different.
I wondered if the game would've gone differently if the NCAA had told him before lol
There was another post that said they got the same answer as when they asked verbally in December, so he probably already knew
I see you are familiar with "The ND Dilemma"
This could be interpreted as he’s doing well on his treatment plan not overall doing well.
It could've, but then they cited other reasons for him not playing. So there's a lack of documentation that it was for medical reasons and actual documentation that it was for player development reasons.
I think you're SOL on this one.
Well that contradicts what the NCAA told Ole Miss when we submitted his medical paperwork and they said it would be enough to get another year. Oh well. On to the next QB
Maddox is next on the depth chart unless we get a transfer
I think Deuce Knight is gonna be coming in
There was also this included:
Additionally, the student-athlete’s prior school indicated it had no documentation on medical treatment, injury reports or medical conditions involving the student-athlete during that time frame and cited “developmental needs and our team’s competitive circumstances” as its reason the student-athlete did not play in the 2022-23 season.
Ferris state explicitly stated that the reason he did not play was for “developmental needs and competitive circumstances “.
Oh well
Pete Golding is beside himself. Driving around downtown Columbia, MO begging (thru texts) Simmons's family for address to Austin's dorm
I'm waiting for him to put on the LSU jersey and for all this information to magically appear. 🤣
Dude needs to just try his luck at the draft. All he wants is NIL money. Ole miss isn't gonna be as good next year even if he comes back
Ole Miss is bringing almost every key player back next year, there is no reason to think they won’t be as good next year with a lot of the same guys as this year.
We will continue to be doubted forever. I remember the same comments last year about how we would be lucky to win 8 games after the draft losses.
“They peaked and lost to Kentucky LOLOLOL” this sub literally the entire offseason.
I would totally take him over Shaduer. Personally. He has the actual story of a future champion. Not his dad story.
What’s the solution to this? It seems like it’s just pure chaos with every situation in CFB, and everything is case-by-case.
They should just change the rules to allow for 5 years of eligibility and the only way to play for a 6th-year is an injury that occurs during the 5th year, and they need to miss more than 1/3 of games or something similar.
As for guys that never went to college or JUCO guys, they should make a rule that every 2 years removed from high school counts as a year of eligibility. Thus 2nd-year juco guys would technically be in their freshman year. Most people graduate at ~18, so you’re no longer eligible at 28. I think that’s reasonable and allows for plenty of opportunities, without negatively affecting younger recruits.
this info is from the original waiver submission. Mars was enlisted recently and has uncovered and sent a ton of supposed "evidence" so idk why that wouldn't be mentioned here...
A note from a doctor? What?
Pretty important part of a Medical Hardship waiver.
Man fuck y’all.
Why?
He's an angry elf
I just want one more year of Trinidad he’s very good and he’s actually deserving of another year.
Why does he deserve another year?
Because Ole Miss didn't win this year
Checks out, let's give him another year so he can not win next year too
Maybe he should get a fucking job instead
And before you bring up Sid from Miami, he should get a job too
The crybabies show their true colors.
No reddit to listen to your boohooing this time.
Jesus man get a fucking life. Your obsession is getting weird
No! <3
Yeah bro is next-level obsessed with Ole Miss, he follows us more than most Ole Miss fans I know.
I know things suck but this is the NCAAS fault.
I know and I hate the NCAA.