These days it seems too black or white. Either looking for a lifetime partner or a casual fwb. Why not a grey zone where you get to know someone as a potential friend, if the chemistry exists explore a potential relationship, if feelings are mutual and it’s the right stage of your life fall in love and get married?
I dated before everyone owned cell phones and just met irl. We explored what dating was about, whom we meshed with, what we liked or didn’t like. I’ve honestly never been on or even looked at a dating app.
Was married to a great father but not a partner. Now in the divorce process. While separated, irl met someone as an initial friend who is becoming more as an AG, LD. A lot on Reddit seems to paint dating so black and white rather than a wonderful exploration of relationships. I hope that more than one soul mate exists for each of us.
I’ll be exploring dating again irl and am confused by why does society these days immediately judges and labels others as either casual or long term? Can’t we just explore and get to know each other and either be friends or romantic partners if that’s where it progresses? I’m not jaded or naive. Have been out of the dating scene for two decades though so help me understand what’s going on these days. Thanks🙏
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Crazy_Skill2770 originally posted:
These days it seems too black or white. Either looking for a lifetime partner or a casual fwb. Why not a grey zone where you get to know someone as a potential friend, if the chemistry exists explore a potential relationship, if feelings are mutual and it’s the right stage of your life fall in love and get married?
I dated before everyone owned cell phones and just met irl. We explored what dating was about, whom we meshed with, what we liked or didn’t like. I’ve honestly never been on or even looked at a dating app.
Was married to a great father but not a partner. Now in the divorce process. While separated, irl met someone as an initial friend who is becoming more as an AG, LD. A lot on Reddit seems to paint dating so black and white rather than a wonderful exploration of relationships. I hope that more than one soul mate exists for each of us.
I’ll be exploring dating again irl and am confused by why does society these days immediately judges and labels others as either casual or long term? Can’t we just explore and get to know each other and either be friends or romantic partners if that’s where it progresses? I’m not jaded or naive. Have been out of the dating scene for two decades though so help me understand what’s going on these days. Thanks🙏
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Because life experiences in 2025 are like a YouTube short or a facebook reel. Give me exactly what I want, curated especially for me and give it to me quickly.
Thus, everything’s hyper speed. Does anyone stop to smell the flowers anymore?
Nope.
🌹
Before I met my fiancee, I basically told women I would go with the flow. If there's a relationship there, then I'm up for it. If there's not, but we like each other and are attracted, then FWB is fine too.
Dating with a particular objective that you apply to every scenario is a fool's errand. If you are looking for a long term relationship and that's it, it's highly likely that you find one where there shouldn't be one. To a man with a hammer, everything is a nail and all that.
Hey just want your opinion as a man but what made your fiancé stand out among the rest? Thank you!
She didn't disturb my peace, she added to it. When I'm with her, I feel totally content. No bullshit, no drama, no micro analyzing my facial expressions and everything I do. If I want to sit and read a book in another room, or if I am tired and not switched on, there's no issues. It's not the only reason I love her, but in terms of what set her apart from other women, that was the biggest thing.
Solid perspective. Congrats to you & your fiancé!
Our flowers are the Lennar homes we browsed on Zillow.
Sad truth
No time, sorry. Next reel, please.
Reality apparently😂
Henceforth hyper speed. Hope my kids have luck dating in this environment when they choose to engage.
I can’t do grey zone because I emotionally attach very easily.
If she’s soulmate level, I’m pretty much immediately going to crush on her and attach, so I can’t do fwb, casual or grey zone.
So she has to be at one of the extremes: either club hookup or wife. The in between doesn’t work for me (perhaps with some very rare exceptions).
Kudos that you know and understand yourself so well.
Society has evolved and there’s new trends now. People have smaller attention span and lots of options available with easy access.
You can still find people who are willing to explore and take time, but its rare.
Well explained. That clarifies my understanding a lot. Reinforces what was feeling in my gut instincts.
I don’t know how old your children are but this is the perfect example of why we need to teach our kids how to interact with other people on a more human level. As a society we are rapidly losing our ability to do this and it’s clearly become detrimental to our species, and to our planet. Everything has gotten so fast that we’ve forgotten how to create things (and relationships) that last. We’ve forgotten how to stop and find beauty in the mundane. We’ve forgotten how to enjoy the journey on our never ending quest for the perfect, Instagram worthy relationships, and the money and success that we feel we need in order to feel worthy. We need to remind our children to slow down sometimes and reflect on what is happening in the now instead of impatiently awaiting for the future.
From my experience growing up before social media and watching it, turn into what it is, I’m pretty sure it’s a net negative on society and relationships and self-esteem all the way around.
The longer I can keep my kids away from it the better. It has turned into the single worst aspect of our current society in my opinion.
We really need to legitimately legislate the fuck out of social media and get it back to what it was in the beginning, no, you can’t do and say whatever you want, no, you can’t just make another profile etc.
I’m glad some schools have at least started banning cell phone use during school time
What you shared is so true in our society. My college age kids have vastly different personalities. My son is focused on making wealth, has a besties group since grade school so nurtures wonderful lifetime relationships, knows his priorities hasn't been on dating but still went to Prom, etc. I think my daughter struggles more in this environment. For me, yoga reminds me to be fully present in the moment and the growth in becoming as life evolves.
And many are too fragile emotionally to handle the rejection and break ups and/or don’t have the relationship skills to take the good with the bad in people and see how they might mesh. They expect to order a partner like they order a pizza.
Oh dear. No wonder fewer are getting married and not as many are choosing to raise kids.
Because dating changes throughout the generations. What was normal to dating in your generation was not normal to your parents generation, etc..
Due to the wider access to education, increased cost of living, ability to connect more easily with like minded people through social media, and other current socioeconomic factors. People do not want to just "figure it out" because they don't have the privilege to spend time on something that realistically is a dead end for the plot.
Also, while you may romanticize the idea of "friends first" feelings naturally later. Many have been burned by that philosophy due to not taking initiative much sooner.
Overall, I get the sentiment but you are a bit out of touch which isn't a negative thing. It's just not constructive to what the dating world is like now.
Good for me to understand. Especially since I will likely be dating across the decades. Already exploring with someone half my age. Guess everyone these days knows exactly what their boundaries and goals are so I’d better figure mine out too.
People are very concerned with sunk cost nowadays. I date intentionally because that’s what I want, I don’t want to play games and not a fan of grey zones… I have enough grey zones in life, I don’t need dating to be one too. I lay my cards on the table, and make my intentions clear.
Now understanding that truly is the world these days. Let’s me know that I need to figure out exactly what cards I want to play and what boundaries.
Sounds lame and boring, tbh. Nobody wants to date someone that doesn’t know what they want like that.
Learned tons how society has changed from everyone’s comments. Upping my game to knowing my boundaries, goals and what cards willing to deal.
You know you get a say in who you date right? You're not the only one with this magical outlook of 'see how we fit together before forcing it into a designated box'. There are other people out there who approach dating like that. Maybe one day you'll find them if you don't disappear up your own ass with this bullshit.
As my bestie said, make sure you stay in the drivers seat. Yup, I know. Adjusting to this current dating scene and threw my thoughts out into the reddit universe. No BS intended. Food for thought as I explore dating in my new upcoming chapter. Younger me was more judgmental. Older me is open and enjoying having more fun in life. Already learning lots from current AG LD and will decide when will end that. Works wonderfully now but not long term.
This is by far my biggest peeve. I constantly see dudes in the man subs complaining about not being able to open up emotionally with their partner. I suggest they find a better partner because none of the women in my circles are like that. They tell me no. Lol 🤷🏽♂️
Yall get dates or fwbs?
Intentional vs casual has alot to do with how attracted you are to the person. Cold hard truth sorry.
Appreciating everyone’s honestly. Now I understand what the invitation to dinner was about because I seemed cute and fun and the inquiries about my love languages, 5 year goals, etc. It’s almost like an interview these days during dates 1-2.
I briefly read your other posts and noticed you were married for 24 years. I'm going to assume that means the youngest you could be is 42 years old, and that you last dated in your early 20s at the latest.
When you are young, you can take that kind of wandering-around-about-intentions-without-labeling-it without much problem, since you have time to figure that stuff out. That's probably what you did before you got married.
When people are, say, past the age of 30, they don't have time for that anymore. Dating past the age of 30 kinda sucks. People feel like the time they have is running out and they don't want to waste it on relationships that are going to go nowhere, so they tend to be very up front about what they want. They don't have the time to indulge your desire to explore everything slowly, because they're trying to get pregnant and raise kids before they're too old to do that. Or, not do that and do whatever it is they want. They want to know what you want. Make it easy for everyone and know what you want.
Definitely got an education from these responses. Since everyone else has defined their boundaries, intentions, cards dealing, I’m going to set mine. Already did the hurry up have kids while you can. Now, I’m back to leisurely single person pace in life. World seems a bit hyper but that’s ok.
I thank my lucky stars that my journey with dating stopped in 2010. Because dating and social media, especially the last decade has completely fractured. The human element that most of us older people were accustomed to before dating apps and social media. It really is a completely different world out there now.
Women have ample choice with men, men either see marriage as a negative, or are in the process of building up their finances to even be dateable, or they’re dealing with crippling mental health issues.
One portion has a lot more going for it than the other portion.
This is why I think it looks completely different between men and women
It’s a tough world. Hopefully our kids get through this to achieve their successful, happy life which is all we as parents want for them.
yes a good person is friends first
That’s really the exception not the rule.
For whatever reason I saw this on my homepage and thought it was carbon dating intentially vs cassually.
Nope 😂
In your age group most men that are dating are dating casually anyway.
What is your grey area? What are you trying to do?
My advice here is to get a hobby or two and learn to enjoy being single.
We’ve been conditioned to assume the worst. Long term, open to short is simply seen as short term and otherwise not believable.
👍🏼
I like the thought of friends evolving into relationships. But the fact is, that seems like such a pipe dream.
I think i occupy a grey zone, though. I'm open to all kinds of situations, from serious, long-term relationships to one-night stands, and basically anything in between. I don't have any preconceived expectations at all. And I mean, I'm a pretty new divorced single dad, so i don't have as much time to date nowadays. I'm neither intentional nor casual. I'm probably a dating enigma.
It's more important for me to have an intellectual connection with a woman, anyway. It's something that I deeply desire.
My intentions have occasionally been misconstrued as desperation or settling, but that is not the case at all. I really am open to just about anything, but it truly is about the person I'm connecting with. Even going on a single date is an opportunity for me.
Wasn’t a pipe dream in former decades. Appreciate your sharing your thoughts. Good to know that there’re other dating enigmas with no preconceived expectations and focused on connecting with the person. Exactly, the intellectual not just physical connection is essential. Emotional openness is more challenging to find these days. Good luck on your single dad journey. Your kids are the most important priority as your time and impact to help them achieve their best lives passes way too quickly. Think these days the different life stages doesn’t even make as much of a difference. It’s truly about who you connect with. Best of luck to you!
The grey zone you are describing requires more commitment than most people are willing to make.
Before cell phones, everyone had time to be social, because it was necessary to achieve anything. You could get to know someone over time much easier that way.
It is now possible to survive in relative isolation, so there has to be conscious effort put forth to spend time together in order to create the kind of “grey zone” you are describing.
Most men aren’t willing to do that because men are losing interest in marriage in dramatically increasing numbers. This is happening for a lot of reasons, most of which women either don’t want to hear or aren’t wiling to acknowledge.
Hence, relationships are now more focused on the transactional aspect instead of the social aspect.
Moving beyond this is going to require men and women to have some very challenging conversations about the future of our society.
Given the opportunities for women to be single moms and still successful in their careers, I wouldn’t necessarily opt to get married these days. It would have to be a true lifelong partner and friend match. Can completely understand the declining interest given the cost of raising kids, if dating and marriage is viewed as a transactional arrangement. Romance has been increasingly replace by cold hard truth of life. Everyone has their eyes open.
Given what you said in this response, you’re going to eliminate about 80-90% of the men that would be willing to invest time in building a relationship and seeing where it goes.
Since I’ve already raised kids and invested wisely to establish my financial security and retirement, I’m not desperate for a relationship.
It’s a two way street. Based on what I’m learning about perspective on the current dating environment, I’m completely content living my life. If the universe sets me up with someone wonderful, I’m game. Without looking, already meeting intelligent, accomplished, active guys with thoughtful life goals who I can tell are interested based on their attentiveness. Realizing that I need to figure out my intentions and goals to stay in the drivers seat.
Young me hoped for romance and believed in Prince Charming from watching Disney movies before they had strong women characters represented. Older wiser me has become less naive but still is open to a partnership to travel the world and grow old with.
Dating is expensive, time-consuming, and frequently unpleasant. Why would I want to do that casually? I'm in it for a life partner, not for scintillating discussions about what I do for the fortieth time.
Dating is clearly different these days. Used to always be fun times in college and shortly thereafter. Sounds rather draining now. The gal should equally put in the energy making arrangements and paying too you know. Don’t sell yourself short. Life partner’s a solid goal. Good luck and hopefully you don’t have to keep repeating yourself too much more if that’s the stage in life you’re ready for.
There is pressure to define what you’re looking for because a lot of people have had their time wasted and they don’t get that time back. I’ve seen some nasty breakups for both genders that came from “situationships”. The easiest way to avoid that is by being up front about what you’re looking for. No one wants to sink time, money, emotion and energy into a dead end relationship.
True you never get back time. I enjoy my present time and never feel like it’s wasted. But fair enough about defining. For me, it’s a new life chapter. Figuring out who I have evolved into and where I’m going. Exploring and discovering what I’ll eventually define what I’m looking for. I’m upfront about it. But will definitely speed up figuring out my intentions, goals and the cards I choose to deal.
No desire for casual dating for me. One side always gets more attached and ultimately hurt in the end.
It’s challenging. Mutual communication is a must for sure to stay on the same page.
The “grey zone” you describe is just called “dating.”
No matter what, you have to do the “grey zone” to know if it’s going to work.
The label “intentionally dating” works almost like a warning label, lol. It’s saying “If we won’t make long term partners, I don’t want to spent a lot of time just having fun.”
As one example, I started dating intentionally vs casually when I realized I wanted a life partner type dynamic, and a series of GFs was no longer satisfying.
After a divorce I spent years dating, having fun, meeting lots of people, no worries. None of us assumed it would lead to a life long partnership. Personally that meant I was open to dating people who I wouldn’t likely want to live with, co-parent kids with, go into a retirement with, etc. I wasn’t dating casually (since I enjoyed getting to know someone for months or more), but I also wasn’t ruling out anyone because they wouldn’t be a good “partner” for me. I was looking for good “date/physical chemistry/travel partner/fun/+1” traits.
That changed, and I started to get intentional and more selective. I started to ask real long term compatibility questions before spending months having fun. Intentionally.
Appreciate the thoughtful reflection of your comments. Especially the warning label plus the not ruling out examples. Makes me realize that post divorce I’ll likely date to just have fun and explore. Certainly not seeking a life partner since newly being set free to fly. Down the road will likely go a similar route and date more intentional when I know exactly what I want and would be willing to compromise for. The younger me was judgmental. The older me is more open. exploring but needs to figure out my current boundaries and goals. Can tell you’re emotionally mature and reflective so will be a wonderful partner for someone.
Honestly I think romance has gotten very commercialized. When everyone complains about how dating sucks it is because 1) The Internet 2) Social Media.
Yes people used to meet in real life and you’d have to look at the pool of candidates from who you meet. And you can still do that but you have to ignore the temptation of online dating. Go and meet people, ask people you know who love you and are in stable relationships to set you up.
But because of the internet & social media what used to be you looking in your immediate community social circles became a more global market. You weren’t just looking and competing with the people you met and had to connect with in IRL, now you had to compete with people online. You have to compete with ideologies, vices, etc.
The problem with online is you very rarely have a sincere reflection of the person you’re dealing with. Behind the curtain everything can be faked and curated online, where as in real life you have to put more effort in. In a lot of ways online is a fantasy world.
And out of it I noticed men and women generally got worse. I tend to say that men and women both got more lizard brained / cavepeople like.
As for me I date casually because I am incredibly selective with the women I date and give my attention to.
Sad but true commentary. Maybe moreso the US? Not sure if it’s better in Italy, Brazil or France? Decades ago I recall extremely romantic gestures and letters from work trips there. Yeah, no one writes letters anymore😢
I’m finding that pursuing my active interests, I’m meeting some incredible guys. Not in full dating mode yet as moreso into the divorce process. But your perspective and advice is solid and I appreciate your taking the time to express it. Think I’ve zero interest in online ever. Not trying to compete. Just be me and meet others being themselves authentically.
Scared if it’s ‘lizard brains and cave people’ like out there for my kids. They’re astute and intelligent. Hope it works out for them. I think raising kids will always be the best thing in my life. From the day they were born, always knew I’d do anything to protect and help them achieve their dreams and goals.
Kudos to you for being incredibly selective on who you give your attention to. That’s how it should be however the relationship is defined.
I date intentionally bc I want to be with someone for a long ass time for me casually is for friends and I don't need sex or a man to feel that casual love that's what my friends are for
Good for you! May your future fabulous long ass relationship be all you wish for. Healthy mindset and wonderful close friendships you’ve fostered. My friends in college never understood the mindset of not needing a guy. Felt that until I wanted to raise a family. Now I realize there’s so many options like sperm banks, freezing eggs, adoption etc if you don’t meet the one. Wasn’t a thing much in my days.
Once additional. kids were out of the question so was marriage. Its amazing how much higher standards women hold themselves to when you can pull the plug at any point for their actions.
Sounds like some tough experiences for you. Stay strong and optimistic.
I date casually,but intention is my ultimate goal
Awesome goal. Hope it works out for you!
When single, I dated casually. 9 out of 10 women I go on dates with will be vapid wastes of time that I end up fucking and never seeing again. If the woman matches well with me and it leads to more, I am open to it.
Not great stats from the female perspective. My dates have all developed into relationships. Can’t imagine ONS.
Every woman I've had a ons says that nonsense. Always "I never do this".
My girlfriend and I did just this. She's 42 and I'm 46, we met 5 years ago on a dating app, both of us single since divorce about a year before (we met at the end of the pandemic). We started off as casual, but open to whatever. Why put structured constraints on things like feelings, which don't work that way? After a couple weeks to a month we both confessed we were falling for each other, and it's been pretty awesome ever since. But it's a little different, we're older, more experienced, and knew what we wanted. Love and relationships seem to be one of those things everyone learns about the hard way.
Aww congrats! Exactly. Agree with what you said about structured constraints. I’m older but still learning about relationships for sure.
What you shared is so true in our society. My college age kids have vastly different personalities. My son is focused on making wealth, has a besties group since grade school so nurtures wonderful lifetime relationships, knows his priorities hasn’t been on dating but still went to Prom, etc. I think my daughter struggles more in this environment. For me, yoga reminds me to be fully present in the moment and the growth in becoming as life evolves.